Pundit Court Rules that Chapter Six applies to elected leaders too

[Nefertiti]

Constitution is supreme court.Declaring the county office a crime scene and the governor suspended is exceeding the constitution provision.The case is relate to a particular contractor and can be confined this far.It should be enough to warn Waitutu not to interfere with witness and evidence.If there was evidence he was interfering his bail conditions can be toughten including keeping him jail.There is nothing like suspending a governor.

He is not constitutionally suspended just restrained from interfering with witnesses and evidence. These two items are found in the county offices and staff - making it impossible to act as governor. Office documents are part of evidence so he can't go there. County staff are part of the witnesses - he can't contact them. See - he is legally the governor but practically shackled. Nyoro took over. I hope the MCA's sack him asap.

Waititu real sin is backing Ruto. I saw him on YouTube tv lamenting that succession is his true enemy. Mumbled something about lying low and keeping off 2022 maneno. Seems he could be back to his senses - Sonko can give him a few tips about the Boss and his laugh buttons.

[RV Pundit]

Robina, that is nonsense.The case relates to what happened.Not what will happen.DPP has his evidence and witnesses.Only we need to worry about is securing the evidence and the witnesses.The politics of it you'll are newbie.Lets focus on this case without even thinking of the politics..I don't think Mumbi whose is a decent lady thought of it.Dont mix this issue.This not a live case.Waitutu already got his cut.Ruto not responsible for his stupidity.He asked a contractor to geniusly deposit money in his wife n kid account.Meanwhile Ruto was doing PhD in science and probably MSc in money laundering.

[vooke]

Constitution is supreme.Declaring the county office a crime scene and the governor suspended is exceeding the constitution provision.The case relate to a particular contractor and can be confined to that.i.Anything else we call it  scope creep in computing.It should be enough to warn Waitutu not to interfere with witness and evidence.If there was evidence he was interfering his bail conditions can be toughten including keeping him jail.There is nothing like suspending a governor.I have no sympathy for Waitutu...he is a thug..but I am afraid what kind of precedent this set against good but independent minded governors who can now be intimidated by DPP and Courts.

There are good reasons ONLY the president ,of all elected officials, is immune from prosecution. The rest are game and Mumbi will not have some elected thugs(MP) buy immunity vide a mischievous ASECA section.

I asked you before, what's the point of that particular section? What's so special about elected goons that they can't step aside?

[Nefertiti]

Robina, that is nonsense.The case relates to what happened.Not what will happen.DPP has his evidence and witnesses.Only we need to worry about is securing the evidence and the witnesses.The politics of it you'll are newbie.Lets focus on this case without even thinking of the politics..I don't think Mumbi whose is a decent lady thought of it.Dont mix this issue.This not a live case.Waitutu already got his cut.Ruto not responsible for his stupidity.He asked a contractor to geniusly deposit money in his wife n kid account.Meanwhile Ruto was doing PhD in science and probably MSc in money laundering.

That's ok let's be ostrich. No, we are not newbies in the politics of it whatever that means. Let's see what the higher courts think.

[RV Pundit]

Vooke,if elections are held today, will Waitutu be eligible.Yes.Then he will  suspended.An oxymoron if you had 3 brain cells still functional.I think Waitutu was elected with more than one active criminal case so was sonko whom I voted for.You cannot suspend a governor or Mp or pork coz of criminal case.The constitution recommend an impeachment or a recall as recourse..political processes.Waitutu has case and should be impeached.The threshold is lower there.If kiambu residents don't want Waitutu..they can impeach him with simple majority of MCA's and no need of criminal culpability.its enough that DPP has opened charges.Are you just stupid or just very stupid.For a magistrate or judge to overturn the decision of 1m mostly educated and informed  kiambu residents is slippery slope that will one day lead to military private suspending our useless constitution.Constitution ought to be sacrosanct without any innovation or trickery.As long as governor has not exhausted all avenues of appeals or reviews..he remain governor..not a suspended governor.

