African governments are overreacting to Covid-19 Pandemic

[vooke]

1,749 as of 7th April 2020

As at today, the total number of confirmed #COVID19 cases is 1749. There is also another death, bringing the total to 13 deaths. It was a male who had stage 4 prostrate cancer at Parklands Hospital. We convey our condolences to the family of the deceased

— Zweli Mkhize (@DrZweliMkhize) April 7, 2020

?s=21

1,686 positive out of 58,100 tests as of 6th April 2020

As at today, the total number of confirmed #COVID19 cases is 1686. This is an increase of 31 from the previously reported cases. pic.twitter.com/W5HjCdMB3x

— Zweli Mkhize (@DrZweliMkhize) April 6, 2020

?s=21


56,900 had been tested as of 5th April 2020 and total cases were 1,655

There are now 1655 positive cases of #Covid19SA #CoronavirusInSA. This is an increase of 70 cases since the previous report. pic.twitter.com/WAnHqBttkY

— Zweli Mkhize (@DrZweliMkhize) April 5, 2020

?s=21



So between 5th and 6th they tested 1,200 and had 31 cases. They never gave the number of tests as of 7th April but the numbers grew by 63.

South Africa is testing thousands per day while Kenya is doubt about 300 per day. From the latest briefing dated April 8,2020, out of the 300 only 7 turned positive. They intend to do more testing, and with this they expect higher daily figures of new cases.

We will get many more cases no doubt but nowhere near EU/America trajectory.

Our eyes should be on South Africa as opposed to Spain or US.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

In this tweet there is 0 social distancing.  Zero.  Masks notwithstanding. 

A suspected covid 19 patient being picked by @MOH_Kenya at the Sana Sana Estate, South B. #17mps #SingleLadiesChallenge #RealRuto #UnMaskingMosesKuria #lockdown pic.twitter.com/BeCHBFwVda

— Otieno 🇹🇿🇺🇬🇰🇪 (@HonBenard) April 8, 2020

I have seen others where lockdown is being enforced by askaris with crowds of people literally being squeezed together.  Which makes the case for the thing not being a big doozy in the tropics more compelling.

[vooke]

In this tweet there is 0 social distancing.  Zero.  Masks notwithstanding. 

A suspected covid 19 patient being picked by @MOH_Kenya at the Sana Sana Estate, South B. #17mps #SingleLadiesChallenge #RealRuto #UnMaskingMosesKuria #lockdown pic.twitter.com/BeCHBFwVda

— Otieno 🇹🇿🇺🇬🇰🇪 (@HonBenard) April 8, 2020

I have seen others where lockdown is being enforced by askaris with crowds of people literally being squeezed together.  Which makes the case for the thing not being a big doozy in the tropics more compelling.

You’ve not even seen the mad scramble for matatus towards 1900H. I witnessed it last Friday. There’s lot of casualness. I bought my first mask yesterday and this only after supermarkets made them mandatory. Then we have an outbreak of substandard sanitizers everywhere. Some are clearly all glycerine and no alcohol. I have been using surgical spirit in my ride for over 5 years for cleaning fruits,that’s what I’m using.

There’s something with negroes and Covid-19.

Here’s another bit of news.

Of all the 179 cases in Kenya, only one WAS in ICU and he came out. 178 are only mildly sick. I heard some claiming there are different variants of the virus and what we have her is the ‘milder’ version. I can’t understand how we imported it and not the meaner cousin

[GeeMail]

Any data to do with this Coronavirus is suspect. Very suspect.
Even New York Times is now asking "where are those heart attacks that used to kill people before Coronavirus?"

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/06/well/live/coronavirus-doctors-hospitals-emergency-care-heart-attack-stroke.html#click=https://t.co/HOX2Tc5PWt

Hospitals are eerily quite ad they wait for Coronavirus victims! But of course in the US a new scam has also emerged where cases /deaths are fraudulently reported as being because of Covid-19 because Federal Government is dishing out funds plus it doesn't matter whether you are insured or not.

And then this with CDC directive. Quite unscientific way of registering deaths!

https://www.westernjournal.com/cdc-tells-hospitals-list-covid-cause-death-even-just-assuming-contributed/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

Could go on. And on...

Corona is the new climate change.

[vooke]

96 cases out of 5,700 tests,and a total of 18 deaths

It’s either they are testing the wrong people or Covid-19 lost its mojo upon landfall in iFrica

As at today the number of confirmed #COVID19 cases are 1845 pic.twitter.com/ZMenLDs8o2

— Zweli Mkhize (@DrZweliMkhize) April 8, 2020

?s=21

[Garliv]

Doubt Western Journal then consider this: https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2020/04/08/dr_birx_unlike_some_countries_if_someone_dies_with_covid-19_we_are_counting_that_as_a_covid-19_death.html

Dr. Birx herself saying as much. They make no difference whether you die WITH corvid-19 or OF Covid-19. Video is there too.


