Ouru omits Jaramogi and Raila from 1st and 2nd liberation

[RV Pundit]

Precisely. The whole idea is Luo entitlement; their long desire to control the national narrative; and to make themselves victims of some sort whom kenyans owe some debt...while on reality they've done nothing that much praiseworthy - never fought - never died - in such large numbers like say Kikuyus or the Nandis. The Nandis were murdered in great numbers, their cattle confisticated, their house set on fire and their land taken away...way back before the first hero. Nandi honoured Koitalel in Nandi Hills through the museum and university. Kikuyu MauMau and its people suffered even worse atrocities. What have Luo really survived...few guys shot on the street.

Peace, love, and unity.

 

[RV Pundit]

Your hero is not my hero. It the reason why your hero is not POrk and why Uhuruto indicted by Icc are pork. People in rv see WSr as hero. Kikuyu see uhuru as a hero. Western world tried to say they were indicted for serious crimes...but people said they were heros...the same way Arafat is hero for palestinian...and terrorist in Isreal.. Who get to decide. Keep your heros..and we keep our heros. We can honour them at county level. If it goes national...then we need some objective process..where people can raise objections...and some commission can decide who a hero is or not. Obviously I doubt Raila is going to be hero in central kenya.

It is quite consistent. Some heroes attempted to fight corruption with Waiguru as a state witness.

[MOON Ki]

Precisely. The whole idea is Luo entitlement; they long desire to control the national narrative; and to make themselves victims of some sort whom kenyans owe some debt...while on reality they've done nothing that much praiseworthy - never fought - never died - in such large numbers like say Kikuyus or the Nandis.

Peace, love, and unity.

 

History. Basic reading and awareness of.   Plus objective understanding.

Google: "Kenya, second liberation". Peace, love, and unity.

Kula nyama.

[GeeMail]

Saba Saba demonstration on July 7, 1990. From Left: Gitobu Imanyara, James Orengo, Raila Odinga and Charles Rubia.

[RV Pundit]

How many Luos died in second liberation. Can you compare to what Brits did to Nandis and talais. Where they not only killed thousands ( I think Nandis were 40,000 in 1900s and brits probably killed 1/4), burnt fields and houses in nearly the whole of nandi ,fined them heavily & reduced them to poverty and eventually moved en-masses all people to reserves - and took their land. What is that to you. The zero liberation?. Or the Talais were were imprisoned in some desolate island in lake victoria. Before Raila was a hero..Koitalel brother koilegen had been in prison for 27 yrs under the colonial rule. Aren't they not heros.

Let not talk about Mau Mau.

Luos have done very very little and sufferred very little. There is no coincidence that PORK of kenya has been with Kikuyu and Kalenjin. They suffered the most - in the most fundamental ways.

Before you google second liberation nonsense...read about Nandi resistance. That is more serious history. Second liberation from MOi who is still out there as free and respected man

History. Objective understanding.

GooglKenya, second liberation".

[MOON Ki]

How many Luos died in second liberation.

What was the Second Liberation?

[RV Pundit]

A blip in the radar of kenya history -which Uhuru and future kenyan leaders will ignore.Definitely ruto will not even bother to mention it. Simple fight for multi-party democracy and more freedoms. Nothing as fundamental say as Mau Mau land rights war or Nandi resistance to British rule.

Can we already have third liberation...IEBC teargas demo?

What was the Second Liberation?

[MOON Ki]

A blip in the radar of kenya history -which Uhuru and future kenyan leaders will ignore.Definitely ruto will not even bother to mention it. Simple fight for multi-party democracy and more freedoms. Nothing as fundamental say as Mau Mau land right or Nandi resistance to British rule.

What was the Second Liberation?

Just answer the question.   Then we can go back to why Jogoo  must and will  rule for 100 years.

[RV Pundit]

re-read my answer - if you cannot comprehend - then clearly I am not your hero for the night. I said it was a small fight for more political and personal freedoms. Small in the context of other fights. If yryou re-read history - you'll understand that 50yrs from now - people will still talk about the big fights - not the second liberation - mau mau and nandi resistance for example were no small fights.

Just answer the question.   Then we can go back to how Jogoo must rule for 100 years.

[MOON Ki]

re-read my answer - if you cannot comprehend - then clearly I am not your hero for the night. I said it was a small fight for more political and personal freedoms. Small in the context of other fights. If yryou re-read history - you'll understand that 50yrs from now - people will still talk about the big fights - not the second liberation - mau mau and nandi resistance for example were no small fights.

Just answer the question.   Then we can go back to how Jogoo must rule for 100 years.

OK, my hero. Let's kula nyama for 100 years.   Love, peace, and unity.

[Kichwa]

You can jump up and down the coffee table like a monkey all day long, but the fact that Raila and Jaramogi are "Mashujaa"  is already sealed. Stop wasting my time and your time with silly childish tribal arguments.

Yeah contemporary leaders of Moi failed on that count. Kenya was an island of peace for that reason. If Moi had slacken one bit - we would have gone Somalia or ethiopia or sudan or uganda way. There are very few countries in Africa that survived without some coup or military take over. This is now becoming less and less likely...as governance improve everywhere.

