Nipate
Forum => Kenya Discussion => Topic started by: RV Pundit on May 19, 2021, 10:22:29 AM
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He seems amongst the few who have identified the Mt Kenya nation's anger against Uhuru and run with it - despite coming from Gatundu South. The others are Ndindi, Wahome, Kimani, Susan and Wa-Ichunga.
Mwangi Kiunjuri has a little window - otherwise, DPORK is slipping away. He needs to fold up TSP - it's useless - and join UDA - and start attacking Uhuru like his life depends on it. Ruto cannot and should not attack Uhuru - but Mt Kenya politicians should not pull punches otherwise angry voters will punish any pro-Uhuru politician next year.
What is Mt Kenya nation's anger against Uhuru?
1) Bringing in the vanquished/hated Raila and taking down the Ruto (the Jubilee hero) for illogical reasons.
2) Mismanaging the economy, being generally aloof, unreachable, and unresponsive to the needs of the people. Replacing Big4 with BBI. Behaving like he owns Mt Kenya the same way Raila owns Luos.
3) Threatening the life and properties and long-term stability of more than a million Kikuyus in RV by opening a war front there.
The revolution goes on - against a sitting lame-duck - with the hostile judiciary and hostile populace - but he owns executive and both house of parliament - and Raila.If Raila bolts - Uhuru will only own Matiangi and Kibicho :).
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He seems amongst the few who have identified the Mt Kenya nation's anger against Uhuru and run with it - despite coming from Gatundu South. The others are Ndindi, Wahome, Kimani, Susan and Wa-Ichunga.
Mwangi Kiunjuri has a little window - otherwise, DPORK is slipping away. He needs to fold up TSP - it's useless - and join UDA - and start attacking Uhuru like his life depends on it. Ruto cannot and should not attack Uhuru - but Mt Kenya politicians should not pull punches otherwise angry voters will punish any pro-Uhuru politician next year.
What is Mt Kenya nation's anger against Uhuru?
1) Bringing in the vanquished/hated Raila and taking down the Ruto (the Jubilee hero) for illogical reasons.
2) Mismanaging the economy, being generally aloof, unreachable, and unresponsive to the needs of the people. Replacing Big4 with BBI. Behaving like he owns Mt Kenya the same way Raila owns Luos.
3) Threatening the life and properties and long-term stability of more than a million Kikuyus in RV by opening a war front there.
The revolution goes on - against a sitting lame-duck - with the hostile judiciary and hostile populace - but he owns executive and both house of parliament - and Raila.If Raila bolts - Uhuru will only own Matiangi and Kibicho :).
Your obsession with Kiunjuri is mind boggling. At times I think you even Kiunjuri himself furthermore you begun to irritate me like Robina. You might even be Robina.
Atleast your mind has now gotten enough oxygen to know we don't vote for cowards, Kuria has a bigger standing than Kiunjuri by far,I wouldn't mind voting Kuria not kati kati Kiunjuri.
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I change my mind if persuaded by reason and reality. MK Kiujuri fitted the bill for many reasons - but he is dropping the ball - by being indeed KatiKati - he needs to go totally frontal on Uhuru - and be ready to battle - if not - he should re-calibrate for Laikipia governoship.
So far I can tell Mt Kenya are angry - and will pick anything against Uhuru.
Your obsession with Kiunjuri is mind boggling. At times I think you even Kiunjuri himself furthermore you begun to irritate me like Robina. You might even be Robina.
Atleast your mind has now gotten enough oxygen to know we don't vote for cowards, Kuria has a bigger standing than Kiunjuri by far,I wouldn't mind voting Kuria not kati kati Kiunjuri.
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Njuri dont be hard on Pundit, atleast with him you can bring him back on track . Robina is a different story .She is a Proffesor who is ready to die for her believes here being Uhuru is handing over Mt Kenya to Raila through PK.
I personally fear Robina will be on a suicide watch come 2022. Therr is need to be elaborate with her .
He seems amongst the few who have identified the Mt Kenya nation's anger against Uhuru and run with it - despite coming from Gatundu South. The others are Ndindi, Wahome, Kimani, Susan and Wa-Ichunga.
Mwangi Kiunjuri has a little window - otherwise, DPORK is slipping away. He needs to fold up TSP - it's useless - and join UDA - and start attacking Uhuru like his life depends on it. Ruto cannot and should not attack Uhuru - but Mt Kenya politicians should not pull punches otherwise angry voters will punish any pro-Uhuru politician next year.
What is Mt Kenya nation's anger against Uhuru?
1) Bringing in the vanquished/hated Raila and taking down the Ruto (the Jubilee hero) for illogical reasons.
2) Mismanaging the economy, being generally aloof, unreachable, and unresponsive to the needs of the people. Replacing Big4 with BBI. Behaving like he owns Mt Kenya the same way Raila owns Luos.
3) Threatening the life and properties and long-term stability of more than a million Kikuyus in RV by opening a war front there.
The revolution goes on - against a sitting lame-duck - with the hostile judiciary and hostile populace - but he owns executive and both house of parliament - and Raila.If Raila bolts - Uhuru will only own Matiangi and Kibicho :).
Your obsession with Kiunjuri is mind boggling. At times I think you even Kiunjuri himself furthermore you begun to irritate me like Robina. You might even be Robina.
Atleast your mind has now gotten enough oxygen to know we don't vote for cowards, Kuria has a bigger standing than Kiunjuri by far,I wouldn't mind voting Kuria not kati kati Kiunjuri.
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Pundit and your boring over-analysis of Uhuru "crimes". Juja 70-30 Kuria-hustler victory is significant. Your MK should be very worried but he is too stupid to realize it. I agree with Njuri both MK and PK are absentee fools watching Ruto take over their backyard. Kuria might eat Kiunjuri lunch despite being from Kiambu. Potentially this could cause headache for Ruto... unless he let Gema to square in mini-primary for UDA runningmate.
Bonchari Matiang'i fool has failed to impress. But ODM won despite machinery and Handshake split. Hustler mere 26% vs Handshake 60%.. not good sign for hustler mass appeal narrative.
Overall from this by-election little has changed. Ruto has upper hand in cohesive Gema. Raila has upper hand in very splintered non-Gema. Raila BADLY needs to resurrect BBI or Ruto will finish him.
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Pundit BBI burial or resurrection will determine 2022.
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Pundit and your boring over-analysis of Uhuru "crimes". Juja 70-30 Kuria-hustler victory is significant. Your MK should be very worried but he is too stupid to realize it. I agree with Njuri both MK and PK are absentee fools watching Ruto take over their backyard. Kuria might eat Kiunjuri lunch despite being from Kiambu. Potentially this could cause headache for Ruto... unless he let Gema to square in mini-primary for UDA runningmate.
Bonchari Matiang'i fool has failed to impress. But ODM won despite machinery and Handshake split. Hustler mere 26% vs Handshake 60%.. not good sign for hustler mass appeal narrative.
Overall from this by-election little has changed. Ruto has upper hand in cohesive Gema. Raila has upper hand in very splintered non-Gema. Raila BADLY needs to resurrect BBI or Ruto will finish him.
A lot changed in this by election.. starting from political career of matiangi effectively ended in Bonchari and Uhuru value nosediving.Now handshake is going to be rebranded NASA but this time they won't agree to have jakom on top.Ruto goal now is 50 plus one...Raila and handshake crew are going to try for third time to aim for rerun.It's not plausible that Oka will stand down for jakom.So jakom will cobble his own thing
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Pundit BBI burial or resurrection will determine 2022.
It's really simple..if orders are not stayed BBI dies... because by the time appeal then supreme court is done it's will be 2023.The orders have to be stayed
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For Kuria, it is personal - heck ufool has made it personal for every one. Ngina won't want to hear him in Gatundu so he has to fight viciously.
He is fitting the bill of maverick unintended consequences of uhuru no gameplan but shut everyone out. I suspect he knows his limits. Just like Ndindi Nyoro or Ichung'wa, kuria won't mind retaining his MP seat as he mark times for governorship or a chance to contro a ministry where they stash some payoff loot. If he nails Kiambaa he may as well bury wishy washy kabogo and even kiunjuri.
the discontent in mt kenya can crown even a dog as kamotho would have it as long as it barking at ufool.
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Good point you bring out albeit indirectly, Raila never goes to any election to sin, he goes to form a Nusu mkate government from 2002, 2007,2013 and 2017.
In 2022 its evident he has resigned for the same. A person who is going for all out winning in 2022 would have a Plan 13 Months to the election.
Pundit and your boring over-analysis of Uhuru "crimes". Juja 70-30 Kuria-hustler victory is significant. Your MK should be very worried but he is too stupid to realize it. I agree with Njuri both MK and PK are absentee fools watching Ruto take over their backyard. Kuria might eat Kiunjuri lunch despite being from Kiambu. Potentially this could cause headache for Ruto... unless he let Gema to square in mini-primary for UDA runningmate.
Bonchari Matiang'i fool has failed to impress. But ODM won despite machinery and Handshake split. Hustler mere 26% vs Handshake 60%.. not good sign for hustler mass appeal narrative.