For US States incentive to hype covid-19 for federal dollars, I would provide links and tweets but.....

Any data to do with this Coronavirus is suspect. Very suspect.
Even New York Times is now asking "where are those heart attacks that used to kill people before Coronavirus?"

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/06/well/live/coronavirus-doctors-hospitals-emergency-care-heart-attack-stroke.html#click=https://t.co/HOX2Tc5PWt

Hospitals are eerily quite ad they wait for Coronavirus victims! But of course in the US a new scam has also emerged where cases /deaths are fraudulently reported as being because of Covid-19 because Federal Government is dishing out funds plus it doesn't matter whether you are insured or not.

The bold is just straight conspiracy theory.  Suppose it's true, what's the purpose of the government dishing out funds?  Do they just send a cash in a brown envelope to whoever reports a fake covid-19 death?  I can't imagine it working that way even in a banana republic.

From the story.

Some of the excess capacity is indeed by design. We canceled elective procedures, though many of those patients never needed hospitalization. We are now providing care at home through telemedicine, but those services are for stable outpatients, not for those who are acutely ill.

Some patients, who would ordinarily be admitted are not being admitted.  That is an uncontroversial fact, because hospitals are being prepped for covid-19.  I agree, there could be something to be said for how this might impact overal mortality separate from covid-19 deaths, I just don't know what.

And then this with CDC directive. Quite unscientific way of registering deaths!

https://www.westernjournal.com/cdc-tells-hospitals-list-covid-cause-death-even-just-assuming-contributed/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

Could go on. And on...

Western Journal...mhhhh.

[KenyanPlato]

Black people me being one of them are vichwa Ngumus.
I went to meet a business partner in a ghettoish town in PA last week
I observed guys at the local Bodegas still talking 2 inches apart and several of them entering this stores without keeping distance

The corner kids were will selling Dope and shooting shit while huddled together

If you look at the underworld markets, blacks are still operating like there is no quarantine

Most of these the folks I saw at the Bodegas were old retired men. The elders, the civic leaders and the voice of reason. They are the sober few and I was surprised that they had not realized how
dangerous it was to do what they were doing

I still see a lot of these fools at laundry marts. Women with 6 kids in town, loitering around the laundry mart and shopping center. Going in and out of this and that store buying junk food

Poverty and ignorance is  a toxic mix

For black people education doesn't make a difference. The educated are the worst conspiracy nuts or religious nuts


This board just shows a Negro is Negro whether educated or uneducated

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Museveni gives Ugandans tips on how to exercise indoors*.

*this may not be very applicable if you live in a shanty in Kawempe and similar areas

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Doubt Western Journal then consider this: https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2020/04/08/dr_birx_unlike_some_countries_if_someone_dies_with_covid-19_we_are_counting_that_as_a_covid-19_death.html

Dr. Birx herself saying as much. They make no difference whether you die WITH corvid-19 or OF Covid-19. Video is there too.


For US States incentive to hype covid-19 for federal dollars, I would provide links and tweets but.....

Fair point.  I have also asked about that particular issue here.  I wonder what the benefit of that is.  Is it just a fog of war we are in an emergency better safe than sorry issue?  Maybe.  Still you are right that if you count everybody who dies with covid-19 as a covid-19 death, then you are going to get numbers that make covid-19 seem deadlier than it really is.  I cannot think of an acceptable situation where misleading numbers are helpful?

[vooke]

Doubt Western Journal then consider this: https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2020/04/08/dr_birx_unlike_some_countries_if_someone_dies_with_covid-19_we_are_counting_that_as_a_covid-19_death.html

Dr. Birx herself saying as much. They make no difference whether you die WITH corvid-19 or OF Covid-19. Video is there too.


For US States incentive to hype covid-19 for federal dollars, I would provide links and tweets but.....

Fair point.  I have also asked about that particular issue here.  I wonder what the benefit of that is.  Is it just a fog of war we are in an emergency better safe than sorry issue?  Maybe.  Still you are right that if you count everybody who dies with covid-19 as a covid-19 death, then you are going to get numbers that make covid-19 seem deadlier than it really is.  I cannot think of an acceptable situation where misleading numbers are helpful?

Garliv is addicted to wild irrational claims.

He is regurgitating conspiracy claims of pumping Covid-19 deaths and CDC are all in. That’s right wing garbage designed to absolve Trump of downplaying the pandemic. The more the virus ravages the US the more stupid Trump appears for downplaying it at first so it is in Trumptards’ interests to minimize its effects.

Understating  is the more likely scenario since one must have been tested positive before death and we know there is a challenge with widespread testing,and we have those dying at home as well.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Doubt Western Journal then consider this: https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2020/04/08/dr_birx_unlike_some_countries_if_someone_dies_with_covid-19_we_are_counting_that_as_a_covid-19_death.html

Dr. Birx herself saying as much. They make no difference whether you die WITH corvid-19 or OF Covid-19. Video is there too.


For US States incentive to hype covid-19 for federal dollars, I would provide links and tweets but.....

