Author Topic: Final Comments on Elections 2017  (Read 6204 times)

Offline Kichwa

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #20 on: August 09, 2017, 10:15:20 PM »
Moon Ki, I think I have always been  in agreement with your diagnosis of what ails Kenya.  What I have not been able to discern is your prescription. As for me, I think you have to keep on fighting the beast until one day it exposes its soft underbelly.  Giving up is not an option for some of us.

MoonKi before you go away and make final comments I'd really like to know your view on the Form 34A debacle. Here is a case where IEBC has announced results on its website and is well on its way to declaring a winner. Then we are being informed not all form34As are in. In fact it seems they are still being signed. Do you remember the thread on the court case precisely tackling the issue of ROs and the role of Chebukati in Bomas? We thought it was wise of the courts to make the ROs results count and not Chebukati's gymnastics at Bomas. Now results are being declared without forms 34A. What is your final feeling on this? Is IEBC not working backwards instead? What is this indicative of?

I started to write a long response but then decided to "cross it out".   Instead, I will tell you a little (true) story.

Little (true) story: I have heard of or read from many Kenyans, at all levels, complaining endlessly---and quite rightly too---about the pervasive corruption in our country.   Raila and his buddies have made endless noises about it.   Even H.E. Uhuru has not been left out: he has, in public, wrung his hands and exclaimed "Too much!  But, ngai!, nitafanya nini?".  Now, I remember looking at photos from an "anti-corruption demonstration" last year---smack in the middle of yet another huge scandal---and counting only about 30 people.    And something like half of that "crowd" consisted Boniface Mwangi and other NGO types on their day-job.  End of Little (true) story.   

Getting back to your "request": Has there been some mischief in these elections?  It's Kenya;  I'd be astonished if there wasn't.     Has the IEBC been involved?   Quite possible.    But here's a question for you:

What are the signs out there that Kenyans really give a f**k about this Form 34A or, indeed, anything that they see as problematic in the tallying process, or a lack of transparency and integrity, or ... whatever?

Kichwa writes of a total-liberation struggle against a ruthless beast.  I am an upright citizen, so any struggle for total liberation will always have my full support.  And especially so when it's against a ruthless beast.   Sadly, however, nobody in Kenya is engaged in anything of the sort.   Kenya is a country that is slowly going to the dogs, with the "next generation" (a.k.a the "youth") mostly preoccupied with "hustling" (the males) or being "sponsored" (the females).   Most of the rest appear to be no more that clueless, tribal sheeple.   That, by the way, is a partial explanation for the support that the "ruthless beast" has from millions and millions.

"This too shall pass" or "Kazi iendelee".   Your pick.  When Kenyans get ready, they will be ready.   Nothing to do with Form 123-ABC.

A final word or two:


"I have done my job and I will not change anything dead or a live" Malonza

Offline MOON Ki

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #21 on: August 09, 2017, 10:33:30 PM »
Moon Ki, I think I have always been  in agreement with your diagnosis of what ails Kenya.  What I have not been able to discern is your prescription. As for me, I think you have to keep on fighting the beast until one day it exposes its soft underbelly.  Giving up is not an option for some of us.

We could discuss that, and I'd be happy to do so---after the present dust has settled down and with a long-term view---but, first, what can we learn from Little (True) Stories? To my mind, therein lies the key.
MOON Ki  is  Muli Otieno Otiende Njoroge arap Kiprotich
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Offline MOON Ki

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #22 on: August 09, 2017, 11:47:50 PM »
Moon Ki, I think I have always been  in agreement with your diagnosis of what ails Kenya.  What I have not been able to discern is your prescription. As for me, I think you have to keep on fighting the beast until one day it exposes its soft underbelly.  Giving up is not an option for some of us.

We could discuss that, and I'd be happy to do so---after the present dust has settled down and with a long-term view---but, first, what can we learn from Little (True) Stories? To my mind, therein lies the key.  Horse-to-water and that sort of thing ...

