Rotational presidency could work in Kenya?

[veritas]

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Like Israel, Germany etc.

According to findings, a majority of Kenyans preferred a rotational presidency, which in their view would bring political stability in a country dogged by tribal political alliances.

https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/amp/opinion/article/2001413346/rotational-presidency-is-the-answer-to-our-perennial-electoral-turmoil

May take time to alter the constitution but seems like a way forward to keep the peace for these elections.

[RV Pundit]

Yes plus deeper federalism or devolution.otherwise the feeling of being excluded will continue and now Kikuyu kalenjin duopoly starting to look ridiculous. We would need regions...then rotating president for 2yrs

[RV Heavy Hitter!]

That is stifling the rights of other Kenyans. Anyone, regardless of economic status, tribe, region, color, or creed, should have all the rights to campaign anywhere for any position. And, YES, should they win, so be it. That is the true freedom that Kenya must build going forward. If someone has something to offer and can campaign and be voted by 50%+1 Kenyans, I don't care which tribe or place he came from. It simply means the majority have spoken.

[KenyanPlato]

yes. the next president should be a coasterian or someone rom north east ..I would do this rotation ..2032 coast, 2037 Nep, 2042 ...Western, 2049 Eastern

[Nowayhaha]

Raila supporters after defeat usually cry for a Rotational President.
Just before Handshake for them Uhuru was the worst President in the World but after Handshake became the best President in the world.
2022 elections became a first in that it became issue based. A first that a major tribe GEMA never followed directions of their Kingpin lets say Like Kalonzo and Lower Western , Raila and Nyanza.
This is a major step towards de-ethnisization of Kenyan politics. Lets hope it stays on that track. A journey of many miles starts with one step.
We should never looks at each other as tribes but Kenyans . Any Kenyan should be able to start a clarion call and become President.
Let the Coasterian convince other Kenyans and he will become the President. Ruto most votes from Kenyans and thats why he is President elect. He got More votes from GEMA than even in his own Rift Valley. Thats how it should be.
Rotational Presidency is an easier way of denying majority their way. David Waihiga came from Majority tribe but came out last . Simply cause he could sell his ideas to even his own tribe. Thats now how democracy works . Should be about ideas and tribes.

[gout]

Which tribe will these decision makers be?? Ama will be aliens??

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Like Israel, Germany etc.

According to findings, a majority of Kenyans preferred a rotational presidency, which in their view would bring political stability in a country dogged by tribal political alliances.

https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/amp/opinion/article/2001413346/rotational-presidency-is-the-answer-to-our-perennial-electoral-turmoil

May take time to alter the constitution but seems like a way forward to keep the peace for these elections.

I think the problem is the Presidential system itself.  Kenya probably needs a parliamentary system.  Huge - and more diverse - countries like India seem to be doing just fine with it.

[RV Pundit]

The reality is it become harder and harder for those who have not been pork to become pork..tribewise.. because you need lots of money, patronage and network that you can only get by having had power...so it's going to be harder to break this Kikuyu kalenjin dupoly..once in a while a wildcard Obama can rise but most of the time the other tribe leaders are going to start at disadvantage so eventually going to become an increasingly big destabilizing issues... quick solution devolve more money n power to counties

[High Roller]

Yes plus deeper federalism or devolution.otherwise the feeling of being excluded will continue and now Kikuyu kalenjin duopoly starting to look ridiculous. We would need regions...then rotating president for 2yrs

Rotating presidency among the 42 tribes every 2yrs is a great idea. It will reduce this presidential obsession and over the long run save a lot of money. It is just not feasible to be spending ksh. 12 billions every 5 years on electing a president, courts and re-runs. For a country with an annual budget of Ksh. 3.3 trillion, that's not an insignificant chunk of change.

