Nipate
Forum => Controversial => Topic started by: vooke on November 10, 2014, 06:15:56 AM
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Negro and wifey is gone
http://www.tribune242.com/news/2014/nov/09/least-two-dead-plane-crashes-crane-shipyard/ (http://www.tribune242.com/news/2014/nov/09/least-two-dead-plane-crashes-crane-shipyard/)
At JKL
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This is very sad news for Christians everywhere. Its one of the many things we will never figure out why they happen.
This guy was a teacher and a mentor. Personally he changed my life.
My condolences to the family.
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Did the late Munroe give a premonition of his death to Jeff Koinange?
"I want to challenge every Kenyan to go to the cemetery and disappoint the graveyard. Die like the Apostle Paul who said I have finished my course, I have kept the faith and I have been poured out like a drink offering. There is nothing left. I am ready to die. That’s how I wanna die because there is nothing else for me left to die,” the Standard reported on what he told the show’s host, Jeff Koinange. “When you die, die like I am planning to die. Empty. It’s finished,” He added in the show.
Negro and wifey is gone
http://www.tribune242.com/news/2014/nov/09/least-two-dead-plane-crashes-crane-shipyard/ (http://www.tribune242.com/news/2014/nov/09/least-two-dead-plane-crashes-crane-shipyard/)
At JKL
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This is truly sad news. I send condolences to the Evangelicals and his family in particular. I listened to a few of his teachings although I did not agree with his theology. Only God knows where his destiny lies. Christians who believe in the resurrection do not despair when believers die.
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Bittertruth,
He did talk so much about death on JKL...i think he saw death coming in spiritual realm,
Without Prejudice.
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Vooke I hope you were not personally linked to Dr Myles Munroe. I hope it's not too intrusive to ask. What do you think of the fact that the preacher owned a personal jet? Comment in view of the prosperity gospel.
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I learnt the negro had a personal jet last month when he visited Kenia.
I regarded him as a practical guy far from vain
The jet was owned by his ministry.
You have no idea how much of prosperity cobwebs he cleaned off me. I first heard him teach that tithes were Mosaic and not Christian and I almost wrote him off as a confused man. It has taken years of study to vindicate him
In short I don't find any trace of prosperity BS in his life. I always marveled how he would visit countries offering his expensive seminars to leaders and biashara executives but preach on churches for nothing. A balanced negro...gone just like that
Vooke I hope you were not personally linked to Dr Myles Munroe. I hope it's not too intrusive to ask. What do you think of the fact that the preacher owned a personal jet? Comment in view of the prosperity gospel.
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I learnt the negro had a personal jet last month when he visited Kenia.
I regarded him as a practical guy far from vain
The jet was owned by his ministry.
You have no idea how much of prosperity cobwebs he cleaned off me. I first heard him teach that tithes were Mosaic and not Christian and I almost wrote him off as a confused man. It has taken years of study to vindicate him
In short I don't find any trace of prosperity BS in his life. I always marveled how he would visit countries offering his expensive seminars to leaders and biashara executives but preach on churches for nothing. A balanced negro...gone just like that
Vooke I hope you were not personally linked to Dr Myles Munroe. I hope it's not too intrusive to ask. What do you think of the fact that the preacher owned a personal jet? Comment in view of the prosperity gospel.
vooke
So he owned a personal jet, yet you didnt find any trace of prosperity in him...I am confused, enlighten me a little on this dupilicity.
I didnt know this Negro, so I am unable to comment on his ministry. Seems like he was effective, given the comments I have read here and elswhere.
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What duplicity mya88?
I never knew nothing about the jet till he visited here last month. I don't know if it was HIS own jet or something bought by the ministry.
All I can tell you is the negro was far from prosperity bullsh*tters you see around pulpits. I know this and I can assure you he was against TITHING, seed or all those other nonsense. Read any of his books and you won't find any trace of that fraudulent utopia fed on stupid Christians
I can also tell you for free that he did more than preaching in churches. Last time he was at Safari Park he was charging 50K per negro for his seminar
So once again, where is the duplicity my dear?
vooke
So he owned a personal jet, yet you didnt find any trace of prosperity in him...I am confused, enlighten me a little on this dupilicity.
