Author Topic: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls  (Read 28603 times)

Offline vooke

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A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« on: May 18, 2015, 01:26:29 PM »
Nuff Sed,
Is it familiar?

Ellen G. White abominable image for Asherah, the phallic pillar of Baal, rises defiantly erect between two judiciously-placed, bewhiskered shrubby balls.

An older image


And a closer shot


Of course there is a ready excuse for the beautiful balls and some serious manhood
2 Timothy 2:4  No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.

Offline Omollo

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #1 on: May 18, 2015, 01:41:16 PM »
No Comment


Here you see a view of the piazza or plaza at the Vatican, also known as St. Peter's square. The papal palace is on the right edge of the photo. The large eight-rayed sun wheel design, symbolic of Ishtar, is immediately noticeable. Look closely in the center of the wheel. What you see there is an obelisk, a genuine Egyptian obelisk shipped from Heliopolis to Rome by the Roman emperor Caligula. The obelisk is, of course, a phallic symbol,* but it also was used in sun worship. Click on the image to view a larger version of the same image.
* It is claimed that the word 'obelisk' literally means 'Baal's shaft' or 'Baal's organ of reproduction'.  Source: Masonic and Occult Symbols Illustrated, by Dr. Cathy Burns, pg. 341.
... [the ICC case] will be tried in Europe, where due procedure and expertise prevail.; ... Second-guessing Ocampo and fantasizing ..has obviously become a national pastime.- NattyDread

Offline Bella

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #2 on: May 18, 2015, 02:35:40 PM »
lol, Omollo, we are not Taliban.  :D I'am still mad at them for destroying the maginificent Bamiyan Buddhas overlooking Afghan plains :( We don't destroy historically significant sites or monuments just because they are pagan in origin. We understand that in reality they are just stone shaped by human hands and no more. Historically, they are a snapshot of a culture long dead. As I understand it, the church has preserved a lot of history in art and architecture over the centuries and even some old pagan temples were converted to churches after the old religions died. For those worried, the old religions of rome died a long time ago, "the obelisk" is no more religiously significant than the parthenon, though it is an important monument. :)
Christus vincit, Christus regnat, Christus imperat; Christus ab omni malo plebem suam defendat
Christ is the victor, Christ is King, Christ is the ruler, May Christ defend His people from all evil

Offline Omollo

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2015, 02:49:44 PM »
Bella

I don't see any language of compromise in the commandments below, do you? This is not from the Koran but the Bible. I may not agree with the Taliban but I had no sympathy for the idolatry that that sanamu in Afghanistan represented. I am sure if a Devil Worshipper set up a monument in Nairobi visible 24/7 from all directions, the reaction by Christians in Kenya would be not so dissimilar to that of the Taliban. The majority tend to dictate.

Note that the Vatican sanamu does not pre-exist the Church. On the contrary the Church acquired it and went ahead to give it greater prominence. Does your church tolerate Baal?

Quote
You shall not bow down to their gods, nor serve them, nor do according to their works; but you shall utterly overthrow them and completely break down their sacred pillars. Exodus 23:24

But you shall destroy their altars, break their sacred pillars, and cut down their wooden images  Exodus 34:13

You shall not make idols for yourselves; neither a carved image nor a sacred pillar shall you rear up for yourselves; nor shall you set up an engraved stone in your land, to bow down to it; for I am the Lord your God  Leviticus 26:1

But thus you shall deal with them: you shall destroy their altars, and break down their sacred pillars  Deut 7:5

And you shall destroy their altars, break their sacred pillars, and burn their wooden images with fire; you shall cut down the carved images of their gods and destroy their names from that place  Deut 12: 3-4
lol, Omollo, we are not Taliban.  :D I'am still mad at them for destroying the maginificent Bamiyan Buddhas overlooking Afghan plains :( We don't destroy historically significant sites or monuments just because they are pagan in origin. We understand that in reality they are just stone shaped by human hands and no more. Historically, they are a snapshot of a culture long dead. As I understand it, the church has preserved a lot of history in art and architecture over the centuries and even some old pagan temples were converted to churches after the old religions died. For those worried, the old religions of rome died a long time ago, "the obelisk" is no more religiously significant than the parthenon, though it is an important monument. :)
... [the ICC case] will be tried in Europe, where due procedure and expertise prevail.; ... Second-guessing Ocampo and fantasizing ..has obviously become a national pastime.- NattyDread

Offline Bella

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #4 on: May 18, 2015, 02:57:10 PM »
Actually Omollo, it very much pre-exists the church. Please read this from this (got it in another discussion forum over this same topic): https://books.google.co.ke/books/about/The_Incredible_Book_of_Vatican_Facts_and.html?id=EXvWAAAAMAAJ&hl=en
Quote

It is was never an idol created for worship. Just a monument by an ancient politician to mark his "achievements". Moreover, a cross stands above it, to show the triumph of christianity over ancient Rome. I also understand St. Peter (and many other christians) was martyred near it, as it was in the centre of an arena where such killings took place, which is why the Pope had it moved to the site of st. Peters burrial.