Oh, I've just been looking at Uncle Sam's projections on "food security" in Kenya.  (I'd like to believe that what's in the belly is something that most people take seriously.)   Things look grim heading into 2018, but do the natives show it?  "Our Man for the Eating Position!" and then ...   "International community, saidia please."  (I will later, in early 2018, quote this "post".  In the meantime, all to enjoy SGR, laptops-for-toddlers, M-Akiba, and what-not.)

Prescription?  Perhaps Evolution?
MOON Ki  is  Muli Otieno Otiende Njoroge arap Kiprotich
Your True Friend, Brother,  and  Compatriot.

Offline Kichwa

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #23 on: August 09, 2017, 11:58:33 PM »
I have heard something like that from a few folks.  They say, "step aside and wait until wanjiku cannot take it anymore.  I do not know about that but it ought to be Plan D or when all fails.

Moon Ki, I think I have always been  in agreement with your diagnosis of what ails Kenya.  What I have not been able to discern is your prescription. As for me, I think you have to keep on fighting the beast until one day it exposes its soft underbelly.  Giving up is not an option for some of us.

We could discuss that, and I'd be happy to do so---after the present dust has settled down and with a long-term view---but, first, what can we learn from Little (True) Stories? To my mind, therein lies the key.

Oh, I've just been looking at Uncle Sam's projections on "food security" in Kenya.  (I'd like to believe that what's in the belly is something that most people take seriously.)   Things look grim heading into 2018, but do the natives show it?  "Our Man for the Eating Position!" and then ...   "International community, siadia please."  (I will later, in early 2018, quote this "post".  In the meantime, all to enjoy SGR, M-Akiba, and what-not.)

Prescription?  Perhaps Evolution?
"I have done my job and I will not change anything dead or a live" Malonza

Offline Globalcitizen12

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #24 on: August 10, 2017, 12:05:26 AM »
I got told off the other day when I asked a friend what the use of lining up for 4 hours when we know nothing will change.

Offline Kichwa

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #25 on: August 10, 2017, 12:13:15 AM »
I agree with your friend.  MOAS and Tyranny of numbers are designed to maintain status quo. They are the enemies of democracy because people start to think of change through other means.


I got told off the other day when I asked a friend what the use of lining up for 4 hours when we know nothing will change.
"I have done my job and I will not change anything dead or a live" Malonza

Offline MOON Ki

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #26 on: August 10, 2017, 12:32:35 AM »
I have heard something like that from a few folks.  They say, "step aside and wait until wanjiku cannot take it anymore.  I do not know about that but it ought to be Plan D or when all fails.

And the "few folks" have a point: history.    Plans B, C and D---whether it's about food or anything else--are always left to the wazungus and other "do-good" foreigners.  (Are Kenyans right now really thinking about how they will feed themselves next year?)

Fortunately for us, the wazungus et. al. are always keen to have at least one "success story" on the "Dark Continent"---some of their citizens even demand to know where their hard-earned is going---and we Kenyans have always been a good candidate for that.   Island in an ocean of mindless mayhem and so forth.   We've been dining out on that for a very long time, and we can still count on it ... must do something in Africa?   Ah, Kenya, the old reliable.  We then wank about how great we are etc.

"Wanjiku":  stellar exemplar of clueless, tribal sheepishness; proven sucker for punishment; or just a silly myth.   So, no "Arab Spring" stuff to worry about South Of The Border. 

Uhuru and his Singh sidekick had something else in mind with their "accept and move on", but, in the broader scheme of things, it was actually excellent advice: Kenyans are always being robbed by their "leaders", have all sorts of sh*t piled on their heads, and so on.   Why not just "accept", as indeed they do, until there is a ready response to "mta do?".   
MOON Ki  is  Muli Otieno Otiende Njoroge arap Kiprotich
Your True Friend, Brother,  and  Compatriot.