[RV Pundit]

It cant be done with 45 tribes.
45 tribes have counties and their governors - they just need more powers.
We need another layer - regions - Mt kenya, RV, Western, Nyanza, Coast, Ukambani and NFD - say 8 regions.
Then regional governor of those regions - every two years can double up as president.
Or we have the chairman of governor council - serve as the president for two years.
So first election everyone elect their governor.
The governors meet every two years - and elect one of their own to double up as president and governor of his county.
Two years non-renewable term.
So every 5yrs - we have 3 presidents - soon everyone will have had PORK.

But for now we have WSR for 10yrs.

Yes plus deeper federalism or devolution.otherwise the feeling of being excluded will continue and now Kikuyu kalenjin duopoly starting to look ridiculous. We would need regions...then rotating president for 2yrs

Rotating presidency among the 42 tribes every 2yrs is a great idea. It will reduce this presidential obsession and over the long run save a lot of money. It is just not feasible to be spending ksh. 12 billions every 5 years on electing a president, courts and re-runs. For a country with an annual budget of Ksh. 3.3 trillion, that's not an insignificant chunk of change.

[RV Heavy Hitter!]

It cant be done with 45 tribes.
45 tribes have counties and their governors - they just need more powers.
We need another layer - regions - Mt kenya, RV, Western, Nyanza, Coast, Ukambani and NFD - say 8 regions.
Then regional governor of those regions - every two years can double up as president.
Or we have the chairman of governor council - serve as the president for two years.
So first election everyone elect their governor.
The governors meet every two years - and elect one of their own to double up as president and governor of his county.
Two years non-renewable term.
So every 5yrs - we have 3 presidents - soon everyone will have had PORK.

But for now we have WSR for 10yrs.

Yes plus deeper federalism or devolution.otherwise the feeling of being excluded will continue and now Kikuyu kalenjin duopoly starting to look ridiculous. We would need regions...then rotating president for 2yrs

Rotating presidency among the 42 tribes every 2yrs is a great idea. It will reduce this presidential obsession and over the long run save a lot of money. It is just not feasible to be spending ksh. 12 billions every 5 years on electing a president, courts and re-runs. For a country with an annual budget of Ksh. 3.3 trillion, that's not an insignificant chunk of change.

Ruto has vowed to open his wallet, might, deep state, and campaign aggressively for either of the three guys, Deputy-elect Gachagua, Kimani Ichungwah, or Ndindi Nyoro. That is after his 10-year term and once the Mountain approves any of them, so talk about 2042 and beyond. The way I see it, others are hopeless unless they throw their hats in the ring with a great plan and campaign aggressively to vanquish Kenya Kwanza in a 50%+1 game. Anyone can run for the presidency; the question is, do that person has the wherewithal and brain capacity like Ruto to win?

[RV Pundit]

Yeah without Raila - it will be sometimes before we get opponent strong enough to challenge Ruto and his successor.

Ruto has vowed to open his wallet, might, deep state, and campaign aggressively for either of the three guys, Deputy-elect Gachagua, Kimani Ichungwah, or Ndindi Nyoro. That is after his 10-year term and once the Mountain approves any of them, so talk about 2042 and beyond. The way I see it, others are hopeless unless they throw their hats in the ring with a great plan and campaign aggressively to vanquish Kenya Kwanza in a 50%+1 game. Anyone can run for the presidency; the question is, do that person has the wherewithal and brain capacity like Ruto to win?

[Githunguri]

KikUyu and Kalenjin have had the presidency for the last 60 years. If you add Ruto Gachagua Ndindi sakaja koskei matrix. They maybe in power for the next 30 years.

Raila's question since 2007 has been;

Can democracy work in a multi-ethnic state of 47 tribes whereby Three majority tribes Kikuyu Kalenjin and Luhya can gang up and take over government in an election?

Is a president elected through ethnic mobilization of select tribes a legitimate president of the other 40 tribes?

What is the cure?Secession?Rotational presidency?