[Nefertiti]

The strict bail conditions would still apply notwithstanding Waititu's eligibility. Uhuruto had to keep off witnesses and threats during the trial. That aside I hope the bad precedent of 2012 is overturned soon by SCORK or a constitutional bench. Serious crime suspects should be disqualified from running for any public office in Kenya.

[RV Pundit]

The strict bail conditions would still apply notwithstanding Waititu's eligibility. Uhuruto had to keep off witnesses and threats during the trial. That aside I hope the bad precedent of 2012 is overturned soon by SCORK or a constitutional bench. Serious crime suspects should be disqualified from running for any public office in Kenya.

Because you don't trust the wisdom of voters.For example, kiambu is one of greatest counties but the people there want a Waitutu.Learn to respect people and democracy.If democracy fails armed watiutu takes over aka military with overwhelming majority... nobody put a gun on Nairobi or Kiambu ..but they elected their beloved thugs Respect that Respect US of A decision to elect Obama ad and Trump.

[RV Pundit]

Bottom line there is no shortcut to high integrity leadership.. people have to try Waitutus..and learn.. slowly over time

[vooke]

Vooke,if elections are held today, will Waitutu be eligible.Yes.Then he will  suspended.An oxymoron if you had 3 brain cells still functional.I think Waitutu was elected with more than one active criminal case so was sonko whom I voted for.You cannot suspend a governor or Mp or pork coz of criminal case.The constitution recommend an impeachment or a recall as recourse..political processes.Waitutu has case and should be impeached.The threshold is lower there.If kiambu residents don't want Waitutu..they can impeach him with simple majority of MCA's and no need of criminal culpability.its enough that DPP has opened charges.Are you just stupid or just very stupid.For a magistrate or judge to overturn the decision of 1m mostly educated and informed  kiambu residents is slippery slope that will one day lead to military private suspending our useless constitution.Constitution ought to be sacrosanct without any innovation or trickery.As long as governor has not exhausted all avenues of appeals or reviews..he remain governor..not a suspended governor.

A suspended governor is still a governor. It is not for courts to remove him.  That's for Kiambu electorate and their representatives. Why do you keep on missing an obviously simple point?

If you wish to commit crimes, make sure they are very far from your office.

Katiba is supreme but it is not moronic like you. Kiambu may elect anyone and anything, but they have no constitutional right to squander County revenue directly or through their elected representatives.

[RV Pundit]

Reminder: Waitutu is more innocent than you. He is presumed very very innocent until proven guilty. You know the record DPP office have had previously in securing conviction.

There is a reason why any sane kenyan would oppose this. A governor is no small job. He cannot be suspended - unless the constitution provide for such suspension. It need to be protected from the presidency who basically now owns the DPP.

What now stop DPP from pressing fake charges immediately a governor is elected - and then dragging the case for 4 yrs - rendering the decision of millions null and void.

There is a clear separation of powers btw judiciary,parliament(including MCAS), executive (pork, gov) that need protection. This is the most direct assault of devolution so far.That you can unconstitutional remove the governor from office...by calling it a suspension.

A suspended governor is still a governor. It is not for courts to remove him.  That's for Kiambu electorate and their representatives. Why do you keep on missing an obviously simple point?

If you wish to commit crimes, make sure they are very far from your office.

Katiba is supreme but it is not moronic like you. Kiambu may elect anyone and anything, but they have no constitutional right to squander County revenue directly or through their elected representatives.

[vooke]

Reminder: Waitutu is more innocent than you. He is presumed very very innocent until proven guilty. You know the record DPP office have had previously in securing conviction.

There is a reason why any sane kenyan would oppose this. A governor is no small job. He cannot be suspended - unless the constitution provide for such suspension. It need to be protected from the presidency who basically now owns the DPP.

What now stop DPP from pressing fake charges immediately a governor is elected - and then dragging the case for 4 yrs - rendering the decision of millions null and void.

There is a clear separation of powers btw judiciary,parliament(including MCAS), executive (pork, gov) that need protection. This is the most direct assault of devolution so far.That you can unconstitutional remove the governor from office...by calling it a suspension.