Offline gout

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #27 on: August 10, 2017, 01:03:02 AM »
It is not we don't aspire for which has the basics but heck even US is on Obamacare details!  Kivutha already reelected has delivered and Sonko(my choice) have promised universal health cover . Msidhani ati makanga hawana akili.
Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one ~ Thomas Paine

Offline MOON Ki

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #28 on: August 10, 2017, 01:22:24 AM »
It is not we don't aspire for which has the basics but heck even US is on Obamacare details!  Kivutha already reelected has delivered and Sonko(my choice) have promised universal health cover . Msidhani ati makanga hawana akili.

Parsing that one--even the bit that appears to be in English---was not easy.  The interpretation took much more time.  But I think I got the general idea.   

Comparisons with the USA, eh?   Interesting.    Tempting, but too easy; I'll skip it.

I'm sure Nairobians will greatly benefit from Sonko's "universal health cover".    Kindly "post"  the details here when they are available.

Makanga.    No comment necessary, I think.     
MOON Ki  is  Muli Otieno Otiende Njoroge arap Kiprotich
Your True Friend, Brother,  and  Compatriot.

Offline Globalcitizen12

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #29 on: August 10, 2017, 02:13:17 AM »
I agree with your friend.  MOAS and Tyranny of numbers are designed to maintain status quo. They are the enemies of democracy because people start to think of change through other means.


I got told off the other day when I asked a friend what the use of lining up for 4 hours when we know nothing will change.
You got this wrong Kichwa. The person was in line to vote for dynamic duo. Not because they would deliver but to fulfill God's Will and to stop an evil man Raila for unleashing his Antichrist agenda. I have crazy friend you may say but sometimes friends choose you. I have another jobless acquaintance a very caring individual but cannot connect her unemployment to bad governance to her politics is politics and it just that then there is life out of it.

Everyone in Kenya cops out. On tribalism we point fingers at politicians as if these politicians are manufactured robots and not products of our own upbringing. When we kill we blame politicians for incitement. There is a copout for everything.. When I pressed this friend on matters pointing contradictions on her own line of think she resulted now to quote "God Will"again insinuating that NASA was not going to win because God had ordained so.. Now with Flawed result it is God has saved us from a lunatic..

We as a people need to have a national dialogue on what we have done to each other. We need to atone. I need to atone for my sometimes outbursts against Kalenjins. It out of hate and hurt that I do so.


You see moonki is thinking there is a day wanjiku will wakeup or face the music. The day is now and here. Wanjiku is scared shit of her own shadow. She ran away to the countryside to flee from her own madness and mayhem. Those men, women, children taking buses up country were running away from their own monster. From their own shadows. it is tragic when you think about.You see hate has the biggest buyers remorse right now NASA and jubilee supporters are wondering how did we get into this hate. How do we end it so that I can smile at Mama Otieno again without having doubts she gonna smile back.

I will share my solution when I gather my thoughts. One of the things we need to do is look for national values that everyone agree are important and then we promote the hella out of these values.

 You see moi had a good idea of promoting peace love and unity for a while we agreed with him and made peace and unity a cornerstone of our nation building. May be now we can try integrity and justice. Once there is integrity everything falls in place.

As I told my Kenya coworker to expect clean elections from Kenya society is to expect miracles. Right now our number one sport is corruption so how do you expect to build a 58 billion system based on integrity. the who electoral process is built  on quicksand. It didn't take long before our expensive project sunk.

IEBC Chebukati and chiloba are not miracle workers nor are they there to fix a sick rotten society. I would say to the political elite take your electoral shit elsewhere. Dr mutunga said shit like petitions belong in shit rooms coz no decent human should deal with that bile of shit. Chiloba and chebukati should announce these results and tell the political class to go fuck a donkey somewhere away from him

Kichwa I know as Luo you all you want is for process to be fair and free. You want vindication. Pyschologically it must be very difficult to be a Luo in Kenya. Being victimized always and mocked must take a toll. My brother I sympathize with your situation and I hope I could right all the wrongs done to your people. Right now we need to accept that this thing is hopeless continue to work on each till we one day we unite as a people to pursue the greater good in the interest of humanity.

