Countdown to Genocide

[vooke]

Any word on David Ndii? Was he at the swearing in?

He was, I saw him.

This is a war of attrition, arrest them one by one to weary them

[Empedocles]

I too beg to disagree with your opinion but we are entitled to ours. That's what a democracy is all about.  We have never been here before and therefore its unchartered territory.  Some are talking about 2022 dreaming that all this will go away and then in 2022 we will have the same elections with Chebukati or his ilk at the helm of the IEBC, yada, yada, yada. It will not be the same again. All I know is that unless a lot of things change in very fundamental ways, we will never have another elections again like in 2017. Half of this country did not participate in the 11/26 elections and therefore we will be on campaign mode until another elections is held. 

Agreed, we're in uncharted territory, it's good to disagree (helps me learn more also) and nobody really knows what's coming up.

The only thing we can do is look into the past and try to guess, like we're all doing here. Yet the patterns of the past seem to keep repeating themselves. I mean, Kalonzo spent years in KANU, more than any current politician I think. Weta, well, he's a product of KANU and MDVD is a pedigree offspring of KANU.

Now,one thing I really don't understand is the basis which RAO used to swear himself in. Wasn't NASA ecstatic over the annulment of the 8.8.17 elections?

Kenya opposition stronghold celebrates at the decision. Kenya's Supreme Court has annulled the result of last month's presidential election, citing irregularities, and ordered a new one within 60 days.

Why the change of mind now?

Then comes the weird statement put out by Kalonzo, Weta, and MDVD:

"We met on Monday and agreed to meet again this morning(Tuesday). However, due to circumstances beyond our comprehension and control, the four of us did not assemble as planned. Nonetheless, the NASA Summit remains strong and united. The Summit will meet within two days, to address the immense challenges facing this country," a joint statement from the three read.

Followed by this news: 77 NASA MPs, 15 county chiefs snubbed Raila 'oath'.

This is more than confusing.

[Nefertiti]

Empo politics is not logic ok? Not the state nor NASA is upholding the law - the difference is who has the rungu. All present 'principals' are Kanu orphans except Raila. A verbal threat to cancel their diplomatic visas is sufficient to dissuade them.

https://www.nation.co.ke/news/Why-police-pulled-out-Uhuru-Park/1056-4285122-xv1y7t/index.html

[vooke]

Miguna hapendi ujinga

[audacityofhope]

Miguna says it is protected speech. You can almost here a pin drop since this act of defiance.

[Empedocles]

Empo politics is not logic ok? Not the state nor NASA is upholding the law - the difference is who has the rungu. All present 'principals' are Kanu orphans except Raila. A verbal threat to cancel their diplomatic visas is sufficient to dissuade them.

https://www.nation.co.ke/news/Why-police-pulled-out-Uhuru-Park/1056-4285122-xv1y7t/index.html

Agreed that neither Jubilee nor NASA even bother pretending to follow the law. Both coalitions are firm believers of impunity.

Wasn't RAO secretary general of KANU and only left when things didn't go his way i.e. being named the anointed successor to Moi? Then he too is a KANU orphan.



Interesting you mention about the rungu. Who's holding it in NASA?

ODM hijacked Raila and Kalonzo swearing-in plans, Wiper says

ODM hijacked NASA's swearing-in ceremony on Tuesday, Kivutha Kibwana has claimed, and demanded respect from the party.

Raila Odinga, who was inaugurated as the people's president, is the leader of the orange party. He was not with his co-principals during the ceremony and there are now claims of a rift but the leaders say they are united.

Details: Raila 'sworn-in' as people's president, Kalonzo absent

Speaking on Musyi FM on Thursday, Kibwana gave his own version of events, saying the four principals agreed to meet that morning before proceeding to the Nairobi park.

The others are Wiper's Kalonzo Musyoka who was to be swrong-in as the people's DP, Musalia Mudavadi (Amani National Congress) and Bungoma senator Moses Wetang'ula (Ford Kenya).

Kibwana, who is Makueni governor and Wiper chairman, said they did not meet because Raila decided to proceed to the venue alone.

"Kalonzo and Raila were to meet that morning. But when Kalonzo got to the venue, only Wetang'ula and Mudavadi were there."

The county boss said they contacted Raila but were told that the Opposition leader had already left for the swearing-in.

"When they contacted Raila, he said he would not make it and would instead proceed to Uhuru Park for the swearing-in," he said.

Kibwana further claimed members of the inauguration's organising committee were not briefed on the happenings.

