The war btw Ruto and Uhuru is now live

[Nefertiti]

Joe Ageyo cornered the goon about his tantrums in 2007. Were the elections not stolen by the deep state? The chameleon changed colors till the rainbow ran out. Lol

[RV Pundit]

Joe Ageyo cornered the goon about his tantrums in 2007. Were the elections not stolen by the deep state? The chameleon changed colors till the rainbow ran out. Lol

2007 is buried hatchet..and Ruto dodged it.2007 gave us new constitution and new election laws including a supreme court.That supreme court has annulled an election

[Nefertiti]

Kenya is 3 beacons. It 2 vs 1 so your boy is on losing side. 2007 was also 2 v 1 so Kibaki had to accede to NARA.

My high IQ is telling me a civil war is probable because Uhuru has gov and Ruto has warriors - Ruto unless assisinated is not the guy to be cowed.

We were just few days from one in 2007. In Nakuru the police basically split along tribes - and army from Lanet had to be called. Now assume the army split.

A repeat of 2007 will be worse.

My high IQ allows me to predict good and bad things.

There is nothing special about Kenya - that South Sudan or Uganda or Rwanda or Somali - didn't have - you have two powerful leaders engaged in death fight - and country will probably die with it.

This is like Machar-Kiir fight - that put south sudan into a civil war.

The next phase is civil war in gov circles, security forces and the work.

Pundit why do you always default to civil war, like you are programmed? This is a political battle of wits and strategy. If you threaten people with brawn then things will get nasty. The other day you were bragging here how you are high IQ and some of us here are low IQ. Have you given up using your wits for this battle?

[RV Pundit]

Nowayah,Bomas unravel because of one thing, devolution. Kikuyu were afraid of majimbo..their fears both founded and unfounded. Founded because the 14 region would mean a million kikuyu in RV and Coast that were already unwanted would suffer.They first killed Prof Mbai.Such a shame because Mbai had helped crafted devolution from majimbo or federalism that some wanted.When it backfired they went to kilifi and adopted constitution that mirrored mois 1980s district focus..the current counties and devolution..is a middle ground btw kilifi or gema document and non gema bomas.Raila want Bomas back.But obviously he doesn't know why many differs with it.This constitution is not broken.It breaks if we go to another war and we can fix it

[RV Pundit]

Kenya is 3 beacons. It 2 vs 1 so your boy is on losing side. 2007 was also 2 v 1 so Kibaki had to accede to NARA.

My high IQ is telling me a civil war is probable because Uhuru has gov and Ruto has warriors - Ruto unless assisinated is not the guy to be cowed.

We were just few days from one in 2007. In Nakuru the police basically split along tribes - and army from Lanet had to be called. Now assume the army split.

A repeat of 2007 will be worse.

My high IQ allows me to predict good and bad things.

There is nothing special about Kenya - that South Sudan or Uganda or Rwanda or Somali - didn't have - you have two powerful leaders engaged in death fight - and country will probably die with it.

This is like Machar-Kiir fight - that put south sudan into a

Kenya is 3 beacons. It 2 vs 1 so your boy is on losing side. 2007 was also 2 v 1 so Kibaki had to accede to NARA.

My high IQ is telling me a civil war is probable because Uhuru has gov and Ruto has warriors - Ruto unless assisinated is not the guy to be cowed.

We were just few days from one in 2007. In Nakuru the police basically split along tribes - and army from Lanet had to be called. Now assume the army split.

A repeat of 2007 will be worse.

My high IQ allows me to predict good and bad things.

There is nothing special about Kenya - that South Sudan or Uganda or Rwanda or Somali - didn't have - you have two powerful leaders engaged in death fight - and country will probably die with it.

This is like Machar-Kiir fight - that put south sudan into a civil war.

The next phase is civil war in gov circles, security forces and the work.

Pundit why do you always default to civil war, like you are programmed? This is a political battle of wits and strategy. If you threaten people with brawn then things will get nasty. The other day you were bragging here how you are high IQ and some of us here are low IQ. Have you given up using your wits for this battle?