NASA has millions and a diverse support base that alone should make everyone proud.

The problem is that with a system like Kenya it can turn the most humble and meek men like Kalonzo to monsters. You can see he is frustrated beyond measure. he is at the breaking point.



Offline mya88

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #30 on: August 10, 2017, 02:33:33 AM »
It is not we don't aspire for which has the basics but heck even US is on Obamacare details!  Kivutha already reelected has delivered and Sonko(my choice) have promised universal health cover . Msidhani ati makanga hawana akili.
The irony......I don't know whether to laugh or cry as I currently enjoy my obamacare. Anyway, makanga wamenena. :D Lets wait another five years (is it 5 or 4, I dont even care to know anymore) and see, now that even Kenyan doctors are colluding with Indian doctors to cone sick Kenyans plagued with cancer........food scarcity, .....education, ...infant mortality.... jobs....which basics were you taking about again?
"We must be the change we wish to see" - Mahatma Ghandi

Offline Kichwa

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #31 on: August 10, 2017, 04:26:38 AM »
Globalcitizen.  Got you.  I do not think we have fully internalized the connection between government policy and our lives. This is why Waiguru stole money from government and was just given mandate by the people to run their county government. It has nothing to do with tribalism.  Its just that we see politics the way we see  sports teams. Our lives do not change when our sports teams win or lose and that's how we see politics in Kenya. However politics do change lives. Kenya is a politicians paradise because all people care about is whether one's team is in power or not-nothing else.

Last but not least, I do not believe my luoness is a burden to me just  because once again Raila was rigged out.  Tomorrow most rabid ouruto supporters will not notice any change in their lives other than the high one gets when your sports team win then you wait for the next season and in between you brag about your team.  You would wish politics would mean more than that.




I agree with your friend.  MOAS and Tyranny of numbers are designed to maintain status quo. They are the enemies of democracy because people start to think of change through other means.


I got told off the other day when I asked a friend what the use of lining up for 4 hours when we know nothing will change.
You got this wrong Kichwa. The person was in line to vote for dynamic duo. Not because they would deliver but to fulfill God's Will and to stop an evil man Raila for unleashing his Antichrist agenda. I have crazy friend you may say but sometimes friends choose you. I have another jobless acquaintance a very caring individual but cannot connect her unemployment to bad governance to her politics is politics and it just that then there is life out of it.

Everyone in Kenya cops out. On tribalism we point fingers at politicians as if these politicians are manufactured robots and not products of our own upbringing. When we kill we blame politicians for incitement. There is a copout for everything.. When I pressed this friend on matters pointing contradictions on her own line of think she resulted now to quote "God Will"again insinuating that NASA was not going to win because God had ordained so.. Now with Flawed result it is God has saved us from a lunatic..

We as a people need to have a national dialogue on what we have done to each other. We need to atone. I need to atone for my sometimes outbursts against Kalenjins. It out of hate and hurt that I do so.


You see moonki is thinking there is a day wanjiku will wakeup or face the music. The day is now and here. Wanjiku is scared shit of her own shadow. She ran away to the countryside to flee from her own madness and mayhem. Those men, women, children taking buses up country were running away from their own monster. From their own shadows. it is tragic when you think about.You see hate has the biggest buyers remorse right now NASA and jubilee supporters are wondering how did we get into this hate. How do we end it so that I can smile at Mama Otieno again without having doubts she gonna smile back.

I will share my solution when I gather my thoughts. One of the things we need to do is look for national values that everyone agree are important and then we promote the hella out of these values.

 You see moi had a good idea of promoting peace love and unity for a while we agreed with him and made peace and unity a cornerstone of our nation building. May be now we can try integrity and justice. Once there is integrity everything falls in place.