Fair point.  I have also asked about that particular issue here.  I wonder what the benefit of that is.  Is it just a fog of war we are in an emergency better safe than sorry issue?  Maybe.  Still you are right that if you count everybody who dies with covid-19 as a covid-19 death, then you are going to get numbers that make covid-19 seem deadlier than it really is.  I cannot think of an acceptable situation where misleading numbers are helpful?

Garliv is addicted to wild claims.

He is regurgitating conspiracy claims of pumping Covid-19 deaths and CDC are all in. That’s right wing garbage designed to absolve Trump of downplaying the pandemic. The more the virus ravages the US the more stupid Trump appears for downplaying it at first so it is in Trumptards’ interests to minimize its effects.

What I have read and Kagwe reported here is post mortem tests for Covid-19 are added to the positive cases

Yes yes yes he is.  But in this case he has a valid point.  Have you listened to Dr. Birx?

Here is the quote.

DR. DEBORAH BIRX: So, I think in this country we've taken a very liberal approach to mortality. And I think the reporting here has been pretty straightforward over the last five to six weeks. Prior to that when there wasn't testing in January and February that's a very different situation and unknown.

There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death. Right now we are still recording it and we will I mean the great thing about having forms that come in and a form that has the ability to market as COVID-19 infection the intent is right now that those if someone dies with COVID-19 we are counting that as a COVID-19 death.

I think that adds to the covid-19 numbers. 

Why do I think that is a problem?

Let's suppose for argument's sake that a person died of HIV/AIDS mediated causes.  And after testing his corpse he was found positive for covid-19.  Is that a covid-19 death or HIV/AIDS death?  If Dr. Birx is right, this will be recorded as a covid-19 death.

I am really clueless what the benefit of that is.

[vooke]

Doubt Western Journal then consider this: https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2020/04/08/dr_birx_unlike_some_countries_if_someone_dies_with_covid-19_we_are_counting_that_as_a_covid-19_death.html

Dr. Birx herself saying as much. They make no difference whether you die WITH corvid-19 or OF Covid-19. Video is there too.


For US States incentive to hype covid-19 for federal dollars, I would provide links and tweets but.....

Fair point.  I have also asked about that particular issue here.  I wonder what the benefit of that is.  Is it just a fog of war we are in an emergency better safe than sorry issue?  Maybe.  Still you are right that if you count everybody who dies with covid-19 as a covid-19 death, then you are going to get numbers that make covid-19 seem deadlier than it really is.  I cannot think of an acceptable situation where misleading numbers are helpful?

Garliv is addicted to wild claims.

He is regurgitating conspiracy claims of pumping Covid-19 deaths and CDC are all in. That’s right wing garbage designed to absolve Trump of downplaying the pandemic. The more the virus ravages the US the more stupid Trump appears for downplaying it at first so it is in Trumptards’ interests to minimize its effects.

What I have read and Kagwe reported here is post mortem tests for Covid-19 are added to the positive cases

Yes yes yes he is.  But in this case he has a valid point.  Have you listened to Dr. Birx?

Here is the quote.

DR. DEBORAH BIRX: So, I think in this country we've taken a very liberal approach to mortality. And I think the reporting here has been pretty straightforward over the last five to six weeks. Prior to that when there wasn't testing in January and February that's a very different situation and unknown.

There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death. Right now we are still recording it and we will I mean the great thing about having forms that come in and a form that has the ability to market as COVID-19 infection the intent is right now that those if someone dies with COVID-19 we are counting that as a COVID-19 death.

I think that adds to the covid-19 numbers. 

Why do I think that is a problem?

Let's suppose for argument's sake that a person died of HIV/AIDS mediated causes.  And after testing his corpse he was found positive for covid-19.  Is that a covid-19 death or HIV/AIDS death?  If Dr. Birx is right, this will be recorded as a covid-19 death.

I am really clueless what the benefit of that is.

Birx is being misquoted. You may listen to what she said on Wednesday here
https://www.mediaite.com/tv/cnns-acosta-asks-birx-fauci-about-commentators-suggesting-death-toll-inflated-theres-a-lot-of-misinformation-out-there/

Here is part of the transcript:

“

I think every time I’ve been up here about the comorbidities. Most of the people, and we have talked about the Italy data, the majority of the Italians who succumbed to this had three or more comorbidities. So this has been known from the beginning. So those individuals will have an underlying condition, but that underlying condition did not cause their acute death when it’s related to a covid infection. In fact, it’s the opposite. Having an underlying condition and getting this virus, we know it’s particularly damaging to those individuals.”

What she is saying is, even if you have preexisting conditions ,if Covid-19 symptoms took you to the hospital and you succumbed they record the cause as Covid-19.

Why it makes sense is simple. They virus is the only variable. Say one is battling preexisting conditions for months or years. They go down with a Covid-19,are rushed to hospital and they are no more within days. Chances are they would have lived longer without Covid-19. The virus cut short their lives directly or indirectly.