The ancient Israelites lived in very different times. I dont recall any of the apostles bothering with ancient idols, except to tell christians the gods worshipped were non-existent. :) No, I wouldnt be one of the Nairobians asking that a 1,500 year old statue be taken down. I'd probably be in a protest infront of one preventing those trying to take it down, actually. :D
Christus vincit, Christus regnat, Christus imperat; Christus ab omni malo plebem suam defendat
Christ is the victor, Christ is King, Christ is the ruler, May Christ defend His people from all evil

Offline Omollo

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2015, 03:47:07 PM »
May be I was a bit inaccurate in my formulation and thus must bear full responsibility for your response. While the existence of the sanamu predates the church, the decision and act of relocating it to The Vatican does not.

I also disagree that it is not a religious symbol. Many if not ALL these monuments have been put up amid open and poorly disguised secret religious rituals. The one in Times Square NY, was marked by a full fledged Masonic match in full openness.

As for Peter having been killed in Rome, I disagree on the grounds that I even doubt he ever stepped in that city: Has St. Peter ever been in Rome?
by Otto Zwierlein, Bonn


Actually Omollo, it very much pre-exists the church. Please read this from this (got it in another discussion forum over this same topic): https://books.google.co.ke/books/about/The_Incredible_Book_of_Vatican_Facts_and.html?id=EXvWAAAAMAAJ&hl=en
Quote
What is the origin of the Egyptian needle in St. Peter's Square?

The mightiest Egyptian obelisk in the world stands in St. Peter's Square, but until a relatively short time ago, a riddle surrounded the great needle. When it was erected in the center of a Rome arena where gladiators used to fight and charioteers raced, Emperor Caligula (whose reign ended in A.D. 41) had a Latin dedication to his mother (Agripina) engraved at the base of the obelisk. Then, almost 1,500 years later, Pope Sixtus V ordered the 320 ton monolith lugged from the ancient arena to its present position in St. Peter's Square.

It is was never an idol created for worship.
Quote
... [the ICC case] will be tried in Europe, where due procedure and expertise prevail.; ... Second-guessing Ocampo and fantasizing ..has obviously become a national pastime.- NattyDread

Offline Bella

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #6 on: May 18, 2015, 04:00:04 PM »
Omollo, I think you'll find this site informative as well, it also tells the story of the obelisk, I reproduce it here in whole: You were right in that, it appears it was more than just an ancient non-religious monument of politicians as I wrote in the last post. Apparently it predated ancient Rome itself by 3,000 years and is actually Egyptian in origin and not Roman. It was originally a tribute to the Egyptian Sungod. :) However, its connection to the first persecutions, particularly that of St. Peter, explains its symbolic significance to the church, the cross on top and the inscription on its base signifying victory of Christ/christianity over Rome.

http://www.divinarivelazione.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=556&Itemid=829&lang=en



Quote





Christus vincit, Christus regnat, Christus imperat; Christus ab omni malo plebem suam defendat
Christ is the victor, Christ is King, Christ is the ruler, May Christ defend His people from all evil

Offline Bella

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #7 on: May 18, 2015, 04:05:51 PM »
May be I was a bit inaccurate in my formulation and thus must bear full responsibility for your response. While the existence of the sanamu predates the church, the decision and act of relocating it to The Vatican does not.

I also disagree that it is not a religious symbol. Many if not ALL these monuments have been put up amid open and poorly disguised secret religious rituals. The one in Times Square NY, was marked by a full fledged Masonic match in full openness.