As I told my Kenya coworker to expect clean elections from Kenya society is to expect miracles. Right now our number one sport is corruption so how do you expect to build a 58 billion system based on integrity. the who electoral process is built  on quicksand. It didn't take long before our expensive project sunk.

IEBC Chebukati and chiloba are not miracle workers nor are they there to fix a sick rotten society. I would say to the political elite take your electoral shit elsewhere. Dr mutunga said shit like petitions belong in shit rooms coz no decent human should deal with that bile of shit. Chiloba and chebukati should announce these results and tell the political class to go fuck a donkey somewhere away from him

Kichwa I know as Luo you all you want is for process to be fair and free. You want vindication. Pyschologically it must be very difficult to be a Luo in Kenya. Being victimized always and mocked must take a toll. My brother I sympathize with your situation and I hope I could right all the wrongs done to your people. Right now we need to accept that this thing is hopeless continue to work on each till we one day we unite as a people to pursue the greater good in the interest of humanity.

NASA has millions and a diverse support base that alone should make everyone proud.

The problem is that with a system like Kenya it can turn the most humble and meek men like Kalonzo to monsters. You can see he is frustrated beyond measure. he is at the breaking point.
"I have done my job and I will not change anything dead or a live" Malonza

Offline Kadame6

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #32 on: August 10, 2017, 07:29:57 AM »
Global, I agree with you 100%. Thanks for that.

Kichwa, you nailed it. Politics is our national sport. Its not the way we chose to improve our living conditions, or end poverty, famine, deaths from simple and easily treatable conditions.

Mya88, we missed you! Glad to see you back. :)

Offline Kadame6

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #33 on: August 10, 2017, 07:38:30 AM »
Me, I think that unfair as it is, the best Raila can do for us now is leave politics. The propaganda done to demonize him in a segment of our population is effective. He is to them how Americans see Putin. This only helps obscure the discussion of issues.

If the big " demon" is no longer in the picture, perhaps people may have a chance to scrutinize what their leaders are actually saying and doing as it affects them. It also doesnt help that we have sooo many uneducated folk who simply dont have the means to inform themselves any better.

I say this with a lot of doubt myself because I saw how the demonization project started in Kibaki's first term and continued having made worse be the 2007 PEV. I am afraid that anyone who emerges who will seem to be a genuine threat to the "mafia" will face the same treatment. And why not? It has proved very effective. So I'm just propping my hope up, its all I can do at the moment.

Offline GeeMail

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #34 on: August 10, 2017, 08:54:22 AM »
MoonKi thanks for the response. Of all the high sounding academic solutions intellectuals may offer, what is in the hands of ordinary Kenyans now is to reject fraudulent election results and government by thievery. Can you imagine tgat ten years after 2007 the government can do the same thing? The obsession with stopping Raila at all costs has cost Kenya so much. It is good to make high sounding policy strategies but what is in the hands of ordinary Kenyans is the rejection of fraudulent elections. It is a very costly affair but probably cheaper than living with thievery for another five years. It means the hope Kenyans have is when God touches the hearts of the main thieves in power. This is possible.
Celebratory violence: 2017 crime invented to justify killings to prevent Raila from becoming PORK. http://www.nipate.com/download/file.php?id=4244

Offline Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #35 on: August 10, 2017, 11:23:37 AM »
I heard Kirinyaga voted Waiguru after she promised she won't steal from them.
"I freed a thousand slaves.  I could have freed a thousand more if only they knew they were slaves."

Harriet Tubman

Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #36 on: August 10, 2017, 11:35:57 AM »
Your real God is in trouble I see and you want to she'd blood.Eti reject result.How?
MoonKi thanks for the response. Of all the high sounding academic solutions intellectuals may offer, what is in the hands of ordinary Kenyans now is to reject fraudulent election results and government by thievery. Can you imagine tgat ten years after 2007 the government can do the same thing? The obsession with stopping Raila at all costs has cost Kenya so much. It is good to make high sounding policy strategies but what is in the hands of ordinary Kenyans is the rejection of fraudulent elections. It is a very costly affair but probably cheaper than living with thievery for another five years. It means the hope Kenyans have is when God touches the hearts of the main thieves in power. This is possible.

