Author Topic: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow  (Read 2828 times)

Offline RV Pundit

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Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« on: September 27, 2022, 10:39:33 PM »
They are saying decision will have implications on financial inclusions...I suspect they will pilot the credit scoring so they can reduce crazy charges n interest on good customers

Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2022, 10:41:42 PM »
Definitely Fuliza usurious interest has to go.. Kenyatta can go jump into lake Victoria

Offline gout

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2022, 11:34:26 AM »
With opus dei akiwa na moto, ufool's state capture will be demolished.
Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one ~ Thomas Paine

Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2022, 11:55:22 AM »
Yeap look like we are off to good start in reforming the country

Offline Githunguri

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  • EVERY KENYAN SHOULD HAVE A GUN.
Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2022, 04:13:22 PM »
Stupid post by a stupid person.

People who borrow from FULIZA can't pay in a single day others take weeks others don't so you have to give punitive costs to ensure those who pay cover for those who can't pay..SIMPLE LOGIC

How much money does GOK in TAXES make from FULIZA Mshwari n KCB Mpesa?Billions of Shillings of course.

It's a willing buyer willing seller and Ruto can't bring hustler nonsense to safaricom n affiliated banks which gives him alot of money needed most at the moment.

He has hijacked the Norfolk hotel presser to wash his hands over the matter.The president can do nothing about credit rating.PERIOD.

If you want a cheap loan Go to your nearest bank and deposit your title deed or logbook.

Offline RV Heavy Hitter!

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2022, 04:52:04 PM »
CRB is not going anywhere because accountability must be maintained (Risk mitigation). Transunion, the current US credit bureau, manages financial risks in Kenya as CRB. Kenya will have to drop the customized Kenya model and fully deploy the US model, where borrowers are ranked from 300 to 850. In the US model, borrowers monthly see scores go up or down depending on how they borrow and pay debts. Since it is day-to-day transactions, unlike US credit cards that close monthly, Kenya's model may be updated weekly or multiple times daily. For example, in the proposed Kenyan model, your score could be 700 credit score on Friday. By next Wednesday, it will be 500 if you defaulted on due payments. Trust Transunion to come up with a fantastic model driven by algorithms! 
Eliud Ewalo is a brilliant guy. I am sure he will research the US model and work with financial giants to develop a product similar to the US model.   
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Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2022, 05:36:58 PM »
Yes credit scoring link to transaction from banks and mpesa is needed..not just adverse reporting like Kenya.I trust Prof Ndungu to lead this...he is an expert in finance access
opus dei in central bank is about to finish his tenure so we need another strong but reform minded candidate at central bank..opus dei has killed the innovation but also saved the day by being incorruptible

Offline Githunguri

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2022, 06:19:16 PM »
It's a very simple principle,

If you can't pay your debt you either don't get debt or get it at high interest rates..This principle applies to GOVERMENT corporate upto individual debt which is where FULIZA applies.Like Kenya pays higher interest rates vs USA 10% and 2% respectively.

If you transact lots of money,earn 1MN per month and have no unpaid debt you are able to FULIZA even 300k.

If you earn 10,000 Bob you have unpaid loans then you can only FULIZA 200 Bob and because you can't pay it in 3wks and most likely default then pay more.

Ruto has done NOTHING AT ALL.JUST HOT AIR.

NJIA YA MUONGO NO FUPI SANA.

Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2022, 07:25:49 PM »
Gov job is to regulate banks - and these mobile loans need regulation. You cannot charge daily interest of 2% - which annualized is 365*2 - 700% - which country will allow you to do that. CBK should ensure banks charge reasonable interest. Gok job is to protect people from shylocks like Fuliza.

Besides this - we should open Mpesa for many banks to compete - for now NCBA and KCB together with Safaricom have locked this - and have undue advantage.

Mpesa overdraft should be open for all banks to compete on the cheapest interest. You should see a menu saying Fuliza from Equity 3%, KCB 2.9%, etc. This will allow proper prize discovery after brutal competition. Without this Safaricom and their two partners collude to create a monopoly in the digital overdraft loan. That is not capitalism. That is oppression.

So there is regulation required - in many levels - beyond your simplistic mind.

It appears to me Mpesa need to be open platform...for all players to enjoy same advantages...tight coupling with Safaricom.