Overall from this by-election little has changed. Ruto has upper hand in cohesive Gema. Raila has upper hand in very splintered non-Gema. Raila BADLY needs to resurrect BBI or Ruto will finish him.
A lot changed in this by election.. starting from political career of matiangi effectively ended in Bonchari and Uhuru value nosediving.Now handshake is going to be rebranded NASA but this time they won't agree to have jakom on top.Ruto goal now is 50 plus one...Raila and handshake crew are going to try for third time to aim for rerun.It's not plausible that Oka will stand down for jakom.So jakom will cobble his own thing
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What people are not saying is that staying orders are inconsequential in comparison to to restraining orders. Mtajua hamjui.
Pundit BBI burial or resurrection will determine 2022.
It's really simple..if orders are not stayed BBI dies... because by the time appeal then supreme court is done it's will be 2023.The orders have to be stayed
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I thought you had some legal knowledge all this time. To stay orders simply mean to suspend their implementation. Restraining orders are part of the orders a court issues - and all can be stayed - if their is good reason to do so.
If orders are stayed - then it mean BBI continues - with understanding that if appeal fails - then orders will continue.
I don't see any good justification why any court would allow BBI to proceed - and spend more public money including in a referendum - when there is already good reason such referendum will be null and void.
Unless Raila and Uhuru will give 30B - of their personal money - plus already spent - to be put in some escrow account.
Uhuru can claim that BBI is very urgent for 2022 - but they are already running away from BBI being a gov project :) - so it will be hard for Junet Mohamed as a civilian to justify the urgency of BBI and the potential public expenditure of 30B going down the drain in a useless referendum.
What people are not saying is that staying orders are inconsequential in comparison to to restraining orders. Mtajua hamjui.
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Pundit , wont do a Tom and Jerry with you like Robina, wait and you will see what I mean.
Biggest mistake Pro BBI made was not challenging the constituion of the High court bench in Dec 2020. You can see the games the activist are already playing.
A question to you , if COA stay the orders will we have the refrendumn ?
I thought you had some legal knowledge all this time. To stay orders simply mean to suspend their implementation. Restraining orders are part of the orders a court issues - and all can be stayed - if their is good reason to do so.
If orders are stayed - then it mean BBI continues - with understanding that if appeal fails - then orders will continue.
I don't see any good justification why any court would allow BBI to proceed - and spend more public money including in a referendum - when there is already good reason such referendum will be null and void.
Unless Raila and Uhuru will give 30B - of their personal money - plus already spent - to be put in some escrow account.
Uhuru can claim that BBI is very urgent for 2022 - but they are already running away from BBI being a gov project :) - so it will be hard for Junet Mohamed as a civilian to justify the urgency of BBI and the potential public expenditure of 30B going down the drain in a useless referendum.
What people are not saying is that staying orders are inconsequential in comparison to to restraining orders. Mtajua hamjui.
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There are about 20 orders. If COA stays all the orders - then BBI reggae continues as if nothing happened. Parliament and Senate will present BBI to Uhuru for assent. Uhuru will give the bill IEBC - who will then proceed to the referendum - in 90 days or so.
The problem is the referendum is very costly - not only for IEBC - but for those For and Opposing - and with the heavy clouds (actually the hailstorm) from high court - NO COA will okay that. It would be reckless throwing of 40B or more down the drain if they later uphold high court ruling.
There has to be very good reason to stay those orders. BBI crew have to demonstrate the prejudice or injustice they will suffer irreparably - that they cannot wait for a few months for COA to deliberate on this.
For now - Uhuru should simply ask Kuhara to focus on saving him - from being indicted - otherwise the rest are lost causes.
COA can stay order #10 - if Uhuru pleads...for it's a serious indictment and he deserves the appeal process.
10. A declaration is hereby made that Mr Uhuru Kenyatta has contravened the chapter six of the Constitution and specifically, article 3(1)(a) (1) while initiating and promoting a constitution change process contrary to provisions of the Constitution on amendment of the Constitution.
Pundit , wont do a Tom and Jerry with you like Robina, wait and you will see what I mean.
Biggest mistake Pro BBI made was not challenging the constituion of the High court bench in Dec 2020. You can see the games the activist are already playing.
A question to you , if COA stay the orders will we have the refrendumn ?
I thought you had some legal knowledge all this time. To stay orders simply mean to suspend their implementation. Restraining orders are part of the orders a court issues - and all can be stayed - if their is good reason to do so.
If orders are stayed - then it mean BBI continues - with understanding that if appeal fails - then orders will continue.
I don't see any good justification why any court would allow BBI to proceed - and spend more public money including in a referendum - when there is already good reason such referendum will be null and void.
Unless Raila and Uhuru will give 30B - of their personal money - plus already spent - to be put in some escrow account.
Uhuru can claim that BBI is very urgent for 2022 - but they are already running away from BBI being a gov project :) - so it will be hard for Junet Mohamed as a civilian to justify the urgency of BBI and the potential public expenditure of 30B going down the drain in a useless referendum.
What people are not saying is that staying orders are inconsequential in comparison to to restraining orders. Mtajua hamjui.
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He seems amongst the few who have identified the Mt Kenya nation's anger against Uhuru and run with it - despite coming from Gatundu South. The others are Ndindi, Wahome, Kimani, Susan and Wa-Ichunga.
Mwangi Kiunjuri has a little window - otherwise, DPORK is slipping away. He needs to fold up TSP - it's useless - and join UDA - and start attacking Uhuru like his life depends on it. Ruto cannot and should not attack Uhuru - but Mt Kenya politicians should not pull punches otherwise angry voters will punish any pro-Uhuru politician next year.
What is Mt Kenya nation's anger against Uhuru?
1) Bringing in the vanquished/hated Raila and taking down the Ruto (the Jubilee hero) for illogical reasons.
2) Mismanaging the economy, being generally aloof, unreachable, and unresponsive to the needs of the people. Replacing Big4 with BBI. Behaving like he owns Mt Kenya the same way Raila owns Luos.
3) Threatening the life and properties and long-term stability of more than a million Kikuyus in RV by opening a war front there.
The revolution goes on - against a sitting lame-duck - with the hostile judiciary and hostile populace - but he owns executive and both house of parliament - and Raila.If Raila bolts - Uhuru will only own Matiangi and Kibicho :).
Your obsession with Kiunjuri is mind boggling. At times I think you even Kiunjuri himself furthermore you begun to irritate me like Robina. You might even be Robina.
Atleast your mind has now gotten enough oxygen to know we don't vote for cowards, Kuria has a bigger standing than Kiunjuri by far,I wouldn't mind voting Kuria not kati kati Kiunjuri.
:) there are worse things you can call me. Like calling me Noway is a redline.
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I see the Koome rigging as aimed straight at BBI appeals. She will pick BBI-friendly bench so I expect the orders to be likely stayed and eventually quashed. BBI is designed as 2022-combo so the timeline issue is moot.
There are about 20 orders. If COA stays all the orders - then BBI reggae continues as if nothing happened. Parliament and Senate will present BBI to Uhuru for assent. Uhuru will give the bill IEBC - who will then proceed to the referendum - in 90 days or so.
The problem is the referendum is very costly - not only for IEBC - but for those For and Opposing - and with the heavy clouds (actually the hailstorm) from high court - NO COA will okay that. It would be reckless throwing of 40B or more down the drain if they later uphold high court ruling.
There has to be very good reason to stay those orders. BBI crew have to demonstrate the prejudice or injustice they will suffer irreparably - that they cannot wait for a few months for COA to deliberate on this.
For now - Uhuru should simply ask Kuhara to focus on saving him - from being indicted - otherwise the rest are lost causes.
COA can stay order #10 - if Uhuru pleads...for it's a serious indictment and he deserves the appeal process.
10. A declaration is hereby made that Mr Uhuru Kenyatta has contravened the chapter six of the Constitution and specifically, article 3(1)(a) (1) while initiating and promoting a constitution change process contrary to provisions of the Constitution on amendment of the Constitution.
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A lot changed in this by election.. starting from political career of matiangi effectively ended in Bonchari and Uhuru value nosediving.Now handshake is going to be rebranded NASA but this time they won't agree to have jakom on top.Ruto goal now is 50 plus one...Raila and handshake crew are going to try for third time to aim for rerun.It's not plausible that Oka will stand down for jakom.So jakom will cobble his own thing
Yes Matiang'i is DOA... but you gotta agree his 27% Bonchari spoilt for Raila not Ruto. Matiang'i implosion benefits Raila - Uhuru nosedive benefits Ruto. Raila has upper hand in non-Gema and only need BBI to string Mdvds, Kalonzos, etc.
BBI is the big determinant. Watch out for Koome actions.
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Judiciary cannot self-immolate to please Uhuru, Koome or politicians. Never. The Ombudsman was crossing the redline. Who will trash their security of tenure to please BBI.
High court gave 5-0. I am sure there was executive pressure.
Of the 13 COA - finding 7 pro-BBI is an impossible task.
Again judiciary will never self-immolate for Raila, Uhuru and your short term political goals.
Asking Judiciary to sacrifice its independence is :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D - the most moronic decision ever visited on the same judiciary.