[Georgesoros]

Black people me being one of them are vichwa Ngumus.
I went to meet a business partner in a ghettoish town in PA last week
I observed guys at the local Bodegas still talking 2 inches apart and several of them entering this stores without keeping distance

The corner kids were will selling Dope and shooting shit while huddled together

If you look at the underworld markets, blacks are still operating like there is no quarantine

Most of these the folks I saw at the Bodegas were old retired men. The elders, the civic leaders and the voice of reason. They are the sober few and I was surprised that they had not realized how
dangerous it was to do what they were doing

I still see a lot of these fools at laundry marts. Women with 6 kids in town, loitering around the laundry mart and shopping center. Going in and out of this and that store buying junk food

Poverty and ignorance is  a toxic mix

For black people education doesn't make a difference. The educated are the worst conspiracy nuts or religious nuts


This board just shows a Negro is Negro whether educated or uneducated

Apparently this Virus has been here for a long time. In Iceland 50% have it but are asymptomatic.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2020/04/10/coronavirus-covid-19-small-nations-iceland-big-data/2959797001/

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Fair point.  I have also asked about that particular issue here.  I wonder what the benefit of that is.  Is it just a fog of war we are in an emergency better safe than sorry issue?  Maybe.  Still you are right that if you count everybody who dies with covid-19 as a covid-19 death, then you are going to get numbers that make covid-19 seem deadlier than it really is.  I cannot think of an acceptable situation where misleading numbers are helpful?

Garliv is addicted to wild claims.

He is regurgitating conspiracy claims of pumping Covid-19 deaths and CDC are all in. That’s right wing garbage designed to absolve Trump of downplaying the pandemic. The more the virus ravages the US the more stupid Trump appears for downplaying it at first so it is in Trumptards’ interests to minimize its effects.

What I have read and Kagwe reported here is post mortem tests for Covid-19 are added to the positive cases

Yes yes yes he is.  But in this case he has a valid point.  Have you listened to Dr. Birx?

Here is the quote.

DR. DEBORAH BIRX: So, I think in this country we've taken a very liberal approach to mortality. And I think the reporting here has been pretty straightforward over the last five to six weeks. Prior to that when there wasn't testing in January and February that's a very different situation and unknown.

There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death. Right now we are still recording it and we will I mean the great thing about having forms that come in and a form that has the ability to market as COVID-19 infection the intent is right now that those if someone dies with COVID-19 we are counting that as a COVID-19 death.

I think that adds to the covid-19 numbers. 

Why do I think that is a problem?

Let's suppose for argument's sake that a person died of HIV/AIDS mediated causes.  And after testing his corpse he was found positive for covid-19.  Is that a covid-19 death or HIV/AIDS death?  If Dr. Birx is right, this will be recorded as a covid-19 death.

I am really clueless what the benefit of that is.

Birx is being misquoted. You may listen to what she said on Wednesday here

I take it you didn't listen to the video in the link.  The quote is verbatim.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/cnns-acosta-asks-birx-fauci-about-commentators-suggesting-death-toll-inflated-theres-a-lot-of-misinformation-out-there/

Here is part of the transcript:

“

I think every time I’ve been up here about the comorbidities. Most of the people, and we have talked about the Italy data, the majority of the Italians who succumbed to this had three or more comorbidities. So this has been known from the beginning. So those individuals will have an underlying condition, but that underlying condition did not cause their acute death when[/b] it’s related to a covid infection. In fact, it’s the opposite. Having an underlying condition and getting this virus, we know it’s particularly damaging to those individuals.”

What she is saying is, even if you have preexisting conditions ,if Covid-19 symptoms took you to the hospital and you succumbed they record the cause as Covid-19.

Why it makes sense is simple. They virus is the only variable. Say one is battling preexisting conditions for months or years. They go down with a Covid-19,are rushed to hospital and they are no more within days. Chances are they would have lived longer without Covid-19. The virus cut short their lives directly or indirectly.

If you look at this later statement, it makes even more compelling, the need to capture and release more data and information.  How many were tested, what were their comorbidities, their death rates(without covid-19).  Right now, they are reporting a number that says these are how many people have positive results and these are how many died.
 
To get a covid-19 test in the US, you have to be in real distress.  In this particular case she is talking about, you are already dead.  There are going to be people in distress with symptoms similar to those being associated with covid-19.  How many of these have died without covid-19?  Without reporting on that that kind of information, putting out data like that, even if it's true, can be misleading, and yes, raise the profile covid-19.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Black people me being one of them are vichwa Ngumus.
I went to meet a business partner in a ghettoish town in PA last week
I observed guys at the local Bodegas still talking 2 inches apart and several of them entering this stores without keeping distance

The corner kids were will selling Dope and shooting shit while huddled together

If you look at the underworld markets, blacks are still operating like there is no quarantine

Most of these the folks I saw at the Bodegas were old retired men. The elders, the civic leaders and the voice of reason. They are the sober few and I was surprised that they had not realized how
dangerous it was to do what they were doing