It's a very simple principle,

If you can't pay your debt you either don't get debt or get it at high interest rates..This principle applies to GOVERMENT corporate upto individual debt which is where FULIZA applies.Like Kenya pays higher interest rates vs USA 10% and 2% respectively.

If you transact lots of money,earn 1MN per month and have no unpaid debt you are able to FULIZA even 300k.

If you earn 10,000 Bob you have unpaid loans then you can only FULIZA 200 Bob and because you can't pay it in 3wks and most likely default then pay more.

Ruto has done NOTHING AT ALL.JUST HOT AIR.

NJIA YA MUONGO NO FUPI SANA.

Offline RV Heavy Hitter!

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2022, 11:04:16 PM »
Gov job is to regulate banks - and these mobile loans need regulation. You cannot charge daily interest of 2% - which annualized is 365*2 - 700% - which country will allow you to do that. CBK should ensure banks charge reasonable interest. Gok job is to protect people from shylocks like Fuliza.

Besides this - we should open Mpesa for many banks to compete - for now NCBA and KCB together with Safaricom have locked this - and have undue advantage.

Mpesa overdraft should be open for all banks to compete on the cheapest interest. You should see a menu saying Fuliza from Equity 3%, KCB 2.9%, etc. This will allow proper prize discovery after brutal competition. Without this Safaricom and their two partners collude to create a monopoly in the digital overdraft loan. That is not capitalism. That is oppression.

So there is regulation required - in many levels - beyond your simplistic mind.

It appears to me Mpesa need to be open platform...for all players to enjoy same advantages...tight coupling with Safaricom.

It's a very simple principle,

If you can't pay your debt you either don't get debt or get it at high interest rates..This principle applies to GOVERMENT corporate upto individual debt which is where FULIZA applies.Like Kenya pays higher interest rates vs USA 10% and 2% respectively.

If you transact lots of money,earn 1MN per month and have no unpaid debt you are able to FULIZA even 300k.

If you earn 10,000 Bob you have unpaid loans then you can only FULIZA 200 Bob and because you can't pay it in 3wks and most likely default then pay more.

Ruto has done NOTHING AT ALL.JUST HOT AIR.

NJIA YA MUONGO NO FUPI SANA.
Yes, when banks compete, borrowers always win. There are over 12K lenders in the US market with a population of 350 million. I think Kenya has less than 100, with about five controlling the lion's share, both digital and traditional, in a population of 50 million. That is oppression/monopoly. Down the road, EA lenders and international lenders need to be allowed to compete in Kenya and the EA market until saturation is reached. That is when credit cards hit the markets. Inundating credit/liquidity is the king of economic growth.
The government needs sensible regulations and effective financial risk management from the private sector. Proper financial risk management, which I think the new administration will usher- in credit bureau tweaking, should reward Sensible borrowers and punish defaulters hard. Someone with excellent credit ought to borrow and enjoy near-zero interest. Once that area is affected, and there is stiff competition, lenders will likely offer months to years of free introductory rates or no interest for long periods. That puts money back to good borrowers, who will, in turn, keep borrowing and expanding their hustles, especially those borrowing 200K and up. With a 740+ credit score in the US, you can go for decades without paying interest on credit cards by taking advantage of 2 years of 0-interest introductory rates. After 2-3 years, shelf the card, use 10% of credit and migrate to another card. After a few years, you will probably be sitting on $500K-1000,000 credit, which will start talking to you at night. Many ideas, some illegal, will be running through your mind, like, for instance, should I spend the whole thing and begin again after seven years?
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Offline hk

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2022, 10:17:43 AM »
Ati state capture targeting kenyattas interest will be dismantled https://www.businessdailyafrica.com/bd/markets/capital-markets/ruto-seeks-deal-with-safaricom-to-disburse-cheap-hustler-loans-3965946 they're looking to partner with "state capture operatives".  They might as well revive the stawi concept https://www.centralbank.go.ke/uploads/press_releases/825716068_Press%20Release%20-%20A%20Revolution%20in%20the%20Financing%20of%20MSMEs.pdf
The hustler fund is meant to bypass the real cause of high cost of credit without dealing will the fundamental problems of cost of credit. Fix the economy, loan interest and cost goes down. Taxpayers would shelter the risk in hustle fund, all the non performing loans in the fund would be paid by taxpayers or the fund would very easily dry up. A Populist idea that  clearly is being battered by reality headwinds. ( I heard that david ndii pitched the idea to IFC and affiliates, there were no takers) .