Robina I think Raila is going down and Ruto is very strong. The next two years will be critical.Raila would be smiling if it was for small mistake of destroying NASA and his support base.Raila every election if you go by ODM fortunes has been losing support.He had Luos, mijikendas and southern Luhyas.I think he in the process of losing coast.That leave him with mainly Luos..10% plus 5% that opinion polls have him.Ruto is the new dynamic...almost playing the middle of gema and non gema

[Nefertiti]

ODM and Raila are pushing for Bomas Draft - hybrid PORK-PM, 3-tier, etc. As you admit this had majority backing. BBI is Bomas not Kilifi.

Raila did not "save" Kibaki in 2002 - any more than Ruto saved Uhuru in 2013. Kibaki and then Uhuru were simply the best candidates at the time. Nobody ever made anybody anything without their own selfish calculations and realism. KANU had Kikuyu-Luhya ticket same as NARC.

The last selfless politician was Jaramogi who indeed saved Jomo - and Uhuru is keen to repay that oldest debt. Uhuru owe his PORK first and foremost to his heritage (so Raila collect for Jaramogi), then Moi Snr (Giddy collects), then Ruto is distant 3rd - will be paid in 2042. I don't see any betrayal just priority - which is accurate. Uhuru remain gentleman ready to pay all debts and atone sins of the father. Jomo killed parliamentary federalism- BBI is actually atonement for original sin.

Nowayaha,

1) Kibaki was abandoned en-masse by Mt Kenya immediately Moi endorsed Uhuru. Kiambu and a whole 1/3 of GEMA still voted for Uhuru and KANU in the main election.

2) Raila saved Kibaki - otherwise KANU would have won - with possibly Nyachae-Raila and Kibaki-Wamalwa distant third. Ngilu and Wamalwa were welterweight. Raila did heavy lifting after Kibaki got indisposed with road accident.

3) Kibaki signed an MOU with LDP. He reneged on it almost immeidately. This is Uhuru 2.0 betrayal of Jubilee and nothing good can come out of it.

4) Kibaki after losing in Bomas - run to Kilifi - and made his own document (BBI style) -and subjected to the referendum - instead of the Bomas draft that had representation of all kenyans.

5) BBI is another kilifi draft - cynical document - it cannot go anywhere without public support - it will be defeated either in parliament or courts or in a referendum - if at all Raila and Uhuru can manage to agree. The current constitution is negotiated document - everyone lost something - and everyone need to get over it - and live with it.

[RV Pundit]

Robina, this jaramogi myth is very hilarious to me as keen historian.GEMA in absence of Kenyatta appointed James Gichuru the kanu chairman and jaramogi the vice chairman. THE DRUNKARD JAMES GICHURU IS THE ONE WHO SACRIFICED BEING PM WHEN KANU WAS ASKED TO FORM GOV BY COLONIAL OFFICE .Jaramogi never sacrificed anything.He wasn't going to be anything more than minister....in James Gichuru gov.KADU and settler then formed gov with like of Moi as education minister.

[Nefertiti]

Robina I think Raila is going down and Ruto is very strong. The next two years will be critical.Raila would be smiling if it was for small mistake of destroying NASA and his support base.Raila every election if you go by ODM fortunes has been losing support.He had Luos, mijikendas and southern Luhyas.I think he in the process of losing coast.That leave him with mainly Luos..10% plus 5% that opinion polls have him.Ruto is the new dynamic...almost playing the middle of gema and non gema

You see this pattern... Raila messed Ruto in 2002 - Ruto messed Raila in 2013 - Raila messed Ruto in 2018 - your hope is Ruto realigns his ducks in next 2 years. Tough luck. Gema are kingmakers so forget about PEV - it needs hate speech and incitement which is bad strategy this round.

BBI is dead thanks to covid. Handshake coalition is new NARC - they will promise to roll out more devolution and all nonsense in 100 days - and sweep the floor with Ruto.

[Nefertiti]

NARC 2 will have PORK, DPORK, PM, 2 DPM - which string all Kalonzo, Mdvds, Johos, Oparanyas to back Raila-PK. With more devolution, gender parity, etc - all miracles in 100 days. Ruto hustler coalition will not be credible to have such lineup since he oppose BBI2.

See it Ruto who is flat-footed... no party, no influencers, no machinery. No nothing.