I still see a lot of these fools at laundry marts. Women with 6 kids in town, loitering around the laundry mart and shopping center. Going in and out of this and that store buying junk food

Poverty and ignorance is  a toxic mix

For black people education doesn't make a difference. The educated are the worst conspiracy nuts or religious nuts


This board just shows a Negro is Negro whether educated or uneducated

Apparently this Virus has been here for a long time. In Iceland 50% have it but are asymptomatic.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2020/04/10/coronavirus-covid-19-small-nations-iceland-big-data/2959797001/

I understood it a little differently.  That about 50% of those who test positive in Iceland are asymptomatic.  The percentage who have it is between 0.3% and 0.8%.  Remarkably, stable or reducing.

Stefansson said Iceland's randomized tests revealed that between 0.3%-0.8% of Iceland's population is infected with the respiratory illness, that about 50% of those who test positive for the virus are asymptomatic when they are tested, and that since mid-March the frequency of the virus among Iceland's general population who are not at the greatest risk – those who do not have underlying health conditions or signs and symptoms of COVID-19 – has either stayed stable or been decreasing.

[Georgesoros]

Black people me being one of them are vichwa Ngumus.
I went to meet a business partner in a ghettoish town in PA last week
I observed guys at the local Bodegas still talking 2 inches apart and several of them entering this stores without keeping distance

The corner kids were will selling Dope and shooting shit while huddled together

If you look at the underworld markets, blacks are still operating like there is no quarantine

Most of these the folks I saw at the Bodegas were old retired men. The elders, the civic leaders and the voice of reason. They are the sober few and I was surprised that they had not realized how
dangerous it was to do what they were doing

I still see a lot of these fools at laundry marts. Women with 6 kids in town, loitering around the laundry mart and shopping center. Going in and out of this and that store buying junk food

Poverty and ignorance is  a toxic mix

For black people education doesn't make a difference. The educated are the worst conspiracy nuts or religious nuts


This board just shows a Negro is Negro whether educated or uneducated

Apparently this Virus has been here for a long time. In Iceland 50% have it but are asymptomatic.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2020/04/10/coronavirus-covid-19-small-nations-iceland-big-data/2959797001/

I understood it a little differently.  That about 50% of those who test positive in Iceland are asymptomatic.  The percentage who have it is between 0.3% and 0.8%.  Remarkably, stable or reducing.

Stefansson said Iceland's randomized tests revealed that between 0.3%-0.8% of Iceland's population is infected with the respiratory illness, that about 50% of those who test positive for the virus are asymptomatic when they are tested, and that since mid-March the frequency of the virus among Iceland's general population who are not at the greatest risk – those who do not have underlying health conditions or signs and symptoms of COVID-19 – has either stayed stable or been decreasing.

Not many live in Iceland, so a 50% of the 10% being asymptomatic is a staggering figure. These people will continue spreading it. It definitely did not spread within 4mos given the sparse population. So my conclusion we are dealing with something out of a Stephen King movie. Its been there waiting.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Black people me being one of them are vichwa Ngumus.
I went to meet a business partner in a ghettoish town in PA last week
I observed guys at the local Bodegas still talking 2 inches apart and several of them entering this stores without keeping distance

The corner kids were will selling Dope and shooting shit while huddled together

If you look at the underworld markets, blacks are still operating like there is no quarantine

Most of these the folks I saw at the Bodegas were old retired men. The elders, the civic leaders and the voice of reason. They are the sober few and I was surprised that they had not realized how
dangerous it was to do what they were doing

I still see a lot of these fools at laundry marts. Women with 6 kids in town, loitering around the laundry mart and shopping center. Going in and out of this and that store buying junk food

Poverty and ignorance is  a toxic mix

For black people education doesn't make a difference. The educated are the worst conspiracy nuts or religious nuts


This board just shows a Negro is Negro whether educated or uneducated

Apparently this Virus has been here for a long time. In Iceland 50% have it but are asymptomatic.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2020/04/10/coronavirus-covid-19-small-nations-iceland-big-data/2959797001/

I understood it a little differently.  That about 50% of those who test positive in Iceland are asymptomatic.  The percentage who have it is between 0.3% and 0.8%.  Remarkably, stable or reducing.

Stefansson said Iceland's randomized tests revealed that between 0.3%-0.8% of Iceland's population is infected with the respiratory illness, that about 50% of those who test positive for the virus are asymptomatic when they are tested, and that since mid-March the frequency of the virus among Iceland's general population who are not at the greatest risk – those who do not have underlying health conditions or signs and symptoms of COVID-19 – has either stayed stable or been decreasing.

Not many live in Iceland, so a 50% of the 10% being asymptomatic is a staggering figure. These people will continue spreading it. It definitely did not spread within 4mos given the sparse population. So my conclusion we are dealing with something out of a Stephen King movie. Its been there waiting.

Yep.  Puny country.