I see the Koome rigging as aimed straight at BBI appeals. She will pick BBI-friendly bench so I expect the orders to be likely stayed and eventually quashed. BBI is designed as 2022-combo so the timeline issue is moot.
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Uhuru just rigged in Koome - Ngatia told us Kibicho called few JSC crew to reduce his scores. She will carry Uhuru bag. How many judges are needed to overturn high court? 3 or 5? Koome just needs 3 BBI-amenable judges on the panel.
CJ is powerful due to power to select the panel. You don't need half of all judges just half of panel.
Judiciary cannot self-immolate to please Uhuru, Koome or politicians. Never. The Ombudsman was crossing the redline. Who will trash their security of tenure to please BBI.
High court gave 5-0. I am sure there was executive pressure.
Of the 13 COA - finding 7 pro-BBI is an impossible task.
Again judiciary will never self-immolate for Raila, Uhuru and your short term political goals.
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Anyway we will know if order is stayed maybe tomorrow (Friday). Then full hearing will be scheduled.
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You obsess with Uhuru and Kiunjuri.
Why non-Gema don't want Ruto
1) Greedy Ruto refuses to share power by opposing BBI
2) Ruto wants to extend Kikuyu-Kalenjin 60yr dictatorship to 100yrs
3) Ruto is super-tribal and his nusu mkate was 90% kalenjin. Even within Kalenjin Nandis have beef with him
Raila just need Uhuru & machinery for BBI and to ensure level field.
What is Mt Kenya nation's anger against Uhuru?
1) Bringing in the vanquished/hated Raila and taking down the Ruto (the Jubilee hero) for illogical reasons.
2) Mismanaging the economy, being generally aloof, unreachable, and unresponsive to the needs of the people. Replacing Big4 with BBI. Behaving like he owns Mt Kenya the same way Raila owns Luos.
3) Threatening the life and properties and long-term stability of more than a million Kikuyus in RV by opening a war front there.
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Noway I don't doubt your prowess - more about your courage to confidently air your views. Can you coherently decipher Mt Kenya politics for poor Robina? It is obvious Ruto has the upper hand - but the runningmate scramble looks headed to the wire. Is it Kiunjuri, Kuria, Karua, Muturi? Muturi is undergoing some ritual to be the new kingpin? Is Muturi Tangatanga, Kieleweke or his own thing? Prof Kagwanja seems to be conducting the rituals.
Njuri dont be hard on Pundit, atleast with him you can bring him back on track . Robina is a different story .She is a Proffesor who is ready to die for her believes here being Uhuru is handing over Mt Kenya to Raila through PK.
I personally fear Robina will be on a suicide watch come 2022. Therr is need to be elaborate with her .
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You're incorrigible. Even if you rig Koome - for her own self interest and self preservation - she will kill BBI - because 12 months from now - a new president will be inside statehouse - and will use Ombudsman to make her life impossible.
As for technicalities.
I believe 5 bench high court constitutional court can only be overturned by either 5 or more of the appellate court.
1 high court judge - normally takes 3 COA
3 high court bench ruling - takes 3-5 COA bench.
When it get to supreme court - it's all the 9 judges - to overturn normally 3, 5, 7 bench of COA>
Uhuru just rigged in Koome - Ngatia told us Kibicho called few JSC crew to reduce his scores. She will carry Uhuru bag. How many judges are needed to overturn high court? 3 or 5? Koome just needs 3 BBI-amenable judges on the panel.
CJ is powerful due to power to select the panel. You don't need half of all judges just half of panel.
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Which NON-GEMA are you talking about that Raila has?
On his own - Ruto beat Raila 10-NIL in non-gema.
But maybe you're confusing NON-GEMA like Kambasa and some luhyas - who supported Raila via proxy!
Don't bank on MaDVD, Kalonzo and Weta supporting Raila EVER AGAIN. It aint happening. They are not that stupid.
Otherwise if we go for NON-GEMA outside the BIG 5 (without candidates) - Ruto has an edge.
Start from MATUSA-SOMALI-BORANA - pastoralist - Ruto has big edge here - will almost win 90% of the vote here.
Next stop would be Coast - now I believe it's 50-50 - When uhuru was running it was 30-70 - because coast just hate Kenyatta name for land injustices.
Next stop would be Gusii - we saw it 50-50 - and with Matiangi - 30-30-30.
Therefore which NON-GEMA are you talking about.
Kambas will follow Kalonzo. Maragoli and Kakamega will follow MaDVD - with both Raila and Ruto sharing crumbs. Bungoma are in Ford-K and UDA (Raila is NILL).
Yes maybe Busia - Raila has an edge. The same way Ruto has an edge in Kuria.
You obsess with Uhuru and Kiunjuri.
Why non-Gema don't want Ruto
1) Greedy Ruto refuses to share power by opposing BBI
2) Ruto wants to extend Kikuyu-Kalenjin 60yr dictatorship to 100yrs
3) Ruto is super-tribal and his nusu mkate was 90% kalenjin. Even within Kalenjin Nandis have beef with him
Raila just need Uhuru & machinery for BBI and to ensure level field.
What is Mt Kenya nation's anger against Uhuru?
1) Bringing in the vanquished/hated Raila and taking down the Ruto (the Jubilee hero) for illogical reasons.
2) Mismanaging the economy, being generally aloof, unreachable, and unresponsive to the needs of the people. Replacing Big4 with BBI. Behaving like he owns Mt Kenya the same way Raila owns Luos.
3) Threatening the life and properties and long-term stability of more than a million Kikuyus in RV by opening a war front there.
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I doubt Koome would want to annoy the masses. She still has general election coming and wont want to go there as damaged goods. I think Gatheca put Koome there for the mbig one next year,he wouldn't waste his energy on mbimbi i.
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Precisely.
I doubt Koome would want to annoy the masses. She still hasnna election coming and wont want to go there as damaged goods. I think Gatheca put Koome there for the mbig one next year,he wouldn't waste his energy on mbimbi i
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In which case Koome merely needs 4 BBI-amenable judges to overturn high court. I am not convinced ombudsman is such scary monster - just bad taste, bad optics. The office reports to JSC and parliament - which is just transparency.
We should see soon - they didn't rig in Koome because she is such pretty Meru. It about control of judiciary.
You're incorrigible. Even if you rig Koome - for her own self interest and self preservation - she will kill BBI - because 12 months from now - a new president will be inside statehouse - and will use Ombudsman to make her life impossible.
As for technicalities.
I believe 5 bench high court constitutional court can only be overturned by either 5 or more of the appellate court.
1 high court judge - normally takes 3 COA
3 high court bench ruling - takes 3-5 COA bench.
When it get to supreme court - it's all the 9 judges - to overturn normally 3, 5, 7 bench of COA>
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The judiciary as an institution do not want ombudman. Ombusdman is not scary - it real - it's constitutional - it's equal to JSC. Putting something in constitution is big deal. Also they are giving JSC powers to suspend judges.
If you did not get one high court judge - you think you can bribe or intimidate even more senior judges at COA and SCORK - to kill their own institution.
Koome will disappoint you - in fact - I doubt she picks the bench at COA - it's normally the president of the court of appeal - it just at high court - that CJ normally picks a bench.
In which case Koome merely needs 4 BBI-amenable judges to overturn high court. I am not convinced ombudsman is such scary monster - just bad taste, bad optics. The office reports to JSC and parliament - which is just transparency.
We should see soon - they didn't rig in Koome because she is such pretty Meru. It about control of judiciary.
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Actually KOOME has zero role in COA. I can't recall when a CJ has picked a COA bench.
Section 13 (1) (b) of the Court of Appeal (Organization and Administration) Act, 2015 provides the President of the Court of Appeal is “…responsible for the allocation of cases and the constitution of benches, including ordinary and extraordinary benches, of the Court” amongst other functions.
So it either the acting president (Lady justice Karanja) or the presiding judge (randomly assigned by the system) - who will constitute a 5-7 bench judge upon application
Today acting on an oral application, a three-judge bench would direct that the President of the Court constitutes an enlarged bench…Sometimes, in response to mail from advocates, the Presiding Judge or President would empanel the bench
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NON-GEMA I mean outside Luo, Gema and Kalenjin. URP is basically Kalenjin - don't kid yourself - Boranas are <1%. MATUSA are not all URP - maybe 70%. Even 2017 they didn't all go Jubilee. Gusii if Matiang'i sits it out are 70% Raila. It Uhuru who brought them to Jubilee in 2017 not Ruto.
Kalonzos, Mdvds - Raila needs BBI to string them - it about their own interest not love for Raila. Otherwise Ruto will run circles around poor old baba. Anyway let see what CoA does tomorrow - if BBI is dead Raila might tosha kati-kati crew. Don't get too excited before BBI funeral.
Which NON-GEMA are you talking about that Raila has?
On his own - Ruto beat Raila 10-NIL in non-gema.
But maybe you're confusing NON-GEMA like Kambasa and some luhyas - who supported Raila via proxy!
Don't bank on MaDVD, Kalonzo and Weta supporting Raila EVER AGAIN. It aint happening. They are not that stupid.
Otherwise if we go for NON-GEMA outside the BIG 5 (without candidates) - Ruto has an edge.
