Shocking discovery (for me at least): the Gatundu Oaths

[Kadame6]

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Now I understand the genesis of uthamaki, railaphobia and the "shall never be president" vow we have all seen/heard everywhere in some form: the Gatundu oaths

When I first heard of this I thought it was a joke, exaggeration, fake news, conspiracy theory...you name it. It was obvious it couldnt be true...except it is!

https://www.google.lu/amp/s/waanglicana.wordpress.com/2017/01/03/the-spell-of-gatundu-oaths/amp/

https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/mobile/article/2000227153

Kenyatta was a bad person. I can imagine thousands of Kikuyus being forcefully made to take that oath. Apparently those who did don't talk about it under almost any circumstances, only passing on the idea that certain people cannot be for this that or the other. They are in their late sixties now.

[Kadame6]

A Times article reporting on the phenomenon back when it was happening in 1969: http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,901233,00.html

[Kadame6]

lol it is the kenyans voters stupid.. do not blame oaths.. the tribalism exhibited in both camps is what is killing Kenya young democracy

Take your uncouthe behaviour elsewhere. For a new member you sure exhibit bad behaviour on your first day. Ata huna aibu.

Take your time to study the culture of this forum and how people talk to each other here even in disagreements. This is not a toilet.

If you are uninterested in the articles, you can also go elsewhere. You dont have to troll.

[KenyanPlato]

I read your articles. They are cannot explain what is happening now. Uhuru and Ruto are young. The voters are young. Uhuru and Ruto have recruited young kikuyus in their administration to do the PR work for them. Uhuru and Ruto have the instruments of power to be able to cajole and bully their opponents that how they got the support in opposition strongholds.

Why are you calling me a troll just because I think your conclusion is wrong and I said it. I am not new check when I registered this handle. I lurk here reading debates. so I know you as well as you know yourself.
You are bitter

[Kadame6]

I read your articles. They are cannot explain what is happening now. Uhuru and Ruto are young. The voters are young. Uhuru and Ruto have recruited young kikuyus in their administration to do the PR work for them. Uhuru and Ruto have the instruments of power to be able to cajole and bully their opponents that how they got the support in opposition strongholds.

Why are you calling me a troll just because I think your conclusion is wrong and I said it. I am not new check when I registered this handle. I lurk here reading debates. so I know you as well as you know yourself.
You are bitter

A troll starts his comment with "stupid"...thats why. And you dont know me. Thats dumb.

[KenyanPlato]

really.. in politics we say it is economy stupid that what I meant.. it is tribalism stupid that is giving us a headache. You misunderstood me. I know you as a prolific debater here. I will recuse myself from all your threads. Deal?

[Kadame6]

really.. in politics we say it is economy stupid that what I meant.. it is tribalism stupid that is giving us a headache. You misunderstood me. I know you as a prolific debater here. I will recuse myself from all your threads. Deal?

Please do.

[GeeMail]

I frankly thought there had been anothet round of oathing 2017. Or was there? Rev Gatu did the right thing to expose uthamakism. Kumbe they told Jomo off and survived? I disagree with Canon Omondi's conclusion. That Uhuru is the only one who can change things. Thanks Kadame6,

[Kadame6]

I frankly thought there had been anothet round of oathing 2017. Or was there? Rev Gatu did the right thing to expose uthamakism. Kumbe they told Jomo off and survived? I disagree with Canon Omondi's conclusion. That Uhuru is the only one who can change things. Thanks Kadame6,

No, not in 2017 but I heard on a podcast that this same talk was revived by a group of Kyuks to rally the community around Uhuru when ICC came calling. Previously, Uhuru had been unelectable. I mentioned this only because I had no idea that tribalism was deliberately orchestrated and set up Kyuks against the rest in many peoples minds because of Kenyatta's actions. I understand it is this same group that was oathed, now in their sixties who have indoctrinated younger generations with Nyanzaphobia which is turned on anyone who seems like a threat. The rest of the country has developed their own tribalism as well as Kikuyu phobia in response. I was just so suprised to realize this was delibertely crafted by a few people.

[Emali]

Good topic...

Our politics personifies the adage 'behind every great fortune their is a great crime'...the 'voting as a block' is driven by this.The Gikuyu's crime is aptly stated by Rev Gatu, the Kalenjin crime is the tribal clashes of 1991 whose genesis has never been fully explained(it was not spontaneous) and the Luo have been victims since independence and coalesced as a consequence.