I think 10% is the size of the random sample that was tested.  It revealed that between 0.3%-0.8% of the tiny country has covid-19, of which 50%(0.15%-0.4% overall) are asymptomatic.

[vooke]

Fair point.  I have also asked about that particular issue here.  I wonder what the benefit of that is.  Is it just a fog of war we are in an emergency better safe than sorry issue?  Maybe.  Still you are right that if you count everybody who dies with covid-19 as a covid-19 death, then you are going to get numbers that make covid-19 seem deadlier than it really is.  I cannot think of an acceptable situation where misleading numbers are helpful?

Garliv is addicted to wild claims.

He is regurgitating conspiracy claims of pumping Covid-19 deaths and CDC are all in. That’s right wing garbage designed to absolve Trump of downplaying the pandemic. The more the virus ravages the US the more stupid Trump appears for downplaying it at first so it is in Trumptards’ interests to minimize its effects.

What I have read and Kagwe reported here is post mortem tests for Covid-19 are added to the positive cases

Yes yes yes he is.  But in this case he has a valid point.  Have you listened to Dr. Birx?

Here is the quote.

DR. DEBORAH BIRX: So, I think in this country we've taken a very liberal approach to mortality. And I think the reporting here has been pretty straightforward over the last five to six weeks. Prior to that when there wasn't testing in January and February that's a very different situation and unknown.

There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death. Right now we are still recording it and we will I mean the great thing about having forms that come in and a form that has the ability to market as COVID-19 infection the intent is right now that those if someone dies with COVID-19 we are counting that as a COVID-19 death.

I think that adds to the covid-19 numbers. 

Why do I think that is a problem?

Let's suppose for argument's sake that a person died of HIV/AIDS mediated causes.  And after testing his corpse he was found positive for covid-19.  Is that a covid-19 death or HIV/AIDS death?  If Dr. Birx is right, this will be recorded as a covid-19 death.

I am really clueless what the benefit of that is.

Birx is being misquoted. You may listen to what she said on Wednesday here

I take it you didn't listen to the video in the link.  The quote is verbatim.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/cnns-acosta-asks-birx-fauci-about-commentators-suggesting-death-toll-inflated-theres-a-lot-of-misinformation-out-there/

Here is part of the transcript:

“

I think every time I’ve been up here about the comorbidities. Most of the people, and we have talked about the Italy data, the majority of the Italians who succumbed to this had three or more comorbidities. So this has been known from the beginning. So those individuals will have an underlying condition, but that underlying condition did not cause their acute death when[/b] it’s related to a covid infection. In fact, it’s the opposite. Having an underlying condition and getting this virus, we know it’s particularly damaging to those individuals.”

What she is saying is, even if you have preexisting conditions ,if Covid-19 symptoms took you to the hospital and you succumbed they record the cause as Covid-19.

Why it makes sense is simple. They virus is the only variable. Say one is battling preexisting conditions for months or years. They go down with a Covid-19,are rushed to hospital and they are no more within days. Chances are they would have lived longer without Covid-19. The virus cut short their lives directly or indirectly.

If you look at this later statement, it makes even more compelling, the need to capture and release more data and information.  How many were tested, what were their comorbidities, their death rates(without covid-19).  Right now, they are reporting a number that says these are how many people have positive results and these are how many died.
 
To get a covid-19 test in the US, you have to be in real distress.  In this particular case she is talking about, you are already dead.  There are going to be people in distress with symptoms similar to those being associated with covid-19.  How many of these have died without covid-19?  Without reporting on that that kind of information, putting out data like that, even if it's true, can be misleading, and yes, raise the profile covid-19.

I did listen to the clip and as I said she is being misquoted.

There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death. Right now we are still recording it and we will I mean the great thing about having forms that come in and a form that has the ability to market as COVID-19 infection the intent is right now that those if someone dies with COVID-19 we are counting that as a COVID-19 death.

The last bit of the clip is what they are lurching on. She repeated this the next day.

Those pushing the overstatement claims read it to mean that all deaths of Covid-19 positive patients are attributed to the virus. But she clarified this is not the case. It’s only when the virus complications took you to ICU. Whatever you succumb to after this is assumed to have been caused by the virus.

You may want to listen to follow up questions on that and especially Fauci’s take:

From 1:39

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Fair point.  I have also asked about that particular issue here.  I wonder what the benefit of that is.  Is it just a fog of war we are in an emergency better safe than sorry issue?  Maybe.  Still you are right that if you count everybody who dies with covid-19 as a covid-19 death, then you are going to get numbers that make covid-19 seem deadlier than it really is.  I cannot think of an acceptable situation where misleading numbers are helpful?

Garliv is addicted to wild claims.

He is regurgitating conspiracy claims of pumping Covid-19 deaths and CDC are all in. That’s right wing garbage designed to absolve Trump of downplaying the pandemic. The more the virus ravages the US the more stupid Trump appears for downplaying it at first so it is in Trumptards’ interests to minimize its effects.