Start from MATUSA-SOMALI-BORANA - pastoralist - Ruto has big edge here - will almost win 90% of the vote here.
Next stop would be Coast - now I believe it's 50-50 - When uhuru was running it was 30-70 - because coast just hate Kenyatta name for land injustices.
Next stop would be Gusii - we saw it 50-50 - and with Matiangi - 30-30-30.
Therefore which NON-GEMA are you talking about.
Kambas will follow Kalonzo. Maragoli and Kakamega will follow MaDVD - with both Raila and Ruto sharing crumbs. Bungoma are in Ford-K and UDA (Raila is NILL).
Yes maybe Busia - Raila has an edge. The same way Ruto has an edge in Kuria.
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So has them or he need BBI to get them :). Remove the BIG 5 Until April 2022 - when the deadline for filling coalition will be due. Don't bank of any of BIG 5.
Non-GEMA outside BIG 5 - 30% or so remaining - Ruto has an edge.
As for Gusii - nothing could be further from the truth.
Matiangi has eaten Ruto lunch - but now with his unceremonious exit post-Bonchari - I expect Jubilee Gusii to move to Ruto.
Jubilee Gusii beat ODM like a drum.But let work with 50-50.
BBI will only be resuscitated in parliament - and they need to start soon :)
NON-GEMA I mean outside Luo, Gema and Kalenjin. URP is basically Kalenjin - don't kid yourself - Boranas are <1%. MATUSA are not all URP - maybe 70%. Even 2017 they didn't all go Jubilee. Gusii if Matiang'i sits it out are 70% Raila. It Uhuru who brought them to Jubilee in 2017 not Ruto.
Kalonzos, Mdvds - Raila needs BBI to string them - it about their own interest not love for Raila. Otherwise Ruto will run circles around poor old baba. Anyway let see what CoA does tomorrow - if BBI is dead Raila might tosha kati-kati crew. Don't get too excited before BBI funeral.
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Raila has NASA plus PK lined up for 5 BBI posts. Without hybrid he is dead. One Kenya was formed to kill UDA in Kamba & Luhya which it did very well.
Gusii - 70% Raila. 2017 Uhuru-Raila split 50-50 thanks to Matiang'i not Ruto. Ruto had no Gusii lunch to be eaten. All Ongwaes, Ongeris, O'Mogenis, Ong'eras are ODM. Jubilee mere Nyamira women rep. Don't forget the old Gusii beef with Kipsigis. I see Ruto is trying to impeach Matiang'i now so no love lost. But hustler nation big rallies amounted to little as in most non-Gema.
Matusa-NFD URP areas Ruto maybe 70%.
Coast depends on Mvurya and Kingi - they lean BBI so far - obviously want to be MP and CS. Joho is Raila diehard. Ruto on his own with Jumwa or Mwashetani is nothing.
So has them or he need BBI to get them :). Remove the BIG 5 Until April 2022 - when the deadline for filling coalition will be due. Don't bank of any of BIG 5.
Non-GEMA outside BIG 5 - 30% or so remaining - Ruto has an edge.
As for Gusii - nothing could be further from the truth.
Matiangi has eaten Ruto lunch - but now with his unceremonious exit post-Bonchari - I expect Jubilee Gusii to move to Ruto.
Jubilee Gusii beat ODM like a drum.But let work with 50-50.
BBI will only be resuscitated in parliament - and they need to start soon :)
NON-GEMA I mean outside Luo, Gema and Kalenjin. URP is basically Kalenjin - don't kid yourself - Boranas are <1%. MATUSA are not all URP - maybe 70%. Even 2017 they didn't all go Jubilee. Gusii if Matiang'i sits it out are 70% Raila. It Uhuru who brought them to Jubilee in 2017 not Ruto.
Kalonzos, Mdvds - Raila needs BBI to string them - it about their own interest not love for Raila. Otherwise Ruto will run circles around poor old baba. Anyway let see what CoA does tomorrow - if BBI is dead Raila might tosha kati-kati crew. Don't get too excited before BBI funeral.
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No hybrid no BBI.
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Days later established lawyers discuss the argument we had .
Listen from minute 19. Do listen from an objective perpective ,si vita .
There are about 20 orders. If COA stays all the orders - then BBI reggae continues as if nothing happened. Parliament and Senate will present BBI to Uhuru for assent. Uhuru will give the bill IEBC - who will then proceed to the referendum - in 90 days or so.
The problem is the referendum is very costly - not only for IEBC - but for those For and Opposing - and with the heavy clouds (actually the hailstorm) from high court - NO COA will okay that. It would be reckless throwing of 40B or more down the drain if they later uphold high court ruling.
There has to be very good reason to stay those orders. BBI crew have to demonstrate the prejudice or injustice they will suffer irreparably - that they cannot wait for a few months for COA to deliberate on this.
For now - Uhuru should simply ask Kuhara to focus on saving him - from being indicted - otherwise the rest are lost causes.
COA can stay order #10 - if Uhuru pleads...for it's a serious indictment and he deserves the appeal process.
10. A declaration is hereby made that Mr Uhuru Kenyatta has contravened the chapter six of the Constitution and specifically, article 3(1)(a) (1) while initiating and promoting a constitution change process contrary to provisions of the Constitution on amendment of the Constitution.
Pundit , wont do a Tom and Jerry with you like Robina, wait and you will see what I mean.
Biggest mistake Pro BBI made was not challenging the constituion of the High court bench in Dec 2020. You can see the games the activist are already playing.
A question to you , if COA stay the orders will we have the refrendumn ?
I thought you had some legal knowledge all this time. To stay orders simply mean to suspend their implementation. Restraining orders are part of the orders a court issues - and all can be stayed - if their is good reason to do so.
If orders are stayed - then it mean BBI continues - with understanding that if appeal fails - then orders will continue.
I don't see any good justification why any court would allow BBI to proceed - and spend more public money including in a referendum - when there is already good reason such referendum will be null and void.
Unless Raila and Uhuru will give 30B - of their personal money - plus already spent - to be put in some escrow account.
Uhuru can claim that BBI is very urgent for 2022 - but they are already running away from BBI being a gov project :) - so it will be hard for Junet Mohamed as a civilian to justify the urgency of BBI and the potential public expenditure of 30B going down the drain in a useless referendum.
What people are not saying is that staying orders are inconsequential in comparison to to restraining orders. Mtajua hamjui.
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I listened to the video and nothing support your ignorant restraining order bullcrap.Stay order on all the 2O orders is almost impossible..leave alone just order being stayed because they cannot even justify how urgent this is and who will pick the taps..besides don't expect exparte stay orders..this will go to proper hearing of all the sides..gov versus 30 lawyers from 8 petitions.Its hopeless for kuhara.End of day no judge like BBI because they never consulted judiciary before their nonsense about ombudsman and JSC...dead as dodo.Only a fool like Raila thinks it has any remote chance.
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Since when was the CJ position subject to popular vote? The Judicary unlike the political class is not there to please the public.
I doubt Koome would want to annoy the masses. She still has general election coming and wont want to go there as damaged goods. I think Gatheca put Koome there for the mbig one next year,he wouldn't waste his energy on mbimbi i.
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Without the public support - and with hostile executive - and parliament - I don't know how she would survive. The public support is key - for all the arms of thegov - or at least the goodwill.
Since when was the CJ position subject to popular vote? The Judicary unlike the political class is not there to please the public.
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Public support, my foot! EVeryone is saying she was rigged in but she stays in office. Public support once CJ is sworn in means squat. If public support is anything then the thief cannot run for public office.
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Without public support - life becomes very difficult- ask dictators how difficult to rule it is. For a CJ despite the security of tenure - you'll be having headache every time as people alleges biasness and all sort of accusations. For koome to survive 8yrs - he has to think long term - otherwise you can appease Uhuru now - and lose the next 7yrs - and at that stage of her career - she is looking to make a mark. And again the powers of a CJ are so limited - it almost foolhardy to soil it.
So Koome should spend the next 1yr running away from lameduck and try to win back public support...because she is starting with obvious setback that she is CJ - not because of her illustrious career as reformist and human rights lawyer - but GEMA apogee. Such a shame because she clearly deserve to be a CJ - so did Ngatia and Ouko.
Public support, my foot! EVeryone is saying she was rigged in but she stays in office. Public support once CJ is sworn in means squat. If public support is anything then the thief cannot run for public office.
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Certainly you didnt watch. Very unfortunate for a person who is following the case closely. Confirms your weakness of know it all.
For your benefit will write verbatim the discussion .word to word.
TOM OJIENDA- The challenge that Justice Musinga has is that alot of certificates and applications have been pending in the court of appeal for a while now without a substantive president since Judge Ouko took leave to seek a position in the supreme court . Alot of files and applications have been pending including applications that have recently been filed.His task would be to enpanel judges to hear some of these matters , I think today Raila Odinga filed another application. I must say This .This is A very delicate time, if the court of appeal grants a stay order after the parties meets the three leaves that are requored to grant a stay mandatory extreme urgency public importance , if they meet all those requirements them the referendum process, christened as reggae will continue , if the court declines to grant the stay even IEBC will be incapable of proceeding with ots work including undertaking the referendumn that is in the mouth or lip of every proponent of BBI, so we have those real challenges and I agree with Akisa that this is a delicate time and the judges who will be selected or who will in the panel to hear these cases have a task at hand .Whatever decision they make .