I didnt know this Negro, so I am unable to comment on his ministry. Seems like he was effective, given the comments I have read here and elswhere.
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vooke,
In his book "Stop Robbing Peter to Pay Paul ", the Late Munroe talks about Money. Among the key things are
1. 5 critical things you must do to prepare for financial increase
2. A powerful step-by-step plan of action to get out of debt
3. Little-known strategies for improving your credit score
4. Techniques for setting and achieving your financial goals etc.
basically, Munroe was teaching Christians on Financial prosperity.
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bittertruth,
Financial prosperity is a good objective/goal. I recall Munroe preaching about making sacrifices, hard sacrifices and saving inorder to construct a house for his family debt-free. The man was that practical. He said support the gospel but not by tithing
What I am against is not attempting to prosper, but taking advantage of hustlers by selling them a fake gospel shortcut way to millions namely, 'giving to MoG', tithing,sowing seed. These things NEVER work so the broke a** giver is actually in a worse state than before they gave. The one tangible symptom of this fraud is a pastor who waxes fatter by the day
vooke,
In his book "Stop Robbing Peter to Pay Paul ", the Late Munroe talks about Money. Among the key things are
1. 5 critical things you must do to prepare for financial increase
2. A powerful step-by-step plan of action to get out of debt
3. Little-known strategies for improving your credit score
4. Techniques for setting and achieving your financial goals etc.
basically, Munroe was teaching Christians on Financial prosperity.
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I'm trying to wrap it around my head how a minister of the gospel who owns a personal jet can be a shepherd of the flock of the Man who had no place to lay His head, a Prophet without Honor. On a more practical level, how does such a wealthy jet-set shepherd preach to a poor man like BarTimeaus?
Mark 10
41 When the ten heard about this, they became indignant with James and John. 42 Jesus called them together and said, “You know that those who are regarded as rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their high officials exercise authority over them. 43 Not so with you. Instead, whoever wants to become great among you must be your servant, 44 and whoever wants to be first must be slave of all. 45 For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
Blind Bartimaeus Receives His Sight
46 Then they came to Jericho. As Jesus and his disciples, together with a large crowd, were leaving the city, a blind man, Bartimaeus (which means “son of Timaeus”), was sitting by the roadside begging. 47 When he heard that it was Jesus of Nazareth, he began to shout, “Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me!”
Matt 20:28 "24 When the ten heard about this, they were indignant with the two brothers. 25 Jesus called them together and said, “You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their high officials exercise authority over them. 26 Not so with you. Instead, whoever wants to become great among you must be your servant, 27 and whoever wants to be first must be your slave— 28 just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
vooke,
In his book "Stop Robbing Peter to Pay Paul ", the Late Munroe talks about Money. Among the key things are
1. 5 critical things you must do to prepare for financial increase
2. A powerful step-by-step plan of action to get out of debt
3. Little-known strategies for improving your credit score
4. Techniques for setting and achieving your financial goals etc.
basically, Munroe was teaching Christians on Financial prosperity.
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Wrap around your entire body a few facts;
1. Munroe did far much more than preaching.
2. Munroe was an anti-tither unlike the loony Ellen G White
I'm trying to wrap it around my head how a minister of the gospel who owns a personal jet can be a shepherd of the flock of the Man who had no place to lay His head, a Prophet without Honor. On a more practical level, how does such a wealthy jet-set shepherd preach to a poor man like BarTimeaus?
Mark 10
41 When the ten heard about this, they became indignant with James and John. 42 Jesus called them together and said, “You know that those who are regarded as rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their high officials exercise authority over them. 43 Not so with you. Instead, whoever wants to become great among you must be your servant, 44 and whoever wants to be first must be slave of all. 45 For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
Blind Bartimaeus Receives His Sight
46 Then they came to Jericho. As Jesus and his disciples, together with a large crowd, were leaving the city, a blind man, Bartimaeus (which means “son of Timaeus”), was sitting by the roadside begging. 47 When he heard that it was Jesus of Nazareth, he began to shout, “Jesus, Son of David, have mercy on me!”