What I have read and Kagwe reported here is post mortem tests for Covid-19 are added to the positive cases

Yes yes yes he is.  But in this case he has a valid point.  Have you listened to Dr. Birx?

Here is the quote.

DR. DEBORAH BIRX: So, I think in this country we've taken a very liberal approach to mortality. And I think the reporting here has been pretty straightforward over the last five to six weeks. Prior to that when there wasn't testing in January and February that's a very different situation and unknown.

There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death. Right now we are still recording it and we will I mean the great thing about having forms that come in and a form that has the ability to market as COVID-19 infection the intent is right now that those if someone dies with COVID-19 we are counting that as a COVID-19 death.

I think that adds to the covid-19 numbers. 

Why do I think that is a problem?

Let's suppose for argument's sake that a person died of HIV/AIDS mediated causes.  And after testing his corpse he was found positive for covid-19.  Is that a covid-19 death or HIV/AIDS death?  If Dr. Birx is right, this will be recorded as a covid-19 death.

I am really clueless what the benefit of that is.

Birx is being misquoted. You may listen to what she said on Wednesday here

I take it you didn't listen to the video in the link.  The quote is verbatim.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/cnns-acosta-asks-birx-fauci-about-commentators-suggesting-death-toll-inflated-theres-a-lot-of-misinformation-out-there/

Here is part of the transcript:

“

I think every time I’ve been up here about the comorbidities. Most of the people, and we have talked about the Italy data, the majority of the Italians who succumbed to this had three or more comorbidities. So this has been known from the beginning. So those individuals will have an underlying condition, but that underlying condition did not cause their acute death when it’s related to a covid infection. In fact, it’s the opposite. Having an underlying condition and getting this virus, we know it’s particularly damaging to those individuals.”

What she is saying is, even if you have preexisting conditions ,if Covid-19 symptoms took you to the hospital and you succumbed they record the cause as Covid-19.

Why it makes sense is simple. They virus is the only variable. Say one is battling preexisting conditions for months or years. They go down with a Covid-19,are rushed to hospital and they are no more within days. Chances are they would have lived longer without Covid-19. The virus cut short their lives directly or indirectly.

If you look at this later statement, it makes even more compelling, the need to capture and release more data and information.  How many were tested, what were their comorbidities, their death rates(without covid-19).  Right now, they are reporting a number that says these are how many people have positive results and these are how many died.
 
To get a covid-19 test in the US, you have to be in real distress.  In this particular case she is talking about, you are already dead.  There are going to be people in distress with symptoms similar to those being associated with covid-19.  How many of these have died without covid-19?  Without reporting on that that kind of information, putting out data like that, even if it's true, can be misleading, and yes, raise the profile covid-19.

I did listen to the clip and as I said she is being misquoted.

There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death. Right now we are still recording it and we will I mean the great thing about having forms that come in and a form that has the ability to market as COVID-19 infection the intent is right now that those if someone dies with COVID-19 we are counting that as a COVID-19 death.

The last bit of the clip is what they are lurching on. She repeated this the next day.

Those pushing the overstatement claims read it to mean that all deaths of Covid-19 positive patients are attributed to the virus. But she clarified this is not the case. It’s only when the virus complications took you to ICU. Whatever you succumb to after this is assumed to have been caused by the virus.

You may want to listen to follow up questions on that and especially Fauci’s take:

From 1:39

She is not being misquoted if the quote includes everything she said about the subject and is verbatim no less.  Nothing added.  Nothing left out.  No paraphrase.  No emphasis.  With video to wit. 

Fauci’s clarification is helpful.  Your immediate cause of death may be a heart attack, but you don’t get it if you don’t have respiratory distress caused by covid-19.  Fair point.

The Italians are taking a different approach.  You don’t die of a heart attack if you don’t have a pre-existing heart condition, even if you had covid-19.  So they emphasize that.

The US is emphasizing the role of covid-19, while Italy emphasizes comorbidities.  A case could be made for either approach.  But it complicates any comparisons one may want carry out between the two situations.

I still think, not enough information is being gathered and shared, to put those numbers(the US) in context.  Specifically about the sick and dying who tested negative for covid-19.  I doubt we will be able to get a picture of the overall effect of covid-19 on the healthy population anytime soon.

[vooke]

Fair point.  I have also asked about that particular issue here.  I wonder what the benefit of that is.  Is it just a fog of war we are in an emergency better safe than sorry issue?  Maybe.  Still you are right that if you count everybody who dies with covid-19 as a covid-19 death, then you are going to get numbers that make covid-19 seem deadlier than it really is.  I cannot think of an acceptable situation where misleading numbers are helpful?

Garliv is addicted to wild claims.

He is regurgitating conspiracy claims of pumping Covid-19 deaths and CDC are all in. That’s right wing garbage designed to absolve Trump of downplaying the pandemic. The more the virus ravages the US the more stupid Trump appears for downplaying it at first so it is in Trumptards’ interests to minimize its effects.