For the Chief Justice gladly she does not empanel the jidges at the court pf appeal this is a matter that would as well end up in the Supreme Court.She would have to preside over .Im sure either way or whatever way it goes in the court of appeal this is litigation that will end up in Supreme Court. And Im sure the Supreme Court is waiting to settle this political question at a very crucial political moment because remember this impacts future of this country whichever way this goes will impact on how the election is conducted and the outcome of that election .It impacts on the political class and on the people of Kenya ultimately.
KIBE MUINGAI: At the stage in Court Of Appeal , If the stay is granted for example looking at it from a position of law it would be Controversial kind of stay , remembering that the main order that was given by the high court is actually a negative order , a Permanent Injuction against IEBC from conducting the referendumn and ofcourse another order of declaration saying that the BBI process is Null and Void and therefore these categories of orders ordinarily are dealt with by either SETTING ASIDE or AFFIRMING them. Now the choice of a stay or application of a stay isgoing to be that if it is granted from a purely technical point of view it is going to be somehow controversial and more importantly without hearing the appeal BBI or Reggae as Proffessor Ojienda says were to continue based on such an order of stay , then for all practical purposes the application for stay would have resolved the appeal itself .Therefore this is why Im saying these BIG decisions if they are made on account of stay application then its going the way of those people talking about Judicialization of Politics and Politicization of Judiciary .Those arguments will even be more live because you cannot win either way.
Personally I was of the view that these kind of situation if a strategy had been taken like lets hear this appeal lets have a Judgement substantively deciding whether the 5 judges were right or wrong . So that we do not start on a note that is highly politicized particularly for the new Chief Justice .But then again this is for the eminent lawyers who have been appointed by the various parties to argue it.
I listened to the video and nothing support your ignorant restraining order bullcrap.Stay order on all the 2O orders is almost impossible..leave alone just order being stayed because they cannot even justify how urgent this is and who will pick the taps..besides don't expect exparte stay orders..this will go to proper hearing of all the sides..gov versus 30 lawyers from 8 petitions.Its hopeless for kuhara.End of day no judge like BBI because they never consulted judiciary before their nonsense about ombudsman and JSC...dead as dodo.Only a fool like Raila thinks it has any remote chance.
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What are you trying to say Mr know nothing.I still don't get what novel thing that two lawyers said.To stay or not to stay all the 20 or individual orders will depend on CoA bench and I don't see how IEBC or Uhuru can be allowed to continue to spend public money in a process that has little chance of success in the appeal court.It would be crazy like kibe say to stay those orders and continue with the case.Therefore I don't see any stay application being successful.Nobody is in hurry except Uhuru razing against time instead of planning his retirement.My prediction stay orders will be rejected except maybe a few and the appeal will be heard for some months..in any case if stay orders are not granted it end of BBI appetite for the two principals..so yes it's the main application..ignore the appeal.But CoA are even smarter than high court and know such games.This will end swiftly when stay application is rejected as it should.Uhuru will be left alone to battle his violation of chapter six with kuhara but for Raila Bbi ends there.And focus shift to catching up with Ruto on 2022.
But your Kuhara can convince the COA to allow more wanton wastage of public money if Uhuru and Raila promise to pick the tabs. That to me is the bottomline. BBI has already costed the public so much money - and before we know from the auditor - who will handle that - possibly Uhuru - we want to stay the orders and allow more wastage. Uchawi?
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Rv will be candid with you, you lack clarity of mind, just like Robina and you sound the same wouldnt be suprised if you are the same person, you use alot of words to say nothing. Refer to below our argument was about stay orders and their practibality you were of the opinion that stay orders will lead to a referendumn . I opined highly likely wont be granted for the reasons Kibe states in the KTN show. That is a week before. Youve softend and are in support of the same view. Why argue if you have no facts . In matters legal you seem to always be behind . An advice to you get your facts right before laying it bear. Example Njuri writes less but he is always point on . Learn from that.
What are you trying to say Mr know nothing.I still don't get what novel thing that two lawyers said.To stay or not to stay all the 20 or individual orders will depend on CoA bench and I don't see how IEBC or Uhuru can be allowed to continue to spend public money in a process that has little chance of success in the appeal court.It would be crazy like kibe say to stay those orders and continue with the case.Therefore I don't see any stay application being successful.Nobody is in hurry except Uhuru razing against time instead of planning his retirement.My prediction stay orders will be rejected except maybe a few and the appeal will be heard for some months..in any case if stay orders are not granted it end of BBI appetite for the two principals..so yes it's the main application..ignore the appeal.But CoA are even smarter than high court and know such games.This will end swiftly when stay application is rejected as it should.Uhuru will be left alone to battle his violation of chapter six with kuhara but for Raila Bbi ends there.And focus shift to catching up with Ruto on 2022.
But your Kuhara can convince the COA to allow more wanton wastage of public money if Uhuru and Raila promise to pick the tabs. That to me is the bottomline. BBI has already costed the public so much money - and before we know from the auditor - who will handle that - possibly Uhuru - we want to stay the orders and allow more wastage. Uchawi?
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Generally that's how it will be. Lots of time wasted in CoA and they will dismiss appeal. BBI will be saved at Supreme Court not CoA. Musinga judges will go through the motions and try to get themselves a name like Prof Ngugi but Supreme Court will check them. That is judicial protocol and checkmating at various levels just like Executive and Parliament checking judiciary. Later if BBI goes through we'll have Ombudsman icing on the cake.
BBI fans are also the public. For some reason, just because they have baptized themselves hustlers, thieves and conmen think they are the only public.
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Obtuse! Jesus! There is nothing you can teach me in Law and many subjects because I pack just double your IQ. Accept and move on. I have NOT softened a bit. Please use Nipate search function to see what I said about stay orders - long before they even filled it -
Rv will be candid with you, you lack clarity of mind, just like Robina and you sound the same wouldnt be suprised if you are the same person, you use alot of words to say nothing. Refer to below our argument was about stay orders and their practibality you were of the opinion that stay orders will lead to a referendumn . I opined highly likely wont be granted for the reasons Kibe states in the KTN show. That is a week before. Youve softend and are in support of the same view. Why argue if you have no facts . In matters legal you seem to always be behind . An advice to you get your facts right before laying it bear. Example Njuri writes less but he is always point on . Learn from that.
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The beauty is if these BBI proponents are truly for a constitution change they will remain in the trenches that long. But we know they are not. They were only interested in 2022. They will not wait for COA to take their time - leave alone Supreme Court. Maybe Uhuru will appeal his own culpability to avoid paying billions but certainly by time it goes to supreme court sometime next year - the proponents would have lost appetitie for this.
The only genuine people pursuing constitution change are Punguza Mzingo - they lost - but they are back - I remember signing their petition again .
Generally that's how it will be. Lots of time wasted in CoA and they will dismiss appeal. BBI will be saved at Supreme Court not CoA. Musinga judges will go through the motions and try to get themselves a name like Prof Ngugi but Supreme Court will check them. That is judicial protocol and checkmating at various levels just like Executive and Parliament checking judiciary. Later if BBI goes through we'll have Ombudsman icing on the cake.
BBI fans are also the public. For some reason, just because they have baptized themselves hustlers, thieves and conmen think they are the only public.
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Nowayaha wa Kuhara - of the restraining order:) infamity
https://nipate.net/index.php?topic=10019.msg90505#msg90505
This is May 14th - did I copy you or Kibe. This was exactly 1 day or so after BBI rulling.
It's down to them getting stay orders or not. If they don't it over - dead as dodo. I think Kuhara want to process Martha Koome quickly and for quid pro quid for a friendly bench. The problem CoA has 13 judges....with most out of Nairobi station. So already a big challenge before it starts...constituting a 7 bench.
Will judiciary at any self-immolate. No.That is why the high court 5 bench was unanimous. Martha Koome I know will not be part of BBI and any such shenagians..it soil her reputation as reformist. It over for Uhuru.
Anyway, they have 14 days to appeal...but definitely CoA is as hostile as high court...because Uhuru has overworked them.
Does Uhuru want to really appeal and get another egg on his face?.I doubt. So this BBI is going to die quietly.
But BABA the COW seem to have swalloed the bait -line, hook and sinker. He should have taken the cue from high court and run.But he going to become part of a hopeless appeal and tie himself further to a dead project- with one year to election :)Big idiot.
Uhuru will therefore appeal to keep Baba and his cows busy :)
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Comeon RV, on matters law and economic you are D material. Thats a fact , I give you your A on matters politics.. You talk of IQ there is a reason you are not employed. Same reason I told you the likes of Ruto would never keep you close.
Obtuse! Jesus! There is nothing you can teach me in Law and many subjects because I pack just double your IQ. Accept and move on. I have NOT softened a bit. Please use Nipate search function to see what I said about stay orders - long before they even filled it -
Rv will be candid with you, you lack clarity of mind, just like Robina and you sound the same wouldnt be suprised if you are the same person, you use alot of words to say nothing. Refer to below our argument was about stay orders and their practibality you were of the opinion that stay orders will lead to a referendumn . I opined highly likely wont be granted for the reasons Kibe states in the KTN show. That is a week before. Youve softend and are in support of the same view. Why argue if you have no facts . In matters legal you seem to always be behind . An advice to you get your facts right before laying it bear. Example Njuri writes less but he is always point on . Learn from that.