Matt 20:28 "24 When the ten heard about this, they were indignant with the two brothers. 25 Jesus called them together and said, “You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their high officials exercise authority over them. 26 Not so with you. Instead, whoever wants to become great among you must be your servant, 27 and whoever wants to be first must be your slave— 28 just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
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vooke,
I do not agree with you that Munroe was anti-tither. Please visit his website and see for your self. The negro has an option where you could remit your tithes, contributions etc.. Via the online platform using a credit card.
I like prosperity gospel because its practical and makes use of simple principle of giving and receiving.
Wrap around your entire body a few facts;
1. Munroe did far much more than preaching.
2. Munroe was an anti-tither unlike the loony Ellen G White
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I picked the quote from one of his books. Let me get it. I will duly apologize and withdraw the statements that I made
That said, I have NEVER heard the negro preach on offerings and such.
Watch this once you get time
PS: Stop Robbing Peter was not authored by Munroe
http://www.stoprobbingpeter.com/
vooke,
I do not agree with you that Munroe was anti-tither. Please visit his website and see for your self. The negro has an option where you could remit your tithes, contributions etc.. Via the online platform using a credit card.
I like prosperity gospel because its practical and makes use of simple principle of giving and receiving.
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https://mylesmunroeinternational.com/partnership/
vooke,
I do not agree with you that Munroe was anti-tither. Please visit his website and see for your self. The negro has an option where you could remit your tithes, contributions etc.. Via the online platform using a credit card.
I like prosperity gospel because its practical and makes use of simple principle of giving and receiving.
Wrap around your entire body a few facts;
1. Munroe did far much more than preaching.
2. Munroe was an anti-tither unlike the loony Ellen G White
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Nuff Sed,
You really are vindictive
Refer to yesterday's sermon
You won't find hallucinations of a deranged false prophet in Munroe try as you may. Please keep digging.
And even if you did, we lump him together with other crooked ministers and life goes on. You even if all evidence was presented that White was a moron, you are hopeless stuck with her because that's all you know in this world
There is perfect order and harmony in the Holy City. All the angels that are commissioned to visit the earth hold a golden card, which they present to the angels at the gates of the city as they pass in and out. —Early Writings (1882), page 39
Angels require cards before checking out at the gate
I was shown that the people of God should not imitate the fashions of the world... I was pointed back to God's ancient people, and was led to compare their apparel with the mode of dress in these last days. What a difference! What a change! Then the women were not so bold as now. WHEN THEY WENT IN PUBLIC, THEY COVERED THEIR FACES WITH A VAIL. In these last days, fashions are shameful and immodest...The small bonnets, exposing the face and head, show a lack of modesty...The inhabitants are growing more and more corrupt... —Testimonies, Volume 1, pp. 188; 189[/b]
This mad primate wanted you and your daughter to don hijab and Burrka
https://mylesmunroeinternational.com/partnership/
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Nuff Sed,
you have crossed the line by deleting those posts.
Go join SDA forums echo chambers where you can hear yourself regurgitating a mad fool's thoughts
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vooke, I have listened to the sermon. Munroe says he hasn't tithed for almost 22yrs now. His main reason being that tithe is the bear minimum that Christians ought to give. He challenges Christians that they ought to give more since they are no longer under the law- like he does.
I picked the quote from one of his books. Let me get it. I will duly apologize and withdraw the statements that I made
That said, I have NEVER heard the negro preach on offerings and such.
Watch this once you get time
PS: Stop Robbing Peter was not authored by Munroe
http://www.stoprobbingpeter.com/
vooke,
I do not agree with you that Munroe was anti-tither. Please visit his website and see for your self. The negro has an option where you could remit your tithes, contributions etc.. Via the online platform using a credit card.
I like prosperity gospel because its practical and makes use of simple principle of giving and receiving.
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My broda,
I have no problem with that. If you read my Sunday sermon, I said as much. We are supposed to support Kingdom business by our offerings. It is my right as your pastor to collect an offering. Hebu sambaza bundles saa hii
Giving in New Testament is simply as you purpose and without compulsion. What vooke is against are the tricks ministers use to make you part with your money. They use carrot and stick approach, threaten you with devourer and diseases or debt while dangling some utopia called open heaven. This is wrong;it is legalism and it distorts the believer's perception of God
vooke, I have listened to the sermon. Munroe says he hasn't tithed for almost 22yrs now. His main reason being that tithe is the bear minimum that Christians ought to give. He challenges Christians that they ought to give more since they are no longer under the law- like he does.