"ODM has not been fair. Even our representatives in the plans were kept in the dark most of the time," he said. "We are part of the NASA coalition but most of the time we were not briefed on meetings and progress."

The chairman noted ODM should respect other parties but added the co-principals were willing to talk to Raila about their differences.

"Yes, there are issues that need to be looked into but I want to assume that the Kamba nation and NASA are intact. All we ask for is respect from our other partner (ODM)," he said.

"There was a time we asked for a NASA retreat because there were many who were unsettled ... there are wrinkles in NASA that need to be ironed out first, especially distribution of leadership posts in Parliament and NASA's technical team. We need respect."

Kalonzo blamed his absence on the pulling out of his security team. In an interview on Mbaitu FM, a local Kamba station, he said he had been ready for the event until the government abruptly withdrew his security detail.

The 2017 deputy president candidate asked his supporters not to lose faith in him after he skipped the much-publicised ceremony.

On Wednesday, he reported an attack at his home but police said it may have been fabricated.

Of security concerns, Kibwana said: "NASA leaders were still deliberating on the oath's wording and how it would be administered but they were unable to meet to resolve the issue for fear of being nabbed."

[Nefertiti]

Empo, Jubilee alone wields the rungu.

Kanu orphans.. Raila was an intruder, a cunning shamba boy, not a child of the home.

[Kichwa]

Robina, You are all over the place since you decided to betray your own principles-define "rungu" for me.

Empo, Jubilee alone wields the rungu.

Kanu orphans.. Raila was an intruder, a cunning shamba boy, not a child of the home.

[Empedocles]

Empo, Jubilee alone wields the rungu.

I meant who holds the rungu in NASA. Uhuruto hold it over Jubilee while RAO holds it over NASA.

Kanu orphans.. Raila was an intruder, a cunning shamba boy, not a child of the home.

So if Moi had handed over the rungu to RAO, he would have still gone ahead to destroy KANU? Really?

Oh, RAO is a child of KANU, even using their same tactics to purportedly convince his supporters they won the election and justify his "swearing in". There's no difference between what RAO did now and what Kibaki (another KANU orphan) did in 2008.

NASA Results Part 5 - Conclusion, the Faker is Exposed. Interesting in depth analysis by Charles Hornsby.

[Nefertiti]

Rungu - state machinery

Robina, You are all over the place since you decided to betray your own principles-define "rungu" for me.

Empo, Jubilee alone wields the rungu.

Kanu orphans.. Raila was an intruder, a cunning shamba boy, not a child of the home.

[Nefertiti]

So if Moi had handed over the rungu to RAO, he would have still gone ahead to destroy KANU? Really?

Oh, RAO is a child of KANU, even using their same tactics to purportedly convince his supporters they won the election and justify his "swearing in". There's no difference between what RAO did now and what Kibaki (another KANU orphan) did in 2008.

NASA Results Part 5 - Conclusion, the Faker is Exposed. Interesting in depth analysis by Charles Hornsby.

You argue that Raila has loser morals than Kanu. I don't disagree. He was with them but not of them 

What does Kichwa make of all this?

[Kichwa]

NASA is a movement of the people and therefore the people hold the rungu.  Jubilee on the other hand is run by individuals. I have no idea who holds the rungu. Kikuyus says they have the rungu and Kalenjins also insists they have it. Kalenjins believe they have the rungu because if Kikuyus betrays them, then they have kikuyu hostages in the rift that they will immediately start executing.  Kikuyus also believe they hold the rungu because Ruto's only path to presidency is through total kikuyu support. Its more like a mutual assured destruction of some sorts and it will not end well.

Empo, Jubilee alone wields the rungu.

I meant who holds the rungu in NASA. Uhuruto hold it over Jubilee while RAO holds it over NASA.

Kanu orphans.. Raila was an intruder, a cunning shamba boy, not a child of the home.

So if Moi had handed over the rungu to RAO, he would have still gone ahead to destroy KANU? Really?

Oh, RAO is a child of KANU, even using their same tactics to purportedly convince his supporters they won the election and justify his "swearing in". There's no difference between what RAO did now and what Kibaki (another KANU orphan) did in 2008.

NASA Results Part 5 - Conclusion, the Faker is Exposed. Interesting in depth analysis by Charles Hornsby.

[Kichwa]

seriously?  you want to talk about Kanu days?

So if Moi had handed over the rungu to RAO, he would have still gone ahead to destroy KANU? Really?