Offline GeeMail

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #37 on: August 10, 2017, 01:17:36 PM »
You rejected NASA campaigns, statistical projections, opinion polls and even their anti-rigging plans. Then you brought apartheid regime green marias and violent police to the streets after what happened at Bomas. And you dare call others violent? You think you are the only one who has the capacity to reject?
Celebratory violence: 2017 crime invented to justify killings to prevent Raila from becoming PORK. http://www.nipate.com/download/file.php?id=4244

Offline mya88

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #38 on: August 10, 2017, 11:18:50 PM »
Me, I think that unfair as it is, the best Raila can do for us now is leave politics. The propaganda done to demonize him in a segment of our population is effective. He is to them how Americans see Putin. This only helps obscure the discussion of issues.

If the big " demon" is no longer in the picture, perhaps people may have a chance to scrutinize what their leaders are actually saying and doing as it affects them. It also doesnt help that we have sooo many uneducated folk who simply dont have the means to inform themselves any better.

I say this with a lot of doubt myself because I saw how the demonization project started in Kibaki's first term and continued having made worse be the 2007 PEV. I am afraid that anyone who emerges who will seem to be a genuine threat to the "mafia" will face the same treatment. And why not? It has proved very effective. So I'm just propping my hope up, its all I can do at the moment.

Kabebe thanks, noted above. Missed you too.
I beg to differ abit, the other sides view Raila the way Democrats view trump or whoever the Republican candidate is at any given time, only problem is like you later stated......we have uneducated folks being fed fodder by a few elites who care nothing about the country. Raila going away will not bring change in Kenya...infact we need a Raila or anyone else with enough balls to keep the current government in check so we dont end up like other nations where the mwananchi really cannot speak about the government. The mafia will stay in power until the day hunger hits so bad kenyans get fed up. I dont think we are there yet. Nations like Ghana have matured a bit and are not as obsessed about tribe as we are. Me personally I dont care who governs, as long as they bring us back to a level we once were. Right now Kenya is like a shadow of its former self.
"We must be the change we wish to see" - Mahatma Ghandi

Offline MOON Ki

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Re: Final Comments on Elections 2017
« Reply #39 on: August 11, 2017, 12:42:56 AM »
MoonKi thanks for the response. Of all the high sounding academic solutions intellectuals may offer, what is in the hands of ordinary Kenyans now is to reject fraudulent election results and government by thievery. Can you imagine tgat ten years after 2007 the government can do the same thing? The obsession with stopping Raila at all costs has cost Kenya so much. It is good to make high sounding policy strategies but what is in the hands of ordinary Kenyans is the rejection of fraudulent elections. It is a very costly affair but probably cheaper than living with thievery for another five years. It means the hope Kenyans have is when God touches the hearts of the main thieves in power. This is possible.

No problem, ndugu/dada.     By the way, the half-arsed "anti-corruption demonstration" that I mentioned was in Nairobi, a city of millions ... during "lunch break", in a place full of idlers.   So, what gets the makanga (and their akili) to show up in droves?  Not the lack of proper government services (for which taxes are paid), or the prices of anything, or ... or the fact they are generally having a rough life of it.  This should give you some idea of what's considered what's-what:


(Just what it is that they think they will get to do, or even just see, is far from clear.)

At the end of the day, the "ordinary Kenyans" will indeed have to make their own decisions.  Whenever they are ready.  Right now they are getting rear-end tarimbo and applauding the act.   
MOON Ki  is  Muli Otieno Otiende Njoroge arap Kiprotich
Your True Friend, Brother,  and  Compatriot.