Finally instant fines for petty traffic offences

[RV Pundit]

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http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Instant-fines-payment-for-traffic-offences-starts/539546-3405182-xo4yso/index.html

[RVtitem]

http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Instant-fines-payment-for-traffic-offences-starts/539546-3405182-xo4yso/index.html

This will definitely reduce congestion in courtrooms.

However, corruption might increase out there perpetrated by police.

[RV Pundit]

Yeah some of the major causes of judicial backlog are these petty traffic and drunk & disorderly cases...that should never get to any serious court in the first places.

I don't see how corruption will increase.  It will actually reduce. Most people dread been take to police stations cells, wasting two days in the cell and court, and eventually paying 500shs for some of those offence.

With this...if cops find you overspeeding by 10k - why waste time with cop - when you can just m-pesa the fine?

If gov was serious they would ensure all the fines are reasonable (10k fine is too much for our economy) and they'll get billions of shs.

All you need to do is to conduct a national survey on the average bribe paid for each of those offence...and make that fine. If the fine is too much (risk-reward matrix)..people will opt to bribe.

This will definitely reduce congestion in courtrooms.

However, corruption might increase out there perpetrated by police.

[RV Pundit]

Should I add that this yet another example of m-pesa revolution that is underway. Without m-pesa these would have been messy cash receipt more corruption system.

[Georgesoros]

Yes 10k is excessive amd punitive. Does one have the option of going to court, if not the govt is taking the role of the judiciary.

Yeah some of the major causes of judicial backlog are these petty traffic and drunk & disorderly cases...that should never get to any serious court in the first places.

I don't see how corruption will increase.  It will actually reduce. Most people dread been take to police stations cells, wasting two days in the cell and court, and eventually paying 500shs for some of those offence.

With this...if cops find you overspeeding by 10k - why waste time with cop - when you can just m-pesa the fine?

If gov was serious they would ensure all the fines are reasonable (10k fine is too much for our economy) and they'll get billions of shs.

All you need to do is to conduct a national survey on the average bribe paid for each of those offence...and make that fine. If the fine is too much (risk-reward matrix)..people will opt to bribe.

This will definitely reduce congestion in courtrooms.

However, corruption might increase out there perpetrated by police.

[RV Pundit]

Our mps need to reduce fines...otherwise pple will bribe the cops. You've an option of going for a protracted court battle.

Yes 10k is excessive amd punitive. Does one have the option of going to court, if not the govt is taking the role of the judiciary.

[Empedocles]

Should I add that this yet another example of m-pesa revolution that is underway. Without m-pesa these would have been messy cash receipt more corruption system.

Not quite. In Germany, for example, the cops happily take credit/debit cards.

All you need to do is to conduct a national survey on the average bribe paid for each of those offence...and make that fine. If the fine is too much (risk-reward matrix)..people will opt to bribe.

Sound reasonable but very unfortunately absolutely not feasible in our society at the moment.

If the fine is deemed low, people will happily pay the fine and zoom off.
If the fine is deemed high, people will happily pay the bribe and zoom off.

So the amount of the fine is not the problem.

[MOON Ki]

Sound reasonable but very unfortunately absolutely not feasible in our society at the moment.

There is no average of standard in Kenya; the figures seem to vary by place, day of the month, how much one has on hand, etc.   Maybe technology could help here: coppers all over the country transmit the bribe-amount-for-today to some central GoK point, someone computes the fine for that day and location, ....  Or the Central GoK point could just tell them to knock it off.     

If the fine is deemed low, people will happily pay the fine and zoom off.
If the fine is deemed high, people will happily pay the bribe and zoom off.

Exactly.    It's incredible to see some Kenyans sold on the idea that technology will somehow make up for the hard work that needs to be done on fundamentals.    Something like the IFMIS was supposed to make up for a lack of morals and a fondness for theft and deceit.  And?    Today we have "Prof. Dr." (soon to be "Sir") Mutahi Ngunyi tell us that a payment that was apparently forced down his throat through "25 levels" .... Still, not as good as the one abut a password being stolen and used in the middle of the night.   

[RV Pundit]

Isn't why they were found them (IFMIS) and their money frozen. Imagine a paper system. I can tell you from real experience we have gone through cash to m-pesa and reduced fraud by several factors. The purpose of fine is to make it punitive enough but not over do it (like USA) that it become incentive to cut corners and pay a bribe. If a bribe someone is willing to pay for an offence is 500sh...then if you say fine is 700shs..then many honest people..would rather pay 700sh and get done with it...but if the fine is 10,000shs..then people will pay 3,000 to the cops. There has to be a balance....we can calculate the trade off..oops we can just ask people...and scientifically determine the optimum level of fine.

MPs have to improve their legistalive agenda..to include proper research and evidence driven legistlation. Right now it based merely on guts. 10K for this offence. 100k for this. Once we can determine the optimum pain-gain for each offence...we can reign on police corruption..who thrive on the imbalance. We also need to make it super simple for someone to plead guilty and be done with whatever offence....generally the majority good people tend to the middle..with extreme on both ends.

Sound reasonable but very unfortunately absolutely not feasible in our society at the moment.