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I am self-taught in matters law, economics and politics -etc - and by profession, I am a software engineer - but I certainly have the IQ to understand many things - naturally. On the other hand - you're obtuse. Why do you think I am not employed :) As for Ruto -and me - I bet many of politicians come online - to read my posts :). I don't need to work with Ruto because I already have good job.
Now let go back to stay orders..I talked about them the day after BBI rulling - and you're here showing me a video of Prof Ojienda and Kibe - 14 days almost later.
By then nobody was talking about staying those orders..
It's down to them getting stay orders or not. If they don't it over - dead as dodo. I think Kuhara want to process Martha Koome quickly and for quid pro quid for a friendly bench. The problem CoA has 13 judges....with most out of Nairobi station. So already a big challenge before it starts...constituting a 7 bench.
Will judiciary at any self-immolate. No.That is why the high court 5 bench was unanimous. Martha Koome I know will not be part of BBI and any such shenagians..it soil her reputation as reformist. It over for Uhuru.
Anyway, they have 14 days to appeal...but definitely CoA is as hostile as high court...because Uhuru has overworked them.
Does Uhuru want to really appeal and get another egg on his face?.I doubt. So this BBI is going to die quietly.
But BABA the COW seem to have swalloed the bait -line, hook and sinker. He should have taken the cue from high court and run.But he going to become part of a hopeless appeal and tie himself further to a dead project- with one year to election :)Big idiot.
Uhuru will therefore appeal to keep Baba and his cows busy :)
Comeon RV, on matters law and economic you are D material. Thats a fact , I give you your A on matters politics.. You talk of IQ there is a reason you are not employed. Same reason I told you the likes of Ruto would never keep you close.
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Besides tell me how you can do politics - without understanding law, economics, history and all the many subjects :). My late father introduced me to all these subjects at a very early age - outside the usual classwork - and as an 11yr old - I was already interested in many such issues - and I had already known enough from reading history to dismiss Jesus and his religion
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You perform poorly matters law and economics. Even the post you quote you indicate Koome will select the bench , very wrong . You didnt even know the constituion of COA and how it operates. I had to come in and tell you and thats when you changed the narative.. I also told you Uhuru and Raila will appeal. You opined differently. Even the post you quote says of the same. Matter of fact this will go to the wire . Supreme Court will have to determine and as TO says this is a political question . All said and done from a political angle , Ruto has an upper hand and he knows it.
I am self-taught in matters law, economics and politics -etc - and by profession, I am a software engineer - but I certainly have the IQ to understand many things - naturally. On the other hand - you're obtuse. Why do you think I am not employed :) As for Ruto -and me - I bet many of politicians come online - to read my posts :). I don't need to work with Ruto because I already have good job.
Now let go back to stay orders..I talked about them the day after BBI rulling - and you're here showing me a video of Prof Ojienda and Kibe - 14 days almost later.
By then nobody was talking about staying those orders..
It's down to them getting stay orders or not. If they don't it over - dead as dodo. I think Kuhara want to process Martha Koome quickly and for quid pro quid for a friendly bench. The problem CoA has 13 judges....with most out of Nairobi station. So already a big challenge before it starts...constituting a 7 bench.
Will judiciary at any self-immolate. No.That is why the high court 5 bench was unanimous. Martha Koome I know will not be part of BBI and any such shenagians..it soil her reputation as reformist. It over for Uhuru.
Anyway, they have 14 days to appeal...but definitely CoA is as hostile as high court...because Uhuru has overworked them.
Does Uhuru want to really appeal and get another egg on his face?.I doubt. So this BBI is going to die quietly.
But BABA the COW seem to have swalloed the bait -line, hook and sinker. He should have taken the cue from high court and run.But he going to become part of a hopeless appeal and tie himself further to a dead project- with one year to election :)Big idiot.
Uhuru will therefore appeal to keep Baba and his cows busy :)
Comeon RV, on matters law and economic you are D material. Thats a fact , I give you your A on matters politics.. You talk of IQ there is a reason you are not employed. Same reason I told you the likes of Ruto would never keep you close.
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Good question , how has Uhuru performed matters
Politics
Economics
Law
Grade him ....
Besides tell me how you can do politics - without understanding law, economics, history and all the many subjects :). My late father introduced me to all these subjects at a very early age - outside the usual classwork - and as an 11yr old - I was already interested in many such issues - and I had already known enough from reading history to dismiss Jesus and his religion
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Lying requires intelligence. But you're a well-known IDIOT. Yes indeed I was mistaken that COA bench would be selected by CJ. This was mostly due to Robina and the crowd looking for any straws.
But sir - you never- told me about CJ not selecting a bench.
I personally remember from my memory - while typing it - that I didn't recall any previous CJ doing this - and I went on to google search - and found the COA administrative act - and pasted here.
Again you're lying about the Uhuru-Raila appeal. Just read my conclusion.
Uhuru KNOWS BBI is mortally totally kaput - and has zero chance of success. Just like Uhuru knew when he was breaking the law from ab initio in BBI. Do not think Uhuru doesn't have lawyers to cross all the ts and dot all the Is.
If it didn't happen - it was by design. The time-wasting was also by design - BBI 1.0 - BBI 2.0 - all the way to BBI 4.0.
Now why would Uhuru appeal
1) High court discovered he knew BBI was illegal from ab initio and personally fingered him. They fell short of making him pay but left it for Auditor General to come up with total bill and for anybody to send it to PRIVATE BOX GATUNDU.
2) Raila is an idiot - and despite high court telling him Uhuru is playing you - he accepts more time-wasting appeal - while knowing the chance of success is almost nill.
In short, Uhuru is appealing for two reasons
1) Waste Raila time and buy himself peace in totally kaput BBI
2) Rescue himself from paying BBI billions.
The only order Uhuru really cares about now is that dangerous one that out him for using public money in political mischief called BBI.
Raila like Nowayah are TOO OBTUSE to read this.
You perform poorly matters law and economics. Even the post you quote you indicate Koome will select the bench , very wrong . You didnt even know the constituion of COA and how it operates. I had to come in and tell you and thats when you changed the narative.. I also told you Uhuru and Raila will appeal. You opined differently. Even the post you quote says of the same. Matter of fact this will go to the wire . Supreme Court will have to determine and as TO says this is a political question . All said and done from a political angle , Ruto has an upper hand and he knows it.
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Uhuru cannot perform. He is a good big picture guy. Has big IQ - well read in economics and history - obviously from Amhrest.
What ails Uhuru is performing - he has no bone or muscle for the grind - so he good chairman of a corporation or ceremonial president - he cannot wield executive authority. So yes without Ruto - Uhuru cannot find his bottoms.
Someone like Ruto is those rare multi-talented folks.
And therefore his performance without Ruto is zero.
1) Economics - Jubilee 2.0 is doing badly - well COVID can be blamed but it was going down.
2) Law - He is at war with judiciary.
3) Politics - He is losing GEMA having long lost the country. If he doesn't reconcile with GEMA - he will end up lonely like Moi.
Finally history will not be kind to him like it wasn't to Moi.
Good question , how has Uhuru performed matters
Politics
Economics
Law
Grade him ....
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RVP, you simply do not understand how court works and that the Right of Appeal is a right as enshrined in our constitution. So, stop running yourself all over the place.
All that the judges have to assess is whether you have an arguable point (even just one arguable point) does not have to be 10 or 100, whether it will eventually succeed or not will be a matter of the hearing of the arguments!
My take is that the application is for a stay of the entire/all of High Court ruling. If a stay is to be granted, it will not be selective or piecemeal, it will be omnibus and as per the entire ruling and the CoA Judges will not go nit-picking what to stay and what not to.
So with that, a stay having been granted, the BBI process proceeds as the hearing continues in parallel. This is why it is in everybody's interest that the hearing and finalization of this stage proceeds as fast as possible so that the Supreme Court (as it will surely end there) can also hear and deal with the matter ASAP. As we all know the Supreme Court so far has been rather un-imaginative and quite a disappointment on matters jurisprudence and enlightened pronouncement; in a word, they have been quite lazy and afraid to explore the law and make ground breaking judgements. Most times they have absconded their duty and simply kicked the can down the road with totally uninspiring rulings!
My personal opinion.... the High Court judges did make some very ground breaking jurisprudence. I would say very positive things they said, a lot of which we should embrace for posterity and protection of our progressive constitution and general rule of law. I think though that they let quite a bit of stuff through that require clarity or unambiguity. It is on these things like the IEBC, referendum process and public participation that I would wish the Supreme Court to make pronunciation on and remove any ambiguity.
Finally as you know, the original BBI was a noble idea which a lot of us embraced wholeheartedly but further down the road was infiltrated by personal whims and wishes including the 70 constituencies nonsense... these were some of the mischief which Raila could not obviously on his own stop as he was outgunned by the other collaborators. I would for example have wished for a decrease of counties to 14 as per original Bomas Draft. Other stuff sneaked into the BBI sort of poisoned it further.