If the Supreme court of the republic of Kenya nullifies the August 9 presidential election, Raila knows very well that he cannot win the presidential election because the turnout in RVGEMA will hit 90% +.

He will ask for the disbandment of IEBC. In short he will cause a constitutional and political crisis to have a coalition government because considers Ruto to be illegitimate because of having received majority votes from RVGEMA while Raila got majority votes from the other over 35 Kenyan tribes.

The supreme court decision will make or break the Kenya Project.

[Nowayhaha]

What would a President do in 2 years ?
Kenya is a Unitary Country . Regionalism will only make Kenya More Divided.
The solution is make Kenya a Nation and it starts with people identifying themselves as Kenyans rather as tribes.

[Dear Mami]

The supreme court decision will make or break the Kenya Project.

It's not that serious. Kenya won't break. But what will happen is continued fragmentation into two camps. Even with hustler narrative, those two still stayed within those contours to a large extent. The danger I fear is a truly dangerous character comes along down the line who takes advantage. Raila has mostly been trying to resolve it through constitutional reforms but a truly awful soul who is talented/skilled/brilliant, in the right circumstances, say during great hardship and an awful govt, can really do something ugly with such sentiments.

I'm pleasantly surprised and glad to see Pundit acknowledge the problem of exclusion in Kenya and suggest solutions like rotating presidency among members of a powerful council of governors.  In the past, he would rubish such grievances as Raila losing bla bla bla, so it's good to know deep down he knows it's a real issue that needs a solution.

And I agree, Githunguri, that for the 'excluded' the RVGema candidate never feels like 'their' president. People who complain that Uhuru was hated until handshake, just don't get it! It's Uhuru's embrace of the 'excluded' that earned him their love; it's like he said 'pia Hawa ni watu wanaeza kutuongoza.' It's really that simple! He made them feel included, so they loved him for it. I know, because I still blame Jubilee disaster duo for their horrid governance. I don't romanticize Uhuru any more than Ruto. But I know why my family and people close to me fell in love with the hated Kamwana: Inclusion. It's that and nothing else.

[RV Pundit]

You clearly dont know me I am acutely aware of the political exlusion and grievances - but I dont feel Raila has the competence to lead this country. I have called Ruto to embrace the whole country like Jubilee 1.0 did. I differed with Kibaki because he became tribalist. For Ruto if confirmed next monday - I want to see him reach out to Luo Nyanza and rest of the country that didnt vote for him - but most importantly to share development and all prominent position that have symbolism of power equally.

Uhuru definitely scored better than Kibaki on inclusion. Jomo Kenyatta was the worse. Moi tried to bring everyone onboard. Kibaki became insular - we had been warned before that he was Othaya kind of guy.Raila for me is nightmare - incompetent moron - who should not be anywhere near serious leadership. You've seen how he cannot even get 46k agents...in his 5th run. The man is feckless, poor manager and total incompetent to quote - sally, orengo and salim lone - folks who have worked closely with him.

So Inshallah Ruto wins and he should be acutely aware that country is divided - and should promise to share development equally - using const/county model - if it's road - please build 10kms in all const or none at all.

I'm pleasantly surprised and glad to see Pundit acknowledge the problem of exclusion in Kenya and suggest solutions like rotating presidency among members of a powerful council of governors.  In the past, he would rubish such grievances as Raila losing bla bla bla, so it's good to know deep down he knows it's a real issue that needs a solution.