There is no average of standard in Kenya; the figures seem to vary by place, day of the month, how much one has on hand, etc.   Maybe technology could help here: coppers all over the country transmit the bribe-amount-for-today to some central GoK point, someone computes the fine for that day and location, ....  Or the Central GoK point could just tell them to knock it off.     

If the fine is deemed low, people will happily pay the fine and zoom off.
If the fine is deemed high, people will happily pay the bribe and zoom off.

Exactly.    It's incredible to see some Kenyans sold on the idea that technology will somehow make up for the hard work that needs to be done on fundamentals.    Something like the IFMIS was supposed to make up for a lack of morals and a fondness for theft and deceit.  And?    Today we have "Prof. Dr." (soon to be "Sir") Mutahi Ngunyi tell us that a payment that was apparently forced down his throat through "25 levels" .... Still, not as good as the one abut a password being stolen and used in the middle of the night.   

[MOON Ki]

Isn't why they were found them (IFMIS) and their money frozen. Imagine a paper system.

First, we are not entirely clear on exactly how much was stolen, let alone frozen.    We started with Sh. 791, and last we heard it was Sh. 2B.

Second---and this is the most important part---the issue in Kenya has never been one of "finding" who stole what or how much they stole.   Anglo Leasing, Goldenburg, Triton, ..., Chicken-gate: the names and numbers are all out there.   

Another case where you don't understand the issue.   

The fundamental problem is that of stopping such theft, not whether it can be detected.    Whether the detection is by computer or by paper-and-pencil is completely irrelevant to that.    Let me try and put it in an even simpler way: if people know they can steal and get away with it, then merely  "finding" them is completely unhelpful, and the techniques and tools used in the "finding" do not change that.   

[Empedocles]

Isn't why they were found them (IFMIS) and their money frozen. Imagine a paper system. I can tell you from real experience we have gone through cash to m-pesa and reduced fraud by several factors. The purpose of fine is to make it punitive enough but not over do it (like USA) that it become incentive to cut corners and pay a bribe. If a bribe someone is willing to pay for an offence is 500sh...then if you say fine is 700shs..then many honest people..would rather pay 700sh and get done with it...but if the fine is 10,000shs..then people will pay 3,000 to the cops. There has to be a balance....we can calculate the trade off..oops we can just ask people...and scientifically determine the optimum level of fine.

MPs have to improve their legistalive agenda..to include proper research and evidence driven legistlation. Right now it based merely on guts. 10K for this offence. 100k for this. Once we can determine the optimum pain-gain for each offence...we can reign on police corruption..who thrive on the imbalance. We also need to make it super simple for someone to plead guilty and be done with whatever offence....generally the majority good people tend to the middle..with extreme on both ends.

You're very wrongly assuming that the cop doesn't want to make some shekels on the side while the guilty motorist doesn't want to save some of their shekels.

The fact is, in our society the cops traffic cops see their job as a money minting enterprise while the hard pressed motorist wants to spend as little as possible as long as there are no repercussions for their actions.

As long as those factors are in play, no amount of legislative agenda will ever change that at all. Only tough action, starting from the very top, can even start changing things in Kenya.

IFMIS? Excuse me haha. The games still continue, over one year after the so-called technology "busted" the culprits (with one of them gearing up to enter politics):

EDIT: Posted simultaneously as Moon Ki Ban but will leave it as is.

Ben Gethi: Waiguru fixed me over NYS

A key suspect in the Sh791 million NYS theft scandal Ben Gethi told MPs yesterday that former CS Anne Waiguru doctored documents to implicate him.

Businessman Gethi, 32, appeared before Parliament's Public Accounts Committee where he said documents prepared by former NYS deputy director Adan Harake were changed to conceal the truth.

The businessman said the same documents were used by the Banking Fraud Investigations Unit, the Directorate of Public Prosecutions and the Assets Recovery Agency to charge him with the loss of Sh791 million and to attach his property.

Gethi said DPP Keriako Tobiko and Banking Fraud boss Joseph Mugwanja wrongly charged him when his two companies are not mentioned anywhere in the losses.

He also said Waiguru interfered with investigations and gave biased statements to sway decisions on fraud and theft at the NYS.

"Waiguru worked with Mugwaja to fabricate documents in NYS and I have evidence to prove it. Most of the claims seem to be office politics at play amongst individuals. There is absolutely no link to corrupt intentions adduced against me whatsoever," Gethi told the committee chaired by Rarieda MP Nicholas Gumbo.

Assets worth Sh585 million acquired with NYS funds and linked to Gethi have been traced and recovery started. They include prime plots in upmarket Muthaiga in Nairobi, a Range Rover and cash in various bank accounts. The assets were purchased through proxies and lawyers and some registered under law firms.

More:http://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2016/10/05/ben-gethi-waiguru-fixed-me-over-nys_c1432003

[MOON Ki]

Assets worth Sh585 million acquired with NYS funds and linked to Gethi have been traced and recovery started.

Frozen?  Recovered?   Who knows ... but things have started.

[MOON Ki]

EDIT: Posted simultaneously as Moon Ki Ban but will leave it as is.

Fair enough.   But, please, don't encourage confusions with the Korean chap; see my "signature".

[Georgesoros]

First of all motor vehicle act should not be treated as a crime, unless there is injury or severe disregard for the act. A broken tail light, worn tires, speeding in the countryside, should not be a crime rather a misdemeanor offense with a 3000 max fine.