Oh, RAO is a child of KANU, even using their same tactics to purportedly convince his supporters they won the election and justify his "swearing in". There's no difference between what RAO did now and what Kibaki (another KANU orphan) did in 2008.

NASA Results Part 5 - Conclusion, the Faker is Exposed. Interesting in depth analysis by Charles Hornsby.

You argue that Raila has loser morals than Kanu. I don't disagree. He was with them but not of them 

What does Kichwa make of all this?

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Miguna says it is protected speech. You can almost here a pin drop since this act of defiance.

The usual strategy has been to corrupt the process and "legitimize" it with trappings of power.  That seems to be backfiring for the jubilant at this point.  Instead, it has opened the floodgates for each group to decide what is legitimate and what is not. 

What Raila did on the 30th, is not materially any different than what Jubilee did last year, if you exclude murdering election IT honchos, threatening judges and IEBC officials, not to mention actually winning the election.

[bryan275]

Miguna says it is protected speech. You can almost here a pin drop since this act of defiance.

That lovable rogue..... Miguna has scared the electoral fraudsters.... they tested the waters by arresting Kajwang.... Canaan is here.

[Dear Mami]

Empo, Jubilee alone wields the rungu.

Kanu orphans.. Raila was an intruder, a cunning shamba boy, not a child of the home.

I agree with you. At least you are fair. Empedocles has been trying to make this "Raila is the same" argument for eons using nothing but the time he joined KANU for really just a stint. Because that's really all anyone can find.

You argue that Raila has loser morals than Kanu. I don't disagree. He was with them but not of them 

What does Kichwa make of all this?

I have a feeling from what you say here and above that you meant to say "I disagree" or "I don't agree" and somehow mixed them up. Am I wrong?

You are right. This is not about the law any more. NASA argue that the law is now just a rungu in the hands of an opponent on an unfair playing field. I agree with them. But I don't personally get what the swearing in is/was about. Me, personally? I just want people to get serious about a people driven movement for secession talks without violence. I am waiting for the point at which this will be possible once the steam is out ears and hubris has been beaten out of chests by men all around. Without a serious threat for secession (without violence, I repeat) there will be no restructuring.

Another thing, Africans need to learn that the ideal of Law is a bazungu ideal. It has not yet sunk enough in our culture to become truly ours. It's still a hoped for goal, not an ideal we actually live up to day to day. So I'm hoping we can come to some sort of arrangement that's true to our own reality and that makes identity politics a none issue. I know it sounds like a dream but hey, niwache niote tafadhali, simzui mwengine asiyependa ndoto zakitumaini!

[vooke]

[Dear Mami]

If they don't end up in prison or wind up dead that is - I think MaDVD and Kanu soft boys knows what Gov hard power can do  to people. They've been there and know that. Engaging in treasonous activities is not a joke...last time Raila ended up 9yrs in Kamiti. This time coz of old age & politics they may use other means to drive the point home but for Miguna, Ndii & Joho - they won't get the free pass.

Madvd n the other soft Kanu boys stopped the first swearing in: that is at least clear. They went to presser n RAO was a no show. Yesterday he went ahead and they were a no show. I think Joho, Magaya and even, I hate to say it, Miguna, are the benefeciaries of Raila's clout should he no longer be a factor. People supporting him will not follow any of the principals after this. They'll follow Joho.

Actually, I think it's the other way around. KANU soft boys "play" politics: they have never actually suffered due to politics and are unwilling to start now. Look at Madvd's smooth face and soft body That dude probably has never even been held up in a queue for more than a few hours leave alone detained or tortured. The Ndiis, Migunas and RAO himself, are different. It's the same with Uhuru and Ruto. Ruto probably would be willing to risk danger but Uhuru is a soft cerelac baby. He and Madvd probably went to the same nursery school and sang singing games together. Even that Naivasha business was not of his making, alipelekwa na "wazee" and he went with the flow without even seriously contemplating what was going on. I'll give him one point over Madvd in that at least he has faced a real threat to him in the name of ICC. I don't think Madvd has ever even experienced a delayed flight.

[Nefertiti]

Empo, Jubilee alone wields the rungu.

Kanu orphans.. Raila was an intruder, a cunning shamba boy, not a child of the home.

I agree with you. At least you are fair. Empedocles has been trying to make this "Raila is the same" argument for eons using nothing but the time he joined KANU for really just a stint. Because that's really all anyone can find.

You argue that Raila has loser morals than Kanu. I don't disagree. He was with them but not of them 

What does Kichwa make of all this?