A suspended governor is still a governor. It is not for courts to remove him.  That's for Kiambu electorate and their representatives. Why do you keep on missing an obviously simple point?

If you wish to commit crimes, make sure they are very far from your office.

Katiba is supreme but it is not moronic like you. Kiambu may elect anyone and anything, but they have no constitutional right to squander County revenue directly or through their elected representatives.

Nobody said he is guilty. This will only be determined at the determination of this. Again, this is not the point.

And since you are firmly into scenario Analysis, what if a governor loots his county dry and stashes everything abroad, and bribes DPP to drag the case forever so he keeps looting each financial year ? His case drags for 6 years so much that he uses stolen loot to successfully retain his seat ,upon which he loots some more and buys everyone for a good ten years?

MCAs would impeach him? Well, he buys them as well.

[RV Pundit]

Katiba provide for impeachment of such a governor. If MCAS are bought - the Judge can also be bought. You have to understand the principles behind modern gov and democracy. The clear seperation and power of Judiciary, Parliament, National and Devolved Gov. There is a reason why a sonko is a governor despite several cases and his not so perfect persona. It's call democracy.

There is nothing like suspending a gov or mp or president. It doesn't exist in law. The magistrate should restrict himself to the scope of the case...the witnesses therein, the evidence there in and etc.

Judiciary cannot do MCA or Kiambu residence job. It should restrict itself to the specific criminal case of Waitutu and the contractor. The witnesses need to be protected and the evidence secured (which really ought to have been by now).

How do we protect the witnesses and evidence while Waitutu to get back to work? We have witness protection Unit. Let them be housed in safe houses and paid. If Waitutu tries to interfere...with witnesses or evidence....Magistrate can enforce specific sanctions...including even locking him up. But we cannot say - don't to go the office - because it's a crime scene.

Nobody said he is guilty. This will only be determined at the determination of this. Again, this is not the point.

And since you are firmly into scenario Analysis, what if a governor loots his county dry and stashes everything abroad, and bribes DPP to drag the case forever so he keeps looting each financial year ? His case drags for 6 years so much that he uses stolen loot to successfully retain his seat ,upon which he loots some more and buys everyone for a good ten years?

MCAs would impeach him? Well, he buys them as well.

[Nefertiti]

We want corruption fought and won...but we cannot allow suspension of someone elected by 1m to be suspended by some magistrate or some DPP to rush cases so governor can step aside.MCA can impeach Waitutu with even lower threshold. If Ruto became pork now...say Uhuru dies...will you be happy if the shoe was on the other foot.

Yes in fact I would - fighting corruption is welcome from all quarters - like really . These people are merely on trial - with busloads of lawyers - not detained. Poor Wanjiku is lucky to have a vengeful Uhuru in her corner. However my key reason for opposing Ruto is his wanton unscrupulousness so perish the thought. I do reiterate you have Stockholm syndrome - this is not even blind loyalty - 50+% tax then you side with thieves?

Elected officials can never equal to appointed.never.here.or even in the us.That is why Trump is potus

Trump is not on trial - has immunity - so your question is moot. Even so, Mueller's is a quasi-judicial inquiry - not a trial - appointed by the DoJ. It is the equivalent of Kenyan DPP appointing someone to probe and issue a report on a case - which could be used to file charges. Courts and judges try people - not prosecutors. Alas, Trump was exonerated.

Elected officials can never equal to appointed.never.here.or even in the us.

If we had impeachments of Ojaamongs for graft - or some modicum of honesty by MPs and MCAs - I would agree with you. But what happens instead? - the governors bribe the senators to cover them - so yes the DPP and the courts are 100% right to effectively suspend them. It is why we have 3 co-equal arms of government - to check and balance each other - including where the oversight is mired in graft, incompetence and/or misplaced loyalties. That is the spirit of the Katiba 2010.