America interest rates are very low not because of the numbers of lenders but because the federal reserve bank and treasury has kept interest rate at very low rate. In addition to flooding the market with cheap money.  In kenya you can have a million lenders but with government borrowing at 12% there's no way interest rates will be low.

Offline Kadudu

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #11 on: September 29, 2022, 10:28:14 AM »
Exactly. If as a bank I can lend the government money at 12% interest rate, why should I risk to lend an individual at 15% interest rate? Of course from around 20% is when the bank will be willing to consider lending individuals.

Ati state capture targeting kenyattas interest will be dismantled https://www.businessdailyafrica.com/bd/markets/capital-markets/ruto-seeks-deal-with-safaricom-to-disburse-cheap-hustler-loans-3965946 they're looking to partner with "state capture operatives".  They might as well revive the stawi concept https://www.centralbank.go.ke/uploads/press_releases/825716068_Press%20Release%20-%20A%20Revolution%20in%20the%20Financing%20of%20MSMEs.pdf
The hustler fund is meant to bypass the real cause of high cost of credit without dealing will the fundamental problems of cost of credit. Fix the economy, loan interest and cost goes down. Taxpayers would shelter the risk in hustle fund, all the non performing loans in the fund would be paid by taxpayers or the fund would very easily dry up. A Populist idea that  clearly is being battered by reality headwinds. ( I heard that david ndii pitched the idea to IFC and affiliates, there were no takers) .

America interest rates are very low not because of the numbers of lenders but because the federal reserve bank and treasury has kept interest rate at very low rate. In addition to flooding the market with cheap money.  In kenya you can have a million lenders but with government borrowing at 12% there's no way interest rates will be low.

Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #12 on: September 29, 2022, 11:00:38 AM »
What real cost of credit for hustlers now...Fuliza and such are doing more than 50 percent for tiny microloans.If Ruto can bring it down to 20 percent he would have done it.Nobody want lower than even 15 percent.. shylocks lending motorbike and cars are all over.We cannot just sit and wait for miracle

Offline gout

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #13 on: September 29, 2022, 11:34:28 AM »
The figures show why government interventions are late for obvious reasons. As Hasla indicated this was a key campaign issue for a reason.
At 1.083% 'access' fee from 1.56 billion daily Safaricom and banks have 17 million daily from hasoras taking Kshs. 100 - 500. That is vulturistic penalty for a product with 99% repayment rates. Only 1% will throw away their lines over 200 shillings unlike big borrowers who have filled banks' books with bad loans and still getting preferential treatment. 

Then 2.4-6 shilling for the say 5 million small time borrowers per day - insane extraction from hasora economic actvities. The 3 day grace period and cutting the charges by 50% is quite a big deal but not enough.

https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/business/article/2001456831/fuliza-economy-kenyans-borrow-sh16b-daily-amid-economic-woes
Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one ~ Thomas Paine

Offline Nowayhaha

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #14 on: September 29, 2022, 02:47:58 PM »

Before CBA had monopoly with all Safaricom products. Your friend Edward Ndichu regularized KCB to become the other partner. You have good ideas . Shida yako ni ujuaji

Gov job is to regulate banks - and these mobile loans need regulation. You cannot charge daily interest of 2% - which annualized is 365*2 - 700% - which country will allow you to do that. CBK should ensure banks charge reasonable interest. Gok job is to protect people from shylocks like Fuliza.

Besides this - we should open Mpesa for many banks to compete - for now NCBA and KCB together with Safaricom have locked this - and have undue advantage.

Mpesa overdraft should be open for all banks to compete on the cheapest interest. You should see a menu saying Fuliza from Equity 3%, KCB 2.9%, etc. This will allow proper prize discovery after brutal competition. Without this Safaricom and their two partners collude to create a monopoly in the digital overdraft loan. That is not capitalism. That is oppression.

So there is regulation required - in many levels - beyond your simplistic mind.

It appears to me Mpesa need to be open platform...for all players to enjoy same advantages...tight coupling with Safaricom.