Moi is a hero for doing all he could for 24yrs to ensure we had some semblance of democratic gov. Raila to Kichwa is a hero for second -liberation from moi dictatorial rule - although we know he was responsible for failed 82 coup that led to many deaths & changed Moi presidency. Pick your hero.

Moi led the country peacefully for 24 years.   

[RV Pundit]

We will hopefully do that as we celebrate real heros like Kipchomeber Arap Koilegen who was a political detainee in 1914! When you hero Jaramogi was a not yet born...leave alone his brother Koitalel Samoei who gave the Brits all he got for 10 yrs...and stand tall amongst all kenyan hero...and I am glad uhuru mentioned him.
http://www.standardmedia.co.ke/article/2000052844/how-political-detainee-paid-the-ultimate-price/?pageNo=2

OK, my hero. Let's kula nyama for 100 years.   Love, peace, and unity.

[RV Pundit]

I see you're losing it...raila and jaramogi are not and never have been my heros. I do realize they are Luos heros. Kenyan didn't trust them enough to make them Pork.

You can jump up and down the coffee table like a monkey all day long, but the fact that Raila and Jaramogi are "Mashujaa"  is already sealed. Stop wasting my time and your time with silly childish tribal arguments.

[MOON Ki]

I was doing some cleaning in my backyard this weekend.   There's this piece of wood that's been lying there for ages, and I finally decided to pick it up.     On the top it had a seemingly decent-looking but somewhat rough veneer; so I thought it might still have some use.   But when I picked it up, I found all sorts of nasty, slimy things on the underside.

This is totally irrelevant here, but I thought "what I did on the weekend" would be a nice way to change the discussion on this thread.

[RV Pundit]

Sound like a smart way to insult me. You' cannot force some of us to view your Luo hero as our heros. Just like I cannot force you to see my heros as yours. The discuscion is okay - It doesn't need changing. What need changing is your worldview. Not everybody thinks like you.

I was doing some cleaning in my backyard this weekend.   There's this piece of wood that's been lying there for ages, and I finally decided to pick it up.     On the top it had a seemingly decent-looking but somewhat rough veneer; so I thought it might still have some use.   But when I picked it up, I found all sorts of nasty, slimy things on the underside.

This is totally irrelevant here, but I thought "what I did on the weekend" would be a nice way to change the discussion on this thread.

[MOON Ki]

Sound like a smart way to insult me. You' cannot force some of us to view your Luo hero as our heros. Just like I cannot force you to see my heros as yours. The discuscion is okay - It doesn't need changing. What need changing is your worldview. Not everybody thinks like you.

I actually give you top marks for "effort"; and I'm sure all will agree that you have certainly tried very hard. True, my final grade for you is an F, but that's only because your efforts happen to be in the wrong class---Nipate.org instead of Nipate.com.   

[RV Pundit]

What make you think i give a flying rat ass how highly your rank me. Keep your scores to yourself. As long as you don't insult me - I am all okay. The last I checked you found me here after lingering at nipate.com.

Keep the debate here about HEROS. The rest of your nonsense you don't need to bring here. You can create a thread or forum to rank me.

I actually give you top marks for "effort"; and I'm sure all will agree that you have certainly tried very hard. True, my final grade for you is an F, but that's only because your efforts happen to be in the wrong class---Nipate.org instead of Nipate.com.   
[/quote

[MOON Ki]

What make you think i give a flying rat about how highly your rank me. Keep your scores to yourself. As long as you don't insult me - I am all okay. The last I checked you found me here after lingering at nipate.com.

Keep the debate here about HEROS. The rest of your nonsense you don't need to bring here. You can create a thread or forum to rank me.

No need to get so agitated.   I'm actually trying to tell you something you might find "positive" and "helpful"---that in the right sort of forum you would be a great success with what you are working on ... a genuine hero!  I just don't think you'll have much luck here.   

[RV Pundit]

More nonsense. I am not here to find luck or popularity. I am here to freely express and share my thoughts. I am NOT here to make friends. What a prick. I have been in many forums - from rcbowen for yrs to toilet.com to nipate.org - and i don't change - one bit --for nearly 14yrs now. This is about some national heroes who are supposed to be mentioned by everyone and uhuru...not me.

No need to get so agitated.   I'm actually trying to tell you something you might find "positive" and "helpful"---that in the right sort of forum you would be a great success with what you are working on ... a genuine hero!  I just don't think you'll have much luck here.   

[MOON Ki]

More nonsense. I am not here to find luck or popularity. I am here to freely express and share my thoughts. I am NOT here to make friends. What a prick. I have been in many forums - from rcbowen for yrs to toilet.com to nipate.org - and i don't change - one bit  --for nearly 14yrs now.

That's not very nice language.  Here's a book you should read:

https://www.amazon.com/How-Win-Friends-Influence-People/dp/0671027034/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1477336044&sr=8-1&keywords=how+to+win+friends

And the point remains: what you have been working on will not fly here. You obviously thought it would, but hopefully you have now seen the light ... not too many fish jumping on that endlessly and lazily recycled bait of green, putrid slime.   "Thinking fish outwit blockhead fisherman !!!", screams the headline.   

Good effort---in 14 years of lower classes---but grade here is F; pupil should repeat last lower class: http://nipate.com/