[Nefertiti]

Because you don't trust the wisdom of voters.For example, kiambu is one of greatest counties but the people there want a Waitutu.Learn to respect people and democracy.If democracy fails armed watiutu takes over aka military with overwhelming majority... nobody put a gun on Nairobi or Kiambu ..but they elected their beloved thugs Respect that Respect US of A decision to elect Obama ad and Trump.

Those same people voted democratically and overwhelmingly for Katiba with independent judiciary. It is merely your personal conjecture what Kiambu people want. They voted independent courts and Mumbis in 2010 - 2017 they voted Waititu. Both must do their job. Checks and balances - donge? - there is nothing superior about elected officials.

[Nefertiti]

Pundit kweli. That very Katiba you are touting declares courts as the final abitor of the law - let us see what they say. So far they disagree with you. I can bet you SCORK will side with Mugambi and Mumbi.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Because you don't trust the wisdom of voters.For example, kiambu is one of greatest counties but the people there want a Waitutu.Learn to respect people and democracy.If democracy fails armed watiutu takes over aka military with overwhelming majority... nobody put a gun on Nairobi or Kiambu ..but they elected their beloved thugs Respect that Respect US of A decision to elect Obama ad and Trump.

Those same people voted democratically and overwhelmingly for Katiba with independent judiciary. It is merely your personal conjecture what Kiambu people want. They voted independent courts and Mumbis in 2010 - 2017 they voted Waititu. Both must do their job. Checks and balances - donge? - there is nothing superior about elected officials.

Even the court rulings aside, Chapter Six was included in the constitution to prevent corrupt people from ascending to power.  One could probably argue whether it was a good idea.  But there is no question why it was included.  Parliament then added laws that effectively rendered it little more than a suggestion.  This is a horse beaten to death, resurrected and killed again ad nauseum. 

[RV Pundit]

Chapter six applies mostly to appointed officials.it requires them to be  apolitical and of highest integrity.Chapter seven on executive contradict or override or overload chapter six on certain position.Waitutu therefore is save...he was elected while facing criminal trial and cannot be suspended for the same .SCORK already made a rulling on this in Marina kiai versus Uhuruto eligibility in 2017.

[vooke]

Chapter six applies mostly to appointed officials.it requires them to be  apolitical and of highest integrity.Chapter seven on executive contradict or override or overload chapter six on certain position.Waitutu therefore is save...he was elected while facing criminal trial and cannot be suspended for the same .SCORK already made a rulling on this in Marina kiai versus Uhuruto eligibility in 2017.

You can't be suspended for the same things you were elected while facing but this is not the case.The subject here is graft under his watch which he oversaw.

Uhuru is immune from both the things he was facing before election and after elections. In fact, there can't be criminal trial with Uhuru on it.  That's just Uhuru or whoever will be president.

Wish as you want but this executive immunity is strictly for the president.

[Nefertiti]

Chapter six applies mostly to appointed officials.it requires them to be  apolitical and of highest integrity.Chapter seven on executive contradict or override or overload chapter six on certain position.Waitutu therefore is save...he was elected while facing criminal trial and cannot be suspended for the same .SCORK already made a rulling on this in Marina kiai versus Uhuruto eligibility in 2017.

You can't be suspended for the same things you were elected while facing but this is not the case.The subject here is graft under his watch which he oversaw.

Uhuru is immune from both the things he was facing before election and after elections. In fact, there can't be criminal trial with Uhuru on it.  That's just Uhuru or whoever will be president.

Wish as you want but this executive immunity is strictly for the president.

Pundit is punching a wall. Unlike economics the law has a near universal final abitor called the courts. Two competent courts have ruled to shackle the subject - he is hanging on the future rulings. The only thing I expect from Appeals and SCORK is to vacate 2012 ICC, strike out the EACA mischief, and formalize the Mumbi Ngugi suspension. Babu Yao needs to switch off zombie mode before he puts his fellow thugs in hot soup. Asking the courts if corrupt electees are special - while Maraga is on the spot as weakest link in the graft war.

[RV Pundit]

3 bench high court, 5 bench court of appeals and supreme court should settle this.... we patriots who love this county hope wisdom will prevail