As for Peter having been killed in Rome, I disagree on the grounds that I even doubt he ever stepped in that city: Has St. Peter ever been in Rome?
by Otto Zwierlein, Bonn


It is was never an idol created for worship.
Quote

Omollo, whether or not Peter was in Rome, (I certainly believe per testimony of ancient christians who would know, that he was) my point is that the catholic church believes he was and that we have his bones underneath the altar of St. Peters basilica,  that the obelisk's presence at the piazza is connected to this belief, and it is also a fact that many christians were martyred by Nero before it, whether Peter was among them or not, so that its being a symbol of Roman persecution of christianity is retained. Hence the symbolic statement of the cross and the inscription of Christ conquers retains its meaning and explains why it stands there, thats what I was explaining. I understood your first concerns to be about why a pagan idol of old would stand infront of a church.
Christus vincit, Christus regnat, Christus imperat; Christus ab omni malo plebem suam defendat
Christ is the victor, Christ is King, Christ is the ruler, May Christ defend His people from all evil

Offline Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #8 on: May 18, 2015, 04:11:53 PM »
vooke,

If Helen White claimed that she was perfect or infallible, I might just be able to see your point.  Otherwise, you need an anti-Helen White injection. 
"I freed a thousand slaves.  I could have freed a thousand more if only they knew they were slaves."

Harriet Tubman

Offline Omollo

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2015, 04:17:06 PM »
Omollo, whether or not Peter was in Rome, my point is that the catholic church believes he was and that we have his bones underneath the altar of St. Peters basilica,  that the obelisk is connected to this belief, and it is also a fact that many christians were martyred by Nero before it, whether Peter was among them or not. Hence the symbolic statement of the cross and the inscription of Christ conquers retains its meaning and explains why it stands there. I understood your first concerns to be about why a pagan idol of old would stand infront of a church.

Bella

The fact that the basis for having the pagan monument in The Vatican is proven false by every serious scholar means there is another (hidden) reason for its prominent presence. There is a school of thought that says it is The Devil's most clever tactic of undermining Christianity. By some ingenuity The Devil managed to place the Symbol of paganism in the heart of The Church and thus rendered it Godless, devoid of the Glory of God and suitable for destruction just like the Temple of Jerusalem.

I have to say I have a lot of sympathy for that view considering nowhere in the Bible does God let down on his abhorrence of Baal and paganism. It is one of the few if not only occasion one is freed from all the demands of the 6th Commandment (Thou shalt not Kill) and in fact one can get in to sin for not doing so.
... [the ICC case] will be tried in Europe, where due procedure and expertise prevail.; ... Second-guessing Ocampo and fantasizing ..has obviously become a national pastime.- NattyDread

Offline Bella

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2015, 04:29:33 PM »
Omollo, whether or not Peter was in Rome, my point is that the catholic church believes he was and that we have his bones underneath the altar of St. Peters basilica,  that the obelisk is connected to this belief, and it is also a fact that many christians were martyred by Nero before it, whether Peter was among them or not. Hence the symbolic statement of the cross and the inscription of Christ conquers retains its meaning and explains why it stands there. I understood your first concerns to be about why a pagan idol of old would stand infront of a church.

Bella

The fact that the basis for having the pagan monument in The Vatican is proven false by every serious scholar means there is another (hidden) reason for its prominent presence. There is a school of thought that says it is The Devil's most clever tactic of undermining Christianity. By some ingenuity The Devil managed to place the Symbol of paganism in the heart of The Church and thus rendered it Godless, devoid of the Glory of God and suitable for destruction just like the Temple of Jerusalem.

I have to say I have a lot of sympathy for that view considering nowhere in the Bible does God let down on his abhorrence of Baal and paganism. It is one of the few if not only occasion one is freed from all the demands of the 6th Commandment (Thou shalt not Kill) and in fact one can get in to sin for not doing so.

Omollo,

I'm afraid its just not true that serious scholars claim Peter did not go to Rome at all. Please look at the Encyclopedia Britannica to see this: http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/453832/Saint-Peter-the-Apostle/5632/Tradition-of-Peter-in-Rome

As you can see there, christians as early as the 1st century believed that Peter had been martyred in Rome. If he had been in fact killed/burried elsewhere, you can rest assured christians from that place would have had something to say to the Roman christians about their claims. :)

I dont doubt st Peter is burried underneath the altar in st Peter's Basilica, the excavation in the early 20th century of the site found a man from the same period fitting the same description tradition has of st Peter, along with an ancient Greek inscription marking his grave: Peter is here, the article I cited referred to. There is a whole book that was written on that excavation process, I believe it is called: The Bones of St. Peter, and gives that information in more detail.
Christus vincit, Christus regnat, Christus imperat; Christus ab omni malo plebem suam defendat
Christ is the victor, Christ is King, Christ is the ruler, May Christ defend His people from all evil

Offline Omollo

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2015, 04:35:15 PM »
Sorry can't access the article. I am outside the area where I can freely access it - if you get my meaning.
Quote
Tradition of Peter in Rome
Omollo,

I'm afraid its just not true that serious scholars claim Peter did not go to Rome at all. Please look at the Encyclopedia Britannica to see this: http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/453832/Saint-Peter-the-Apostle/5632/Tradition-of-Peter-in-Rome