[Nefertiti]

That is history like 2007 - folks believe selfless patriot Jaramogi declined to form GoK without Jomo as PM - and that Kibaki rigged Raila. Few people believe Raila was rigged 2013-17 cause RVGema is perceived as the bigger coalition.

For 2022 - most Ruto folks esp Gema - already accept Ruto will win but system will rig in Raila. Perception is reality.

Robina, this jaramogi myth is very hilarious to me as keen historian.GEMA in absence of Kenyatta appointed James Gichuru the kanu chairman and jaramogi the vice chairman. THE DRUNKARD JAMES GICHURU IS THE ONE WHO SACRIFICED BEING PM WHEN KANU WAS ASKED TO FORM GOV BY COLONIAL OFFICE .Jaramogi never sacrificed anything.He wasn't going to be anything more than minister....in James Gichuru gov.KADU and settler then formed gov with like of Moi as education minister.

[Kadudu]

Pundit, we have told you several times. Stop those war cries. There will be no war if William Ruto looses an election. He is not Raila. If you think that even one Kikuyu will raise his hand against a Luo or Kisii because of William Ruto, then you are mistaken.
Whom apart from Kikuyus and the few Kisiis will the Kalejin attack? The number of Kalejin outside of RV is negligible. Face reality and scheme for a life after 2022 without William Ruto being president of Kenya.

[gout]

Most Afrooptimist just because they sip on some imported wines and whiskey are deluded to think Africa is some Geneva and not jungles running with brutal restless people who will turn crazy in a spark despite all the history. The veneer of some urban slums and press conferences is deluding! Uhurus, Murathes, Atwolis are in utopia heaven stairs. They think they hold monopoly of savagery in stealing covid billions, but the desperate masses are now nuns.

The kids who saw 2007 are now out of school and idle -they won't mind any blood sport for any sake.

Heck, mwafrika is hacking their spouses and kids, like cabbage and you think with political grievance they won't run amok because of empty never again slogans! 

[RV Pundit]

Any war btw Kalenjin and kikuyus is enough to grind the country to a halt. Even in 2007 - the rest of the wars - were sideshows. We are talking about a million people who be affected within matters of hour or days.

Pundit, we have told you several times. Stop those war cries. There will be no war if William Ruto looses an election. He is not Raila. If you think that even one Kikuyu will raise his hand against a Luo or Kisii because of William Ruto, then you are mistaken.
Whom apart from Kikuyus and the few Kisiis will the Kalejin attack? The number of Kalejin outside of RV is negligible. Face reality and scheme for a life after 2022 without William Ruto being president of Kenya.

[Nefertiti]

And how does this work for Ruto-MK ticket? War has logic too. There is a reason Murathe and Tuju are still carrying Uhuru cross - watching the interview it difficult to get the exaggeration in your thread here.

Any war btw Kalenjin and kikuyus is enough to grind the country to a halt. Even in 2007 - the rest of the wars - were sideshows. We are talking about a million people who be affected within matters of hour or days.

Pundit, we have told you several times. Stop those war cries. There will be no war if William Ruto looses an election. He is not Raila. If you think that even one Kikuyu will raise his hand against a Luo or Kisii because of William Ruto, then you are mistaken.
Whom apart from Kikuyus and the few Kisiis will the Kalejin attack? The number of Kalejin outside of RV is negligible. Face reality and scheme for a life after 2022 without William Ruto being president of Kenya.

[Nowayhaha]

Kenya is 3 beacons. It 2 vs 1 so your boy is on losing side. 2007 was also 2 v 1 so Kibaki had to accede to NARA.

My high IQ is telling me a civil war is probable because Uhuru has gov and Ruto has warriors - Ruto unless assisinated is not the guy to be cowed.

We were just few days from one in 2007. In Nakuru the police basically split along tribes - and army from Lanet had to be called. Now assume the army split.

A repeat of 2007 will be worse.

My high IQ allows me to predict good and bad things.

There is nothing special about Kenya - that South Sudan or Uganda or Rwanda or Somali - didn't have - you have two powerful leaders engaged in death fight - and country will probably die with it.

This is like Machar-Kiir fight - that put south sudan into a civil war.

The next phase is civil war in gov circles, security forces and the work.