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The issue is on tithes. I haven't heard Munroe dissing tithing as vooke does.
While tithing is found in the law, it did not originate in the law. Many refer to Abraham as the first one to give a tithe in Genesis 14:17-20 but required gifts came long before that. We see an encounter between God and Cain in Genesis 4:2-7 in which God rebukes Cain out for not giving rightly. His brother Abel had given his best gift but Cain didn’t. This eventually led to Cain killing his brother out of jealousy and envy.
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Circumcision and also animal sacrifices came long before the Law. I propose you engage in both. ANd while at it get several concubines because Abraham the Father of Faith did
I never said Munroe dissed tithing like I did, to him it was a point he least emphasized and in one of the books he said give to God not necessarily 10%
The issue is on tithes. I haven't heard Munroe dissing tithing as vooke does.
While tithing is found in the law, it did not originate in the law. Many refer to Abraham as the first one to give a tithe in Genesis 14:17-20 but required gifts came long before that. We see an encounter between God and Cain in Genesis 4:2-7 in which God rebukes Cain out for not giving rightly. His brother Abel had given his best gift but Cain didn’t. This eventually led to Cain killing his brother out of jealousy and envy.
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Circumcision and also animal sacrifices came long before the Law. I propose you engage in both. ANd while at it get several concubines because Abraham the Father of Faith did
I never said Munroe dissed tithing like I did, to him it was a point he least emphasized and in one of the books he said give to God not necessarily 10%
The issue is on tithes. I haven't heard Munroe dissing tithing as vooke does.
While tithing is found in the law, it did not originate in the law. Many refer to Abraham as the first one to give a tithe in Genesis 14:17-20 but required gifts came long before that. We see an encounter between God and Cain in Genesis 4:2-7 in which God rebukes Cain out for not giving rightly. His brother Abel had given his best gift but Cain didn’t. This eventually led to Cain killing his brother out of jealousy and envy.
So Monroe is vindicated in vookes eyes because he least emphasized tithing, yet in his sermons he tells you to give as much as you can.....meaning more than the tithe requires be it 25% or even 50%. That doesn’t even make sense, the idea here is giving so I still fail to see the point vooke is trying to make with his anti-tithing practices or teachings.
Are you saying people shouldn’t give at all? If they are to give, what reasons or why should they give? To whom are they giving? For what purpose? Is it okay for pastors to pay themselves using tithes or church money? If yes, how much and who determines that? If not, how are the men of the clothe supposed to feed themselves? I am following this anti-tithing topic because I do have a problem with few pastors and how the live their lives like the one below who lives in a house that looks like a five start hotel.
http://www.mwakilishi.com/content/articles/2014/11/04/speaking-of-pastors-here-are-photos-of-kiunas-mansion.html (http://www.mwakilishi.com/content/articles/2014/11/04/speaking-of-pastors-here-are-photos-of-kiunas-mansion.html)
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mya88,
Please refer to my Sunday sermon.
The gospel of our Lord Jesus is free. Spreading it is not. This means without funding/resources it is impossible to spread the Word. You need first willing hearts, men and Women who heed to Jesus commission. Secondly you need money to move around, hold meetings, sustain yourself as you preach because most likely you won't be working while preaching. In short, giving for the gospel is Godly.
There are many exhortations to give. Jesus Himself was supported by many women like Mary Magdalene-Luke 8:2-3. So vooke will not hesitate to collect an offering from you! Do you mind sowing into my life an iPad mini 2?
My beef is with the ministers who abuse this right to be supported and use any means to exact money from you. They will twist verses, promise utopia like health and wealth so as to entice you to give. They exaggerate the few success testimonies in a sea of frustrated folks. They peddle false hope and make millions out of the needy and the most vulnerable
There is a high positive correlation between ministers' personal wealth and the vigor with which they push the prosperity gospel. You preach hard,you live large. Deluded wor shippers are told that the exponentially increasing wealth of the pastor is as a result of prosperity gospel. But the truth is prosperity preachers will make money whether their messages work or not. As long as am collecting tithes, it doesn't matter whether God prospers the tither, I get the tithes of both the successful givers and the unsuccessful.