As you can see there, christians as early as the 1st century believed that Peter had been martyred in Rome. If he had been in fact killed/burried elsewhere, you can rest assured christians from that place would have had something to say to the Roman christians about their claims. :)

I dont doubt st Peter is burried underneath the altar in st Peter's Basilica, the excavation in the early 20th century of the site found a man from the same period fitting the same description tradition has of st Peter, along with an ancient Greek inscription marking his grave: Peter is here, the article I cited referred to. There is a whole book that was written on that excavation process, I believe it is called: The Bones of St. Peter, and gives that information in more detail.
[/quote]
... [the ICC case] will be tried in Europe, where due procedure and expertise prevail.; ... Second-guessing Ocampo and fantasizing ..has obviously become a national pastime.- NattyDread

Offline Bella

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2015, 04:39:24 PM »
Its fairly long, but I'll try to reproduce it. :)
Christus vincit, Christus regnat, Christus imperat; Christus ab omni malo plebem suam defendat
Christ is the victor, Christ is King, Christ is the ruler, May Christ defend His people from all evil

Offline Bella

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #13 on: May 18, 2015, 04:53:34 PM »
Quote

These sources, plus the suggestions and implications of later works, combine to lead many scholars to accept Rome as the location of the martyrdom and the reign of Nero as the time.


Omollo,  are you in a dangerous country that monitors information or something?

Anyway, as the britannica shows there are scholars on both sides of the issue. As for me, I always defer to the testimony of early christians on questions of what is authentic christian tradition. :) I believe the man under the altar in st Peters, though this is not part of official dogma, but I believe it is st Peter because Christians believed it and the bones found there match the belief, that's enough for me! :D This wiki also has some more info on the excavations and early christian beliefs and scholarly disputes on the matter: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Peter%27s_tomb O my word, there is a free online version of 'The Bones of St. Peter: The First Full Account of the Search for the Apostle's Body": http://stpetersbasilica.info/Necropolis/JW/TheBonesofStPeter-1.htm#contents

Christus vincit, Christus regnat, Christus imperat; Christus ab omni malo plebem suam defendat
Christ is the victor, Christ is King, Christ is the ruler, May Christ defend His people from all evil

Offline Omollo

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #14 on: May 18, 2015, 06:05:16 PM »
Bella

These days which country doesn't? In the past they dependent on secret denunciations to start bugging phones and sending men in overcoats.... these days they still do that but again have hired virtually everybody to spy for them. Your ISP, Your Grocer (Credit Card electronic receipts, Your library, not to mention the cellphone company.

I have free access when I am within the institute I am attached to.

That said, the Britannica article has underwhelmed me. It is a mixture of fact and fiction with clear symmetry. It makes declarations. The only "proof" that the bones found in Rome belong to Peter appears to be some inscription saying "Peter is here". Now for that to be accepted dozens of tests would have to be carried out on the bones and the inscription to rule out mischief. The article I cited says the following (I have numbered for ease. He starts by examining the evidence in the New statement:  ":

Quote
uncircumcised heathens, and Peter the circumcised Jews

I shall attached the Pdf version in full
Omollo,  are you in a dangerous country that monitors information or something?

Anyway, as the britannica shows there are scholars on both sides of the issue. As for me, I always defer to the testimony of early christians on questions of what is authentic christian tradition. :) I believe the man under the altar in st Peters, though this is not part of official dogma, but I believe it is st Peter because Christians believed it and the bones found there match the belief, that's enough for me! :D This wiki also has some more info on the excavations and early christian beliefs and scholarly disputes on the matter: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Peter%27s_tomb
[pdf]http://www.philologie.uni-bonn.de/philologie/personal/zwierlein/st_peter_in_rome.pdf[/pdf]
... [the ICC case] will be tried in Europe, where due procedure and expertise prevail.; ... Second-guessing Ocampo and fantasizing ..has obviously become a national pastime.- NattyDread

Offline Bella

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #15 on: May 18, 2015, 06:23:03 PM »
Thanks Omollo, I will look at the pdf and get back. I dont think you saw my addition to the earlier post, so I'll just repeat that the book accounting the excavation process I reffered to earlier is actually freely available online: http://stpetersbasilica.info/Necropolis/JW/TheBonesofStPeter-5.htm#Peter. Now, lets take a look at that article...
Christus vincit, Christus regnat, Christus imperat; Christus ab omni malo plebem suam defendat
Christ is the victor, Christ is King, Christ is the ruler, May Christ defend His people from all evil

Offline Bella

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #16 on: May 18, 2015, 07:32:28 PM »
Omollo, like you I must claim underwhelment  :D

First of all, having looked about, it appears this scholar does not at actually represent a consensus, as may appear, and that the volume he has written (in German) of which he provided the English summary that you have cited, is controversial and has been answered by other scholars, but in German, which I cannot access.