What are you trying to say Mr know nothing.I still don't get what novel thing that two lawyers said.To stay or not to stay all the 20 or individual orders will depend on CoA bench and I don't see how IEBC or Uhuru can be allowed to continue to spend public money in a process that has little chance of success in the appeal court.It would be crazy like kibe say to stay those orders and continue with the case.Therefore I don't see any stay application being successful.Nobody is in hurry except Uhuru razing against time instead of planning his retirement.My prediction stay orders will be rejected except maybe a few and the appeal will be heard for some months..in any case if stay orders are not granted it end of BBI appetite for the two principals..so yes it's the main application..ignore the appeal.But CoA are even smarter than high court and know such games.This will end swiftly when stay application is rejected as it should.Uhuru will be left alone to battle his violation of chapter six with kuhara but for Raila Bbi ends there.And focus shift to catching up with Ruto on 2022.
But your Kuhara can convince the COA to allow more wanton wastage of public money if Uhuru and Raila promise to pick the tabs. That to me is the bottomline. BBI has already costed the public so much money - and before we know from the auditor - who will handle that - possibly Uhuru - we want to stay the orders and allow more wastage. Uchawi?
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I stop reading on 3rd para - but let me give you one reason why stay orders will not be granted.
Long before the judgement that gave us the 20 orders this month - the high court had INJUNCTED IEBC as early as last year or this year Feb - and then Uhuru was similarly INJUNCTED on march.
IF YOU COULD NOT SET ASIDE INJUNCTIONS - HOW DO YOU HOPE TO STAY JUDGEMENT ORDERS
The reason is simple - allowing Uhuru to sign BBI into law or IEBC to hold the referendum - will make the appeal almost useless - and will cost the country DEARLY.
So IEBC or Uhuru will not be allowed to proceed with BBI until the matter is heard in 2022. If they were in a hurry - nobody stopped them in 2018 from finishing BBI and have enough time to litigate this to SCORK as was more than EXPECTED it would be controversial.
The rest of the orders can be stayed. I don't think there is a hurry for example to find Uhuru guilty of violating chapter six. It cost nothing to stay such orders...zero prejudice..zero cost..zero urgency. Uhuru will eventually pick the tabs when hostile gov or court send the BBI bill to him.
IF ANYBODY WANTS IEBC ALLOWED TO SPEND PUBLIC MONEY AS APPEAL IS HEARD - PLEASE PUT THE MONEY IN ESCROW ACCOUNT - IF YOU WIN THE APPEAL - YOU WILL BE REFUNDED - IF YOU LOSE - TOO bad.
Otherwise what nonsense argument will allow a sane sober judge to authorize expenditure of another 15-20B by IEBC on a referendum that has already been declared NULL AND VOID!!!!!!!!!
Who will be that irresponsible? I mean we still a have to wait for auditor general to tell us how much money has been wasted so far.
RVP, you simply do not understand how court works and that the Right of Appeal is a right as enshrined in our constitution. So, stop running yourself all over the place.
All that the judges have to assess is whether you have an arguable point (even just one arguable point) does not have to be 10 or 100, whether it will eventually succeed or not will be a matter of the hearing of the arguments!
My take is that the application is for a stay of the entire/all of High Court ruling. If a stay is to be granted, it will not be selective or piecemeal, it will be omnibus and as per the entire ruling and the CoA Judges will not go nit-picking what to stay and what not to.
So with that, a stay having been granted, the BBI process proceeds as the hearing continues in parallel. This is why it is in everybody's interest that the hearing and finalization of this stage proceeds as fast as possible so that the Supreme Court (as it will surely end there) can also hear and deal with the matter ASAP. As we all know the Supreme Court so far has been rather un-imaginative and quite a disappointment on matters jurisprudence and enlightened pronouncement; in a word, they have been quite lazy and afraid to explore the law and make ground breaking judgements. Most times they have absconded their duty and simply kicked the can down the road with totally uninspiring rulings!
My personal opinion.... the High Court judges did make some very ground breaking jurisprudence. I would say very positive things they said, a lot of which we should embrace for posterity and protection of our progressive constitution and general rule of law. I think though that they let quite a bit of stuff through that require clarity or unambiguity. It is on these things like the IEBC, referendum process and public participation that I would wish the Supreme Court to make pronunciation on and remove any ambiguity.
Finally as you know, the original BBI was a noble idea which a lot of us embraced wholeheartedly but further down the road was infiltrated by personal whims and wishes including the 70 constituencies nonsense... these were some of the mischief which Raila could not obviously on his own stop as he was outgunned by the other collaborators. I would for example have wished for a decrease of counties to 14 as per original Bomas Draft. Other stuff sneaked into the BBI sort of poisoned it further.
What are you trying to say Mr know nothing.I still don't get what novel thing that two lawyers said.To stay or not to stay all the 20 or individual orders will depend on CoA bench and I don't see how IEBC or Uhuru can be allowed to continue to spend public money in a process that has little chance of success in the appeal court.It would be crazy like kibe say to stay those orders and continue with the case.Therefore I don't see any stay application being successful.Nobody is in hurry except Uhuru razing against time instead of planning his retirement.My prediction stay orders will be rejected except maybe a few and the appeal will be heard for some months..in any case if stay orders are not granted it end of BBI appetite for the two principals..so yes it's the main application..ignore the appeal.But CoA are even smarter than high court and know such games.This will end swiftly when stay application is rejected as it should.Uhuru will be left alone to battle his violation of chapter six with kuhara but for Raila Bbi ends there.And focus shift to catching up with Ruto on 2022.
But your Kuhara can convince the COA to allow more wanton wastage of public money if Uhuru and Raila promise to pick the tabs. That to me is the bottomline. BBI has already costed the public so much money - and before we know from the auditor - who will handle that - possibly Uhuru - we want to stay the orders and allow more wastage. Uchawi?
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Well it just confirms once again that you are clueless on how the court works! The permanent injunction was for the pendance or period until the case is heard and determined. Now that the case is determined these injunctions are similarly replaced by this ruling. So a stay of this ruling technically means that you can proceed with your everyday life until the appeal is heard and determined. On the other hand, a stay or "leave to appeal"
can be is normally granted with sanctions or conditions; including a number of things which Uhuru can or cannot do as you suggest e.g. that he shouldn't sign the Referendum Bill
I stop reading on 3rd para - but let me give you one reason why stay orders will not be granted.
Long before the judgement that gave us the 20 orders this month - the high court had INJUNCTED IEBC as early as last year or this year Feb - and then Uhuru was similarly INJUNCTED on march.
IF YOU COULD NOT SET ASIDE INJUNCTIONS - HOW DO YOU HOPE TO STAY JUDGEMENT ORDERS
The reason is simple - allowing Uhuru to sign BBI into law or IEBC to hold the referendum - will make the appeal almost useless - and will cost the country DEARLY.
So IEBC or Uhuru will not be allowed to proceed with BBI until the matter is heard in 2022. If they were in a hurry - nobody stopped them in 2018 from finishing BBI and have enough time to litigate this to SCORK as was more than EXPECTED it would be controversial.
And this could be one of the sanctions/conditions that will be imposed alongside the grant for stay or "leave to appeal" to run until the appeal is heard and determined.
IF ANYBODY WANTS IEBC ALLOWED TO SPEND PUBLIC MONEY AS APPEAL IS HEARD - PLEASE PUT THE MONEY IN ESCROW ACCOUNT - IF YOU WIN THE APPEAL - YOU WILL BE REFUNDED - IF YOU LOSE - TOO bad.
Otherwise what nonsense argument will allow a sane sober judge to authorize expenditure of another 15-20B by IEBC on a referendum that has already been declared NULL AND VOID!!!!!!!!!
Who will be that irresponsible? I mean we still a have to wait for auditor general to tell us how much money has been wasted so far.
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Why are people stupid? And why do stupid people think others are stupid.Jesus of Nazereth.
Key word is PREJUDICE ( I know you've heard of SUBJUDICE)
Now if you go to court today - and seek orders - before the case is heard - you're going to be seeking INJUNCTIONs.
Meaning you're going to convince the court that even without you being heard - you could suffer prejudice - that cannot wait for resolution of the case.
For example if someone wants to kill you - first business is to stop them from killing you. This what Punguza and others did. They got injunction against IEBC and Uhuru.
Now after case is heard and determined - you get a judgment - and orders. That is already very serious. The court has issued serious 20 orders
To stay judgement orders - you need to proof that one you will be prejudiced -in a way that you cannot wait or you'll suffer irreparable damage. For BBI - they need to demonstrate why they cannot wait for say 3-6 months for appeal court to review the lower court judgement!!!!
Why is this urgent? Obviously they will claim 2022? Why must referendum be held btw now and septemeber? If constitutional changes are for posterity why must they be held NOW?
Generally speaking - if you get injunction - it mean court has seen merit in your case and urgency -
As for BBI appeal - yeah the urgency has been "met" enough for COA to alert the president to form a bench - now we await to see the other elements - and why a court of appeal will allow reggae to continue.