Pundit why do you always default to civil war, like you are programmed? This is a political battle of wits and strategy. If you threaten people with brawn then things will get nasty. The other day you were bragging here how you are high IQ and some of us here are low IQ. Have you given up using your wits for this battle?

Uhuru is no longer a factor  . Just like Awori in 2007 , didnt bring any value to Kibaki

[Nowayhaha]

Nowayah,Bomas unravel because of one thing, devolution. Kikuyu were afraid of majimbo..their fears both founded and unfounded. Founded because the 14 region would mean a million kikuyu in RV and Coast that were already unwanted would suffer.They first killed Prof Mbai.Such a shame because Mbai had helped crafted devolution from majimbo or federalism that some wanted.When it backfired they went to kilifi and adopted constitution that mirrored mois 1980s district focus..the current counties and devolution..is a middle ground btw kilifi or gema document and non gema bomas.Raila want Bomas back.But obviously he doesn't know why many differs with it.This constitution is not broken.It breaks if we go to another war and we can fix it

Did you read the Bomas draft ?  That document was premised on selection rather than election  The so called Regional assembilies and Presidents  would be selected by councils , same as selection of a Premier .  Also how do you explain the initial idea of making Nyanza two regions and maintaining one in Central ,Coast , North Eastern, Eastern ?
Here is the Bomas draft go through it and tell me if it is not comedy

https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/s3.sourceafrica.net/documents/118273/Kenya-4-Draft-Constitution-Bomas-Draft-2004.pdf

[Nowayhaha]

NARC 2 will have PORK, DPORK, PM, 2 DPM - which string all Kalonzo, Mdvds, Johos, Oparanyas to back Raila-PK. With more devolution, gender parity, etc - all miracles in 100 days. Ruto hustler coalition will not be credible to have such lineup since he oppose BBI2.

See it Ruto who is flat-footed... no party, no influencers, no machinery. No nothing.

You need to wake up from that Lala land you are in are ,Mudavadi . The miracle will be Raila winning  and its not happening , Didnt happen in 97,2007,2013, 2017  and wont happen in  2022 , you will be here talking about how 2022 elections were rigged

[RV Pundit]

COE - harmonized both Bomas and Kilifi - gave us harmonized draft 1 - we made our suggestions - they gave us harmonized draft II - and then Naivasha PSC - made the final call and gave us constitution. So this is really water under the bridge. I believe both sides won and lost. I believe BBI cannot be anything serious.

Did you read the Bomas draft ?  That document was premised on selection rather than election  The so called Regional assembilies and Presidents  would be selected by councils , same as selection of a Premier .  Also how do you explain the initial idea of making Nyanza two regions and maintaining one in Central ,Coast , North Eastern, Eastern ?
Here is the Bomas draft go through it and tell me if it is not comedy

https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/s3.sourceafrica.net/documents/118273/Kenya-4-Draft-Constitution-Bomas-Draft-2004.pdf

[Nefertiti]

NARC 2 will have PORK, DPORK, PM, 2 DPM - which string all Kalonzo, Mdvds, Johos, Oparanyas to back Raila-PK. With more devolution, gender parity, etc - all miracles in 100 days. Ruto hustler coalition will not be credible to have such lineup since he oppose BBI2.

See it Ruto who is flat-footed... no party, no influencers, no machinery. No nothing.

You need to wake up from that Lala land you are in are ,Mudavadi . The miracle will be Raila winning  and its not happening , Didnt happen in 97,2007,2013, 2017  and wont happen in  2022 , you will be here talking about how 2022 elections were rigged

We been here before - Ruto doing KYM job then get overzealous, loudmouth and kicked out like a dog. 2005 - 2 vs 1 No won. 2010 - 2 vs 1 Yes won. Ruto has never been president. He need to create and run a non-Kalenjin party first for at least a few years. He's still at basic level of tripping over himself. How do you lose to a retiring president? This is Guinness record.

[Nefertiti]

Noway - on party management Mdvd has a better record than Ruto. You'd think after Kanu, ODM-K, ODM, UDM bloke would know a few tricks. It was bragged he had control of the party - before we discover a clause that say party leader decision is final on all matters - exactly like ODM