Its no wonder no other tribes vote as a block because its simply not possible without a strong external unifying factor, I remember shortly after the last elections mysterious clashes were reported in Bungoma with heavy casualties...was it an outside force trying to get Luhya's into the block mentality? I dont know but clearly alot of our political history is hidden to protect the status quo

[bryan275]

I frankly thought there had been anothet round of oathing 2017. Or was there? Rev Gatu did the right thing to expose uthamakism. Kumbe they told Jomo off and survived? I disagree with Canon Omondi's conclusion. That Uhuru is the only one who can change things. Thanks Kadame6,

No, not in 2017 but I heard on a podcast that this same talk was revived by a group of Kyuks to rally the community around Uhuru when ICC came calling. Previously, Uhuru had been unelectable. I mentioned this only because I had no idea that tribalism was deliberately orchestrated and set up Kyuks against the rest in many peoples minds because of Kenyatta's actions. I understand it is this same group that was oathed, now in their sixties who have indoctrinated younger generations with Nyanzaphobia which is turned on anyone who seems like a threat. The rest of the country has developed their own tribalism as well as Kikuyu phobia in response. I was just so suprised to realize this was delibertely crafted by a few people.

That indoctrination is very effective.  Last week, I met up with some friends for after work drinks.  These are professionals in the finance field in London and being august 8 the we discussed the elections etc.  Results were streaming in by then and Uhuru was opening up a massive lead. 

One of the ladies (born in 78) bought a round in honour of a Uhuru victory, and declared rather loudly "If Odinga wins, we're all dead!".    I asked why, and she couldn't explain ,just that is a well known fact that we'll all die.

Very odd.

[Omollo]

Kenya lay claim to stability ahead of her time. Various issues have not been addressed and cohabitation is therefore founded on a sandy foundation.

Like every stable country, Kenya has to undergo a civil war. Thankfully we are moving towards it seamlessly. It will last 100 years or more since the country is relatively wealthy and it will take time to deplete its own and external resources brought in by various factions.

Somalia's war started around 1987 and as of now has lasted 30 years and shows no sign of ending any time soon. Yet it had as many resources as the poorest county in Kenya.

I already see the last indicator/ trigger : ALL or majority agree that the solution to the problems of Kenya is to go to war!

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

I frankly thought there had been anothet round of oathing 2017. Or was there? Rev Gatu did the right thing to expose uthamakism. Kumbe they told Jomo off and survived? I disagree with Canon Omondi's conclusion. That Uhuru is the only one who can change things. Thanks Kadame6,

No, not in 2017 but I heard on a podcast that this same talk was revived by a group of Kyuks to rally the community around Uhuru when ICC came calling. Previously, Uhuru had been unelectable. I mentioned this only because I had no idea that tribalism was deliberately orchestrated and set up Kyuks against the rest in many peoples minds because of Kenyatta's actions. I understand it is this same group that was oathed, now in their sixties who have indoctrinated younger generations with Nyanzaphobia which is turned on anyone who seems like a threat. The rest of the country has developed their own tribalism as well as Kikuyu phobia in response. I was just so suprised to realize this was delibertely crafted by a few people.

That indoctrination is very effective.  Last week, I met up with some friends for after work drinks.  These are professionals in the finance field in London and being august 8 the we discussed the elections etc.  Results were streaming in by then and Uhuru was opening up a massive lead. 

One of the ladies (born in 78) bought a round in honour of a Uhuru victory, and declared rather loudly "If Odinga wins, we're all dead!".    I asked why, and she couldn't explain ,just that is a well known fact that we'll all die.

Very odd.

And tribal stereotypes flow very easily from such people's tongue.  It's almost completely mindless.  It doesn't come from mother's milk, but it's very close.  I have met people who would only walk between others walking in the opposite direction on the pain of death, no matter how ridiculous it is to try and avoid.  I think the tribalism you see in some Kenyans is like that.  It's just something everyone around assumes is true.

[MOON Ki]

One of the ladies (born in 78) bought a round in honour of a Uhuru victory, and declared rather loudly "If Odinga wins, we're all dead!".    I asked why, and she couldn't explain ,just that is a well known fact that we'll all die.

And wearing shorts into the grave.     

[Kadame6]

Good topic...

Our politics personifies the adage 'behind every great fortune their is a great crime'...the 'voting as a block' is driven by this.The Gikuyu's crime is aptly stated by Rev Gatu, the Kalenjin crime is the tribal clashes of 1991 whose genesis has never been fully explained(it was not spontaneous) and the Luo have been victims since independence and coalesced as a consequence.

Its no wonder no other tribes vote as a block because its simply not possible without a strong external unifying factor, I remember shortly after the last elections mysterious clashes were reported in Bungoma with heavy casualties...was it an outside force trying to get Luhya's into the block mentality? I dont know but clearly alot of our political history is hidden to protect the status quo

This is it. Mkoloni gave as a unifying factor, one Kenyatta squandered with his power grabs, wealth grabs and creating uthamakism to protect them. Moi's bad rule gave us another unifying factor but Kibaki proceeded to squander that as well rather than grab the opportunity to forge a genuine new nationalism. I dont know what unifying factor will come again next. Maybe desperate levels of poverty. A big chunk of Kenya is already feeling less and less Kenyan with every election, slowly disociating because leaders have failed to create nationalism. I only pray something happens to bring us together and that whoever is in charge doesnt squander it again.