Give up already. There is no way BBI will be resuscitated. It totally dead. 5-0. How is that even possible to recover from. At least Uhuru suffered 5-2 - the last time - with Ojwang and lady justice disagreeing.
Well it just confirms once again that you are clueless on how the court works! The permanent injunction was for the pendance or period until the case is heard and determined. Now that the case is determined these injunctions are similarly replaced by this ruling. So a stay of this ruling technically means that you can proceed with your everyday life until the appeal is heard and determined. On the other hand, a stay or "leave to appeal" can be is normally granted with sanctions or conditions; including a number of things which Uhuru can or cannot do as you suggest e.g. that he shouldn't sign the Referendum Bill
I stop reading on 3rd para - but let me give you one reason why stay orders will not be granted.
Long before the judgement that gave us the 20 orders this month - the high court had INJUNCTED IEBC as early as last year or this year Feb - and then Uhuru was similarly INJUNCTED on march.
IF YOU COULD NOT SET ASIDE INJUNCTIONS - HOW DO YOU HOPE TO STAY JUDGEMENT ORDERS
The reason is simple - allowing Uhuru to sign BBI into law or IEBC to hold the referendum - will make the appeal almost useless - and will cost the country DEARLY.
So IEBC or Uhuru will not be allowed to proceed with BBI until the matter is heard in 2022. If they were in a hurry - nobody stopped them in 2018 from finishing BBI and have enough time to litigate this to SCORK as was more than EXPECTED it would be controversial.
And this could be one of the sanctions/conditions that will be imposed alongside the grant for stay or "leave to appeal" to run until the appeal is heard and determined.
IF ANYBODY WANTS IEBC ALLOWED TO SPEND PUBLIC MONEY AS APPEAL IS HEARD - PLEASE PUT THE MONEY IN ESCROW ACCOUNT - IF YOU WIN THE APPEAL - YOU WILL BE REFUNDED - IF YOU LOSE - TOO bad.
Otherwise what nonsense argument will allow a sane sober judge to authorize expenditure of another 15-20B by IEBC on a referendum that has already been declared NULL AND VOID!!!!!!!!!
Who will be that irresponsible? I mean we still a have to wait for auditor general to tell us how much money has been wasted so far.
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I down my tools.... you are ungovernable. At this stage, I am not communicating so it is useless/pointless to engage.
Why are people stupid? And why do stupid people think others are stupid.Jesus of Nazereth.
Key word is PREJUDICE ( I know you've heard of SUBJUDICE)
Now if you go to court today - and seek orders - before the case is heard - you're going to be seeking INJUNCTIONs.
Meaning you're going to convince the court that even without you being heard - you could suffer prejudice - that cannot wait for resolution of the case.
For example if someone wants to kill you - first business is to stop them from killing you. This what Punguza and others did. They got injunction against IEBC and Uhuru.
Now after case is heard and determined - you get a judgment - and orders. That is already very serious. The court has issued serious 20 orders
To stay judgement orders - you need to proof that one you will be prejudiced -in a way that you cannot wait or you'll suffer irreparable damage. For BBI - they need to demonstrate why they cannot wait for say 3-6 months for appeal court to review the lower court judgement!!!!
Why is this urgent? Obviously they will claim 2022? Why must referendum be held btw now and septemeber? If constitutional changes are for posterity why must they be held NOW?
Generally speaking - if you get injunction - it mean court has seen merit in your case and urgency -
As for BBI appeal - yeah the urgency has been "met" enough for COA to alert the president to form a bench - now we await to see the other elements - and why a court of appeal will allow reggae to continue.
Give up already. There is no way BBI will be resuscitated. It totally dead. 5-0. How is that even possible to recover from. At least Uhuru suffered 5-2 - the last time - with Ojwang and lady justice disagreeing.
Well it just confirms once again that you are clueless on how the court works! The permanent injunction was for the pendance or period until the case is heard and determined. Now that the case is determined these injunctions are similarly replaced by this ruling. So a stay of this ruling technically means that you can proceed with your everyday life until the appeal is heard and determined. On the other hand, a stay or "leave to appeal" can be is normally granted with sanctions or conditions; including a number of things which Uhuru can or cannot do as you suggest e.g. that he shouldn't sign the Referendum Bill
I stop reading on 3rd para - but let me give you one reason why stay orders will not be granted.
Long before the judgement that gave us the 20 orders this month - the high court had INJUNCTED IEBC as early as last year or this year Feb - and then Uhuru was similarly INJUNCTED on march.
IF YOU COULD NOT SET ASIDE INJUNCTIONS - HOW DO YOU HOPE TO STAY JUDGEMENT ORDERS
The reason is simple - allowing Uhuru to sign BBI into law or IEBC to hold the referendum - will make the appeal almost useless - and will cost the country DEARLY.
So IEBC or Uhuru will not be allowed to proceed with BBI until the matter is heard in 2022. If they were in a hurry - nobody stopped them in 2018 from finishing BBI and have enough time to litigate this to SCORK as was more than EXPECTED it would be controversial.
And this could be one of the sanctions/conditions that will be imposed alongside the grant for stay or "leave to appeal" to run until the appeal is heard and determined.
IF ANYBODY WANTS IEBC ALLOWED TO SPEND PUBLIC MONEY AS APPEAL IS HEARD - PLEASE PUT THE MONEY IN ESCROW ACCOUNT - IF YOU WIN THE APPEAL - YOU WILL BE REFUNDED - IF YOU LOSE - TOO bad.
Otherwise what nonsense argument will allow a sane sober judge to authorize expenditure of another 15-20B by IEBC on a referendum that has already been declared NULL AND VOID!!!!!!!!!
Who will be that irresponsible? I mean we still a have to wait for auditor general to tell us how much money has been wasted so far.
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RV, Raila and team come with a different strategy. The now want suspension of the High Court order that stopped a constitutional referendum.
Its like a movie . Anti BBI team should forget about the merits or demrits of the case. This is because time is of disadvantage for BBI team. They should play delay tactics . We are in June already and its next to impossible for IEBC to hold a referendumn by July.
https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/amp/national/article/2001413876/bbi-office-files-appeal-raises-16-key-issues
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Suspension of orders is staying of orders. Mwangi is playing Raila. CoA cannot authorize IEBC to conduct a referendum when 5 bench have found serious issues. It waste of time. They need to justify why this is life and death - well it's for political circus like Raila wanted - it's about time - he got Plan B on the roll.
Anyway first challenge is getting 7 Bench in COA - with only 13 COA juges - spread in Nairobi, Mombasa, Nyeri, Kisumu, Nakuru and Eldoret - how will the new President Musinga get 7 bench judges that easily. They might have to abandon their stations - and rush to Nairobi - leading to more injustices elsewhere.
Uhuru should swiftly appoint 17 COA - so we get the required no of 30 COA.
Uhuru should NOT benefit from speedy hearing of his case - and should suffer like every kenyan - from the huge backlog - that him and Kuhara have caused by refusing to obey court orders.
CoA have the opportunity to stick it to executive one more - a real kick on their gonads for kenyans like Prof Ngugi and team delivered.
RV, Raila and team come with a different strategy. The now want suspension of the High Court order that stopped a constitutional referendum.
Its like a movie . Anti BBI team should forget about the merits or demrits of the case. This is because time is of disadvantage for BBI team. They should play delay tactics . We are in June already and its next to impossible for IEBC to hold a referendumn by July.
https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/amp/national/article/2001413876/bbi-office-files-appeal-raises-16-key-issues
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Currently there are 12 COA Judges if they go minus one the the COA will be unconstitutional . What Anti BBI team should do is first to contest the constitution of the bench . Being a very highly politicized case some judges will opt out /recuse themselves . This will buy at minimum one week . Then secondly they should get an injunction against IEBC holding the referendum by all means they should argue out the proceeding of the referendum process . This is the only card Pro BBI Team have .
Suspension of orders is staying of orders. Mwangi is playing Raila. CoA cannot authorize IEBC to conduct a referendum when 5 bench have found serious issues. It waste of time. They need to justify why this is life and death - well it's for political circus like Raila wanted - it's about time - he got Plan B on the roll.
Anyway first challenge is getting 7 Bench in COA - with only 13 COA juges - spread in Nairobi, Mombasa, Nyeri, Kisumu, Nakuru and Eldoret - how will the new President Musinga get 7 bench judges that easily. They might have to abandon their stations - and rush to Nairobi - leading to more injustices elsewhere.
Uhuru should swiftly appoint 17 COA - so we get the required no of 30 COA.
Uhuru should NOT benefit from speedy hearing of his case - and should suffer like every kenyan - from the huge backlog - that him and Kuhara have caused by refusing to obey court orders.
CoA have the opportunity to stick it to executive one more - a real kick on their gonads for kenyans like Prof Ngugi and team delivered.
RV, Raila and team come with a different strategy. The now want suspension of the High Court order that stopped a constitutional referendum.
Its like a movie . Anti BBI team should forget about the merits or demrits of the case. This is because time is of disadvantage for BBI team. They should play delay tactics . We are in June already and its next to impossible for IEBC to hold a referendumn by July.
https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/amp/national/article/2001413876/bbi-office-files-appeal-raises-16-key-issues