Tithing in the scriptures was MANDATORY for all Jews. This system was adopted about 500AD into the church. Before that, the gospel was supported by Freewill offerings as Paul taught. Tithing is still with us today and badly abused. You are promised health,new jobs,more money, success and just about everything.
Then you have seed-faith where guys are told to give money for ANY prayer request they have. mya88 needs a kid, sow a seed of x amount, need a job, sow a seed of y. Giving to God is reduced to an investment with capital and returns and a rate of return.
vooke is not an activist but he endavors to free believers from such abusive doctrines by sharing the truth. Many believers are hurting, they are disillusioned. They think God has forgotten them, they were sold false hope. I was writing a book but I have decided to take my time even as I engage my friends and anyone the Lord leads me.
Am surprised that most of my friends have reservations on some of these teachings. Please note the teachings cut across sects and denominations. So am not fighting Catholics or Deliverance church.
So Monroe is vindicated in vookes eyes because he least emphasized tithing, yet in his sermons he tells you to give as much as you can.....meaning more than the tithe requires be it 25% or even 50%. That doesn’t even make sense, the idea here is giving so I still fail to see the point vooke is trying to make with his anti-tithing practices or teachings.
Are you saying people shouldn’t give at all? If they are to give, what reasons or why should they give? To whom are they giving? For what purpose? Is it okay for pastors to pay themselves using tithes or church money? If yes, how much and who determines that? If not, how are the men of the clothe supposed to feed themselves? I am following this anti-tithing topic because I do have a problem with few pastors and how the live their lives like the one below who lives in a house that looks like a five start hotel.
http://www.mwakilishi.com/content/articles/2014/11/04/speaking-of-pastors-here-are-photos-of-kiunas-mansion.html (http://www.mwakilishi.com/content/articles/2014/11/04/speaking-of-pastors-here-are-photos-of-kiunas-mansion.html)
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mya88,
Please refer to my Sunday sermon.
Secondly you need money to move around, hold meetings, sustain yourself as you preach because most likely you won't be working while preaching. In short, giving for the gospel is Godly.
There are many exhortations to give. Jesus Himself was supported by many women like Mary Magdalene-Luke 8:2-3. So vooke will not hesitate to collect an offering from you! Do you mind sowing into my life an iPad mini 2?
@vooke
I will take my time to read your sunday sermons. I thought sowing a seed was for the ministry, not into the pastors "personal life". if I give vooke an ipad mini2, how is that sowing back to the ministry? For all I know vooke my be using the ipad to browse facebook, nipate and the likes
It is this “sustain yourself” that lies at the heart of the matter…how much doe you need to sustain yourself? There isn’t any rules and regulations governing how church functions so that little bit leaves a lot of room for abuse. Some do it knowingly, but could it be subconsciously? I wonder. Most pastors of mega churches actually live large and some like TD jakes or even the soft spoken one ( I forget his name) may own private jets. If what you are saying is true, then they too fall under those you claim because the remind people of tithing even quoting scriptures.
TD jakes preaches hard, he is effective, he commands large crowds and appears in most TV shows, because of that he has sold books, sold sermons, should those go to ministry or his own pockets? There is a TV show called preachers of LA that really makes preachers look bad because it shows how the dabble in opulence while the flock can barely get by. This is sad, because people are suffering and are desperate for God. Things are worse than I ever remember them to be. This topic is not as simple as you put it, but still insightful.
Then you have seed-faith where guys are told to give money for ANY prayer request they have. mya88 needs a kid, sow a seed of x amount, need a job, sow a seed of y. Giving to God is reduced to an investment with capital and returns and a rate of return.
Actually the don’t call it tithing, they call it offering or even sowing a seed. Most Nigerian preachers are notorious with this, but my understanding was that you saw the seed to good by your faith, whatever it is you wish for will be given unto you. There is a scripture where Jesus tells a us that if all had the faith as little as a mustard seed, then we could tell the mountain to move and it will. Then there is the poor widow woman with two coins who sow as all she has and gets more than she could have ever imagined. How is that different?