[Wa Njambi]

Aaaiiii!!! Rotate Presidency. This is intellectual laziness. For one, this issue was addressed by introduction of devolution. Each country has it's "presidente". With small and steady increments,  we are making progress toward breaking the barriers Regional/Tribal impediments for this position - and while at it, include Gender, Age and creed impediments. Rotational presidency would be a lazy solution to problem that doesn't exist. People vote on ethnic patterns because they relate to the candidate, not because the dislike other ethnic groups. The more we have cross-ethinic interaction, those ethnic barriers and biases will dispel. A decade ago, we celebrated electing a Young turk...today we have forgotten that excitement. We have elected a few Asians to the National Assembly. We have good performing women CS's...and we don't look at them as Women, but as able Kenyans, regardless of gender, doing an outstanding job. These biases will fade with interaction, and Education.
[qnuote author=RV Pundit link=topic=13946.msg127084#msg127084 date=1661872389]
Yes plus deeper federalism or devolution.otherwise the feeling of being excluded will continue and now Kikuyu kalenjin duopoly starting to look ridiculous. We would need regions...then rotating president for 2yrs
[/quote]

[Wa Njambi]

Njamba     Ngai!   Are you aware that Presidency is not a Beauty Pageants thingie. It's Best citizen for the job by popular vote.

yes. the next president should be a coasterian or someone rom north east ..I would do this rotation ..2032 coast, 2037 Nep, 2042 ...Western, 2049 Eastern

[Nowayhaha]

RV has been an advocate of regionalism and specifically aligned to the previous Provinces which were actually crafted by Colonialists to protect their interests.
Ofcourse if Rift Valley becomes a Regional Government he believes there will be a shift in power over the predominantly GEMA counties of Laikipia and Nakuru. Other Counties like Kajiado, Turkana , Narok, Samburu will be taking instructions from Eldoret.
Also Its evident RV thought Ruto would perform much more better in Matusa , Coast and North Eastern . He is blamimg Rutos perfomance on UDAs GEMA support.
As a Moist he thought KADU/KANU was being rejuvinated. The problem with him is he expected the results in one day. He doesnt see Ruto has made much more progress especially with a turnout decline from 80% in 2017 to 60% in 2022 occasioned by the politics of confusion brought about by handshake.
For RV he thought by fighting BBI the so called KADU/KANU regions would back Ruto 100% Where as we fought BBI for a just Kenya most importantly to defend Kenya and stop the political deceit of Raila trying to lure Mt Kenya to vote for him in 2022 by using treachery and bringing more issues in Kenyan social fibre than solutions.
People need to understand the only way to bring Kenya together is what Ruto did. He came out clear and said no one owes him a debt . He went out there selling hustler narrative which he mixed with Bottom up narrative . He put his all effort in campaigns went to all corners of Kenya selling the message of hope. He put in hardwork in some cases his life was threatened but he still pushed .
Thats what made him President elect.
Fact is without GEMA he wouldnt be President
Fact is without Kambas 270K votes he wouldnt be President
Fact is without Kisiis he would be President
Fact is without Luhya he wouldnt be President
Fact is without Coast Votes he would be President
Fact is Without North Eastern he would be President.
So please stop the narrative of Rift Valley GEMA.
Ruto became President because of all parts of Kenya.
This is the reason we have 50% +1 provision in the Kenyan Constituion.
People should stop hyprocisy that inclusion is only when Raila is favoured by Sitting Government. Moi included Raila in his government through Cooperation, Kibaki through NARC and Grand Coalition. Uhuru through handshake , what more inclusivity do they want ? Raila to be president , then he needs to work harder and pray harder .
Uhuru included Raila and his henchman and excluded Ruto RV and GEMA after 2017 .The same people who put in power. But Raila supporters cant see that Uhuru would be really happy when in Nyanza but become very angry while in Mt Kenya while abusing them as Washenzi. Uhuru used the whole statw machinery and resources to exclude Ruto and Mt Kenya and even tried intefering with elections to exclude Ruto , RV and Mt Kenya but to Raila supporters thats fair game......