What I have read and Kagwe reported here is post mortem tests for Covid-19 are added to the positive cases

Yes yes yes he is.  But in this case he has a valid point.  Have you listened to Dr. Birx?

Here is the quote.

DR. DEBORAH BIRX: So, I think in this country we've taken a very liberal approach to mortality. And I think the reporting here has been pretty straightforward over the last five to six weeks. Prior to that when there wasn't testing in January and February that's a very different situation and unknown.

There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death. Right now we are still recording it and we will I mean the great thing about having forms that come in and a form that has the ability to market as COVID-19 infection the intent is right now that those if someone dies with COVID-19 we are counting that as a COVID-19 death.

I think that adds to the covid-19 numbers. 

Why do I think that is a problem?

Let's suppose for argument's sake that a person died of HIV/AIDS mediated causes.  And after testing his corpse he was found positive for covid-19.  Is that a covid-19 death or HIV/AIDS death?  If Dr. Birx is right, this will be recorded as a covid-19 death.

I am really clueless what the benefit of that is.

Birx is being misquoted. You may listen to what she said on Wednesday here

I take it you didn't listen to the video in the link.  The quote is verbatim.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/cnns-acosta-asks-birx-fauci-about-commentators-suggesting-death-toll-inflated-theres-a-lot-of-misinformation-out-there/

Here is part of the transcript:

“

I think every time I’ve been up here about the comorbidities. Most of the people, and we have talked about the Italy data, the majority of the Italians who succumbed to this had three or more comorbidities. So this has been known from the beginning. So those individuals will have an underlying condition, but that underlying condition did not cause their acute death when it’s related to a covid infection. In fact, it’s the opposite. Having an underlying condition and getting this virus, we know it’s particularly damaging to those individuals.”

What she is saying is, even if you have preexisting conditions ,if Covid-19 symptoms took you to the hospital and you succumbed they record the cause as Covid-19.

Why it makes sense is simple. They virus is the only variable. Say one is battling preexisting conditions for months or years. They go down with a Covid-19,are rushed to hospital and they are no more within days. Chances are they would have lived longer without Covid-19. The virus cut short their lives directly or indirectly.

If you look at this later statement, it makes even more compelling, the need to capture and release more data and information.  How many were tested, what were their comorbidities, their death rates(without covid-19).  Right now, they are reporting a number that says these are how many people have positive results and these are how many died.
 
To get a covid-19 test in the US, you have to be in real distress.  In this particular case she is talking about, you are already dead.  There are going to be people in distress with symptoms similar to those being associated with covid-19.  How many of these have died without covid-19?  Without reporting on that that kind of information, putting out data like that, even if it's true, can be misleading, and yes, raise the profile covid-19.

I did listen to the clip and as I said she is being misquoted.

There are other countries that if you had a preexisting condition and let's say the virus caused you to go to the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem some countries are recording as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death. Right now we are still recording it and we will I mean the great thing about having forms that come in and a form that has the ability to market as COVID-19 infection the intent is right now that those if someone dies with COVID-19 we are counting that as a COVID-19 death.

The last bit of the clip is what they are lurching on. She repeated this the next day.

Those pushing the overstatement claims read it to mean that all deaths of Covid-19 positive patients are attributed to the virus. But she clarified this is not the case. It’s only when the virus complications took you to ICU. Whatever you succumb to after this is assumed to have been caused by the virus.

You may want to listen to follow up questions on that and especially Fauci’s take:

From 1:39

She is not being misquoted if the quote includes everything she said about the subject and is verbatim no less.  Nothing added.  Nothing left out.  No paraphrase.  No emphasis.  With video to wit. 

Fauci’s clarification is helpful.  Your immediate cause of death may be a heart attack, but you don’t get it if you don’t have respiratory distress caused by covid-19.  Fair point.

The Italians are taking a different approach.  You don’t die of a heart attack if you don’t have a pre-existing heart condition, even if you had covid-19.  So they emphasize that.

The US is emphasizing the role of covid-19, while Italy emphasizes comorbidities.  A case could be made for either approach.  But it complicates any comparisons one may want carry out between the two situations.

I still think, not enough information is being gathered and shared, to put those numbers(the US) in context.  Specifically about the sick and dying who tested negative for covid-19.  I doubt we will be able to get a picture of the overall effect of covid-19 on the healthy population anytime soon.

She is misquoted in the sense that her words are taken to mean the opposite of what she is saying even after repeating it the next day. The portion I highlighted is what is being thrown around on its own.

We can only tell the ‘overall effect’ if we tested everyone. That’s not happening any time soon. This means case fatality  rate is likely to be overstated and its variance across countries may boil down to, among others, testing.


Regarding the data you believe would put Covid-19 figures in context, I think there is enough data on daily deaths. Covid-19 is far from the #1 killer but it can easily get there if the infected cases hits millions,or so the argument goes. That plus the resources expended in managing the 8% or so of the infected who get critical