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mya,
I have an ipad Air for nipate and other mundane stuff. The mini will be purely for the Word :)
OK, I was kidding on that. Please don't take offense. The little I do on .com and .org I can afford without sweat.
There is nothing wrong with living large, but if it comes from convincing the gullible that giving you money will endear them to God and earn them fortunes then we have a problem.
Size is intimidating. Recall David and Goliath. So when most people see Dexter Jakes thundering from the pulpit, they are least likely to question anything he says. There almost seems to be an unwritten rule that if he/she is this big, he can't be wrong. If Paul, the greatest apostle,pastor,preacher who ever lived was subjected to scrutiny by the people of Berea (Acts 17:11), nobody should be immune from scrutiny. Am a skeptic, I take what you say and test it against scriptures because if you mislead me, we will both end up in hell; you for misrepresenting God,me for believing your lies
I watched the first few episodes of Preachers of LA and I got bored. There is no place for such opulence in the Bible. These guys are just serving their own god, their belly. It is sad.
I agree with you about faith being a seed but these guys equate offering to the seed not the faith. so it is all about who gives MORE. The more you give, the more you prosper. This is unbiblical. The poor widow gave among the least denomination of the then currency and she was more JUSTIFIED that those who gave several times her giving. If that woman gave today,she would not get a reserved seat at the front of a megachurch. IT is the millionaires givers who are more honored today. Funy thing is what men esteem most is oft times worthless before God :o
Paul 'pressured' the poor to give, but ONLY for CHARITY not his lifestyle. When it came to his own sustenance, he often waived the right to an income and opted to work with his hands. Paul had no qualms with poor Macedonians giving to the poor saints of Jerusalem. But he could not burden the poor to support him. Nowadays you have the poor supporting one individual lead an obscene lifestyle. This is manifested in jets, rides, castles and so forth. THis is wrong. One disgraced former head of Mars Hill church had some stooges proposing that he earn $650,000 per annum. Churches are not corporations where leaders become millionaires simply because giving has increased. There is CITAM with thousands across the country here and I was shocked to learn that the former head, Bishop Adoyo spins a Toyota 110. That's a worthless junk costing no more than 400,000 KES. That is the spirit
You can do this simple test; confirm how many of the prosperity preachers major in charity work. They seldom. All they collect goes towards never-ending church 'projects'- bigger 'sanctuary', better sound, AC, seats.... administration and so forth. They only pay lip service to charity. I know of a church where the charity department is very vibrant. They visit prisons, hospices, the aged, orphanages....but the members have to raise the funds for these missions over and above what they gave in church as tithes and offerings.
@vooke
I will take my time to read your sunday sermons. I thought sowing a seed was for the ministry, not into the pastors "personal life". if I give vooke an ipad mini2, how is that sowing back to the ministry? For all I know vooke my be using the ipad to browse facebook, nipate and the likes
It is this “sustain yourself” that lies at the heart of the matter…how much doe you need to sustain yourself? There isn’t any rules and regulations governing how church functions so that little bit leaves a lot of room for abuse. Some do it knowingly, but could it be subconsciously? I wonder. Most pastors of mega churches actually live large and some like TD jakes or even the soft spoken one ( I forget his name) may own private jets. If what you are saying is true, then they too fall under those you claim because the remind people of tithing even quoting scriptures.
TD jakes preaches hard, he is effective, he commands large crowds and appears in most TV shows, because of that he has sold books, sold sermons, should those go to ministry or his own pockets? There is a TV show called preachers of LA that really makes preachers look bad because it shows how the dabble in opulence while the flock can barely get by. This is sad, because people are suffering and are desperate for God. Things are worse than I ever remember them to be. This topic is not as simple as you put it, but still insightful.
Actually the don’t call it tithing, they call it offering or even sowing a seed. Most Nigerian preachers are notorious with this, but my understanding was that you saw the seed to good by your faith, whatever it is you wish for will be given unto you. There is a scripture where Jesus tells a us that if all had the faith as little as a mustard seed, then we could tell the mountain to move and it will. Then there is the poor widow woman with two coins who sow as all she has and gets more than she could have ever imagined. How is that different?