[RV Pundit]

I have been advocate of federalism/majimbo/devolution since the 1990s when I started politics.
In a deeply divided tribal country - with tribal nations- we need federalism or devolution or majimbo
That we agree with Moi/Ruto -
Since the 60s and early 2000s - it was only RV & Coast who supported Majimbo.
Eventually Raila and crew joined the Majimbo bandwagon in 2005 after being shafted by Kibaki in NARC.
Bomas was big win for return of Majimbo or federalism.
I understand and appreciate GEMA fears of Majimbo - I have written extensively on this - as early as 2005 huko.
Their fears were mostly unfounded as you can see in the devolution - they are now very happy with it.
The late Dr Mbai genius was to deal with GEMA fears of Majimbo by calling it devolution.
Gema supremacist like you killed him for that. We NEED HUGE MONUMENT OF DR MBAI IN BOMAS OF KENYA.
Of course in 2010 eventually we resorted to counties - district (GEMA been on it since 1950s)
I am okay with counties - 47 ideal for our 45 tribes
If we can add more money and power - to counties - I am totally for it.
As for regions - I think they have some utility - as you can see counties in Mt kenya have tried to form blocs - in coast - blocs - name it.
The regions were created by kenyans.
There are of course problems say in how to deal with Nakuru? or South Rift (Maasai-Kipsigis) - that was main reason it was rejected in Naivasha.
The minority in those regions - feel they will be excluded - example Nakuru in Central RV, Narok in South RV, say Turkana in North RV? or say Embus in Mt Kenya.
Otherwise I dont hate GEMA - I wouldnt have married a GEMA woman.
I hate fools like you.
I love kenya - and I want it to progress.

RV has been an advocate of regionalism and specifically aligned to the previous Provinces which were actually crafted by Colonialists to protect their interests.
Ofcourse if Rift Valley becomes a Regional Government he believes there will be a shift in power over the predominantly GEMA counties of Laikipia and Nakuru. Other Counties like Kajiado, Turkana , Narok, Samburu will be taking instructions from Eldoret.
Also Its evident RV thought Ruto would perform much more better in Matusa , Coast and North Eastern . He is blamimg Rutos perfomance on UDAs GEMA support.
As a Moist he thought KADU/KANU was being rejuvinated. The problem with him is he expected the results in one day. He doesnt see Ruto has made much more progress especially with a turnout decline from 80% in 2017 to 60% in 2022 occasioned by the politics of confusion brought about by handshake.
For RV he thought by fighting BBI the so called KADU/KANU regions would back Ruto 100% Where as we fought BBI for a just Kenya most importantly to defend Kenya and stop the political deceit of Raila trying to lure Mt Kenya to vote for him in 2022 by using treachery and bringing more issues in Kenyan social fibre than solutions.
People need to understand the only way to bring Kenya together is what Ruto did. He came out clear and said no one owes him a debt . He went out there selling hustler narrative which he mixed with Bottom up narrative . He put his all effort in campaigns went to all corners of Kenya selling the message of hope. He put in hardwork in some cases his life was threatened but he still pushed .
Thats what made him President elect.
Fact is without GEMA he wouldnt be President
Fact is without Kambas 270K votes he wouldnt be President
Fact is without Kisiis he would be President
Fact is without Luhya he wouldnt be President
Fact is without Coast Votes he would be President
Fact is Without North Eastern he would be President.
So please stop the narrative of Rift Valley GEMA.
Ruto became President because of all parts of Kenya.
This is the reason we have 50% +1 provision in the Kenyan Constituion.
People should stop hyprocisy that inclusion is only when Raila is favoured by Sitting Government. Moi included Raila in his government through Cooperation, Kibaki through NARC and Grand Coalition. Uhuru through handshake , what more inclusivity do they want ? Raila to be president , then he needs to work harder and pray harder .
Uhuru included Raila and his henchman and excluded Ruto RV and GEMA after 2017 .The same people who put in power. But Raila supporters cant see that Uhuru would be really happy when in Nyanza but become very angry while in Mt Kenya while abusing them as Washenzi. Uhuru used the whole statw machinery and resources to exclude Ruto and Mt Kenya and even tried intefering with elections to exclude Ruto , RV and Mt Kenya but to Raila supporters thats fair game......