It's a very simple principle,

If you can't pay your debt you either don't get debt or get it at high interest rates..This principle applies to GOVERMENT corporate upto individual debt which is where FULIZA applies.Like Kenya pays higher interest rates vs USA 10% and 2% respectively.

If you transact lots of money,earn 1MN per month and have no unpaid debt you are able to FULIZA even 300k.

If you earn 10,000 Bob you have unpaid loans then you can only FULIZA 200 Bob and because you can't pay it in 3wks and most likely default then pay more.

Ruto has done NOTHING AT ALL.JUST HOT AIR.

NJIA YA MUONGO NO FUPI SANA.

Offline Kadudu

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #15 on: September 29, 2022, 03:46:14 PM »
Fuliza is legal shylock. In total the intereat rates are going to 1.000% p.a. Those guys are killing Kenyans who take small loans.

What real cost of credit for hustlers now...Fuliza and such are doing more than 50 percent for tiny microloans.If Ruto can bring it down to 20 percent he would have done it.Nobody want lower than even 15 percent.. shylocks lending motorbike and cars are all over.We cannot just sit and wait for miracle

Offline High Roller

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #16 on: October 02, 2022, 12:24:16 AM »
US is saturated with services somewhat like Fuliza called payday loans. They are run by small operation establishments typically from storefronts in low-income neighborhoods. Their customers generally have poor credit and have no other access to money to cover urgent bills. Payday lenders use different methods for calculating interest rates, often demanding nearly 400% on an annualized basis. Most borrowers fail to repay a payday loan and fall into a pattern of getting another loan to pay the previous one.

Check out this link: https://www.responsiblelending.org/issues/victims-payday



Offline RV Heavy Hitter!

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #17 on: October 02, 2022, 06:10:29 AM »
US is saturated with services somewhat like Fuliza called payday loans. They are run by small operation establishments typically from storefronts in low-income neighborhoods. Their customers generally have poor credit and have no other access to money to cover urgent bills. Payday lenders use different methods for calculating interest rates, often demanding nearly 400% on an annualized basis. Most borrowers fail to repay a payday loan and fall into a pattern of getting another loan to pay the previous one.

Check out this link: https://www.responsiblelending.org/issues/victims-payday
Payday loans are Bank of America, Morgan Chase and big banks on lower tier lending. The giants control all the markets and operate within law in all their lending practices.
Quote
A lender may charge a finance charge for each deferred deposit loan or payday loan that must not exceed an annual percentage rate of 36%.https://www.ncsl.org/research/financial-services-and-commerce/payday-lending-state-statutes.aspx#:~:text=A%20lender%20may%20charge%20a,annual%20percentage%20rate%20of%2036%25.
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Offline Georgesoros

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Re: Safaricom, NCBA and KCB presser tomorrow
« Reply #19 on: October 04, 2022, 03:56:43 PM »
Ati state capture targeting kenyattas interest will be dismantled https://www.businessdailyafrica.com/bd/markets/capital-markets/ruto-seeks-deal-with-safaricom-to-disburse-cheap-hustler-loans-3965946 they're looking to partner with "state capture operatives".  They might as well revive the stawi concept https://www.centralbank.go.ke/uploads/press_releases/825716068_Press%20Release%20-%20A%20Revolution%20in%20the%20Financing%20of%20MSMEs.pdf
The hustler fund is meant to bypass the real cause of high cost of credit without dealing will the fundamental problems of cost of credit. Fix the economy, loan interest and cost goes down. Taxpayers would shelter the risk in hustle fund, all the non performing loans in the fund would be paid by taxpayers or the fund would very easily dry up. A Populist idea that  clearly is being battered by reality headwinds. ( I heard that david ndii pitched the idea to IFC and affiliates, there were no takers) .

America interest rates are very low not because of the numbers of lenders but because the federal reserve bank and treasury has kept interest rate at very low rate. In addition to flooding the market with cheap money.  In kenya you can have a million lenders but with government borrowing at 12% there's no way interest rates will be low.


Build a foundation and everything else will follow. Building structures and then trying to retrofit the foundation will make the whole economy very unstable.
I thought that since Ruto was in govt since 1992 he could have a better plan than being presented. Unless he is hiding something.