I have a feeling from what you say here and above that you meant to say "I disagree" or "I don't agree" and somehow mixed them up. Am I wrong?

I meant Raila is not a Kanu orphan, you're right it was a typo.

You are right. This is not about the law any more. NASA argue that the law is now just a rungu in the hands of an opponent on an unfair playing field. I agree with them. But I don't personally get what the swearing in is/was about. Me, personally? I just want people to get serious about a people driven movement for secession talks without violence. I am waiting for the point at which this will be possible once the steam is out ears and hubris has been beaten out of chests by men all around. Without a serious threat for secession (without violence, I repeat) there will be no restructuring.

Another thing, Africans need to learn that the ideal of Law is a bazungu ideal. It has not yet sunk enough in our culture to become truly ours. It's still a hoped for goal, not an ideal we actually live up to day to day. So I'm hoping we can come to some sort of arrangement that's true to our own reality and that makes identity politics a none issue. I know it sounds like a dream but hey, niwache niote tafadhali, simzui mwengine asiyependa ndoto zakitumaini!

Rule of law is easier to enforce now with the autonomous judiciary. The High Court just ordered CA to restore media airwaves pending a full hearing of their alleged security breaches. Kajwang and those arrested have rights of the accused against the state. We are better than before.

Devolution was meant to reduce the tribalism/identity maneno. Secession or partition cannot happen without bloodshed - you'd be hard pressed to point to any such history. The proponents in NASA mean to use it as a bargain chip for more devolution. Some of us agree that international standards of federalism are 60-40% revenue division - in the US, Germany, Canada, SA, etc.

[Kichwa]

Robina, wacha zako, secession has happened without bloodshed like in the old Soviet Union.  But even if there were no examples, that does not mean it cannot happen. You are creating rules and laws which are not written anywhere except self serving to scare away those agitating for freedom. Zimbabwe just ousted a president without violence.  The models you are describing are old. Violence is not the only means to achieve change.  We in NASA believe we do not need an armed conflict to secede or bring about fundamental changes to this country.  Armed conflict does not guarantee sustainable changes because the intellectuals and statesmen have to cede power to the gunmen and their commanders in the bush and when they take over they usually end up as dictators after committing a lot of atrocities during the war. It is very costly in human life but does guarantee reform-Uganda and Rwanda are good examples.  The best way to reform a country like Kenya is through peaceful but forceful and effective resistance. Let them arrest Raila and see how that changes anything. They will never know peace until they change or we secede peacefully. 

Empo, Jubilee alone wields the rungu.

Kanu orphans.. Raila was an intruder, a cunning shamba boy, not a child of the home.

I agree with you. At least you are fair. Empedocles has been trying to make this "Raila is the same" argument for eons using nothing but the time he joined KANU for really just a stint. Because that's really all anyone can find.

You argue that Raila has loser morals than Kanu. I don't disagree. He was with them but not of them 

What does Kichwa make of all this?

I have a feeling from what you say here and above that you meant to say "I disagree" or "I don't agree" and somehow mixed them up. Am I wrong?

I meant Raila is not a Kanu orphan, you're right it was a typo.

You are right. This is not about the law any more. NASA argue that the law is now just a rungu in the hands of an opponent on an unfair playing field. I agree with them. But I don't personally get what the swearing in is/was about. Me, personally? I just want people to get serious about a people driven movement for secession talks without violence. I am waiting for the point at which this will be possible once the steam is out ears and hubris has been beaten out of chests by men all around. Without a serious threat for secession (without violence, I repeat) there will be no restructuring.

Another thing, Africans need to learn that the ideal of Law is a bazungu ideal. It has not yet sunk enough in our culture to become truly ours. It's still a hoped for goal, not an ideal we actually live up to day to day. So I'm hoping we can come to some sort of arrangement that's true to our own reality and that makes identity politics a none issue. I know it sounds like a dream but hey, niwache niote tafadhali, simzui mwengine asiyependa ndoto zakitumaini!

Rule of law is easier to enforce now with the autonomous judiciary. The High Court just ordered CA to restore media airwaves pending a full hearing of their alleged security breaches. Kajwang and those arrested have rights of the accused against the state. We are better than before.

Devolution was meant to reduce the tribalism/identity maneno. Secession or partition cannot happen without bloodshed - you'd be hard pressed to point to any such history. The proponents in NASA mean to use it as a bargain chip for more devolution. Some of us agree that international standards of federalism are 60-40% revenue division - in the US, Germany, Canada, SA, etc.