However, it appears to me his basic argument is that the Epistle/book of 1st Peter is "fictitious" and that the Epistle dates not from the 1st century but from the 2nd century long after Peter's death (this is just stated as established fact, no evidence in sight anywhere in the article, however) and then an emphatic interpretation of the reference to "Babylon" in that Epistle (again, simply stated as fact, evidence onge!) that does not match any of the uses of the term among Christians and Jews of the 1st/2nd century who per most scholars, as I understand it, used it to refer to the actual Rome...the empire/capital of the empire.

The rest is simply that (a) st. Ignatius' reference to Peter and Paul having special authority over the Roman church (110 AD) means something other than what has been taken traditionally to be the meaning (that Ignatius believed that Peter and Paul had a special relationship to the church located in Rome) or that (b) st Clement's letter (from 96/7 AD) again means something else. He admits to a christian tradition of the death of Peter by the Roman church but dates it to 150/160 AD. Of course, he does not bother to explain what would motivate the christians of this particular church to just invent such a tradition from whole clothe, and why the Palestinian churches (Jerusalem and Antich) where this author claims Peter lived and died and never left, would allow this rubbish without objection. Were they not aware of the death and burial of their own bishop and beloved apostle? Even granting that the tradition is first recorded in 150 and accepting his dismissal of 1st Peter, Clement and Igatius, that is still early enough that the churches knew Bishops/leaders who had known the apostles or the earliest apostolic fathers. That others would not have said, no, st Peter is burried at his church in Antioch/Jerusalem, just seems an amazing claim to make to me. :D

Everything else comes down to this: Its not written in the Bible (this after disparaging 1st Peter as fictitious and then giving an interpretation of Babylon that is unique and doesnt follow the use of the term among the Jews and christians of that era). Well, anyone who has read the New Testament knows that it doesnt mention all/detailed accounts of the lives of the apostles, apart from st Paul whom Acts follows extensively. From the New Testament, you can't know much of how most of the apostles lived and died in the 1st century after Jesus had left. That doesnt mean they vanished from the earth and didnt do anything else, live or die, its just not something that was recorded in the letters that were to form the canon of the new testament. However, a tradition of early christianity does exist and cannot be simply wished away. Neither is it contradicted by other christians, so it appears there is no "smoking gun" here at all. Just an alternative view of history, IMO. And a view that to me, simply doesnt make sense of all the evidence but is entirely a big old argument from silence. :D
Christus vincit, Christus regnat, Christus imperat; Christus ab omni malo plebem suam defendat
Christ is the victor, Christ is King, Christ is the ruler, May Christ defend His people from all evil

Offline vooke

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #17 on: May 18, 2015, 07:35:12 PM »
vooke,

If Helen White claimed that she was perfect or infallible, I might just be able to see your point.  Otherwise, you need an anti-Helen White injection. 

Termie,
I think you hate me with a passion. Nuff Sed draws my attention to three phallics in her signature and aks me if they remind me of anything. I swear they did just that I couldn't figure what. Then it all came back, a hard on and two balls erected(pun) on Ellen Gould White grave. She ordered it soon after her hubby's death.

I believe it is very impolite to ignore a question/challenge.
2 Timothy 2:4  No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.

Offline vooke

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #18 on: May 18, 2015, 07:40:59 PM »
kadame,
I doubt Peter has ever been to Rome. Could you VERY briefly adduce your strongest and earliest evidence that he did?
2 Timothy 2:4  No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.

Offline Bella

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Re: A beautiful phallic complete with two balls
« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2015, 07:48:34 PM »
kadame,
I doubt Peter has ever been to Rome. Could you VERY briefly adduce your strongest and earliest evidence that he did?
vooke, christians believed he was, Nothing in the New Testaments says he wasnt ever there. What evidence shows he couldnt have? This is something even protestants scholars agree on, since it has nothing to do with whether Peter was pope and the other cxatholic-protestant fights. For example, please look at this explanation and tell me where it is wrong...

http://www.biblicalstudies.com/bstudy/miscstudies/peterrome.htm

Quote


Christus vincit, Christus regnat, Christus imperat; Christus ab omni malo plebem suam defendat
Christ is the victor, Christ is King, Christ is the ruler, May Christ defend His people from all evil