Author Topic: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month  (Read 4801 times)

Offline RV Pundit

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Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« on: February 05, 2021, 08:57:08 AM »
Look like they are very determined to have the referendum soon however unpopular the BBI.
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/politics/muturi-hints-at-earlier-bbi-vote-3280422

Only the judiciary can save itself and us...by delaying this ruBBIsh and giving us yes/no for 2022.

Offline Omollo

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2021, 09:49:55 AM »
Pundit

The fastest and easiest way to defeat BBI is for it to be presented to a plebiscite as soon as possible. If they are rigging, well, it'll pass rekindle the 1988 Mlolongo which as you know inflicted a near fatal blow on Moi opening the way to multiparty politics that would eventually sweep KANU into oblivion.

If they allow free and fair polling, it will be defeated on youth vote alone.

Do the math: RV, Coast, NEP and western are voting No. Central is voting 80% no. Leaving Nyanza to vote to a man for it. Nairobi will vote majority no. Eastern is 50:50 but tilts towards No. So where are the votes?

Same fate awaits Uhuru's 3rd term shenanigans. He's lost his core constituencies - Kikuyus or GEMA and Kalenjins. Where would he get enough to top on with cybervotes from fake polling stations? He'll end up like Museveni- scrambling to primitively stuff ballot boxes.

The judiciary can stop it. But I hope they don't. The best hanging is where the victim prepared the noose hoping to hang someone else. Nobody cries. Everyone cheers as tables are turned.

Raila has taken leave of his senses.

One of my favorite adages is the question: When a lion & a widow separately say 'he was a good man', do they mean the same thing? I always ask this of people who don't inflect for dissonance. The answer: The women's husband is dead and the lion ate him! Raila and Uhuru have conflicting objectives.in fact their objectives are diametrically opposed. Each is trying to use the other.

As for Muturi: an apparatchik with no backbone will say anything and even eat his own puke moments later. His words mean zero. He's brought his office into disrepute. It's almost impossible to believe Sir Humphrey Slade and Fred Mbiti once occupied that seat. He's even beaten the dismal record of Kaparo & Ngeno. You got the AG: a piece of a slum toilet batshit.
... [the ICC case] will be tried in Europe, where due procedure and expertise prevail.; ... Second-guessing Ocampo and fantasizing ..has obviously become a national pastime.- NattyDread

Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2021, 10:30:53 AM »
I agree. It good test run for 2022. So we know the depth of the water.

But I think they are some good proposals in that BBI that can be salvaged by Yes or NO.

I don't mind prime minister thing - but I oppose muddling executive and parliament - with return of Mps being minister

But come to think about - practically nothing in there need a constitutional change.

The whole thing is RUBBISH - let them bring it.

Pundit

The fastest and easiest way to defeat BBI is for it to be presented to a plebiscite as soon as possible. If they are rigging, well, it'll pass rekindle the 1988 Mlolongo which as you know inflicted a near fatal blow on Moi opening the way to multiparty politics that would eventually sweep KANU into oblivion.

If they allow free and fair polling, it will be defeated on youth vote alone.

Do the math: RV, Coast, NEP and western are voting No. Central is voting 80% no. Leaving Nyanza to vote to a man for it. Nairobi will vote majority no. Eastern is 50:50 but tilts towards No. So where are the votes?

Same fate awaits Uhuru's 3rd term shenanigans. He's lost his core constituencies - Kikuyus or GEMA and Kalenjins. Where would he get enough to top on with cybervotes from fake polling stations? He'll end up like Museveni- scrambling to primitively stuff ballot boxes.

The judiciary can stop it. But I hope they don't. The best hanging is where the victim prepared the noose hoping to hang someone else. Nobody cries. Everyone cheers as tables are turned.

Raila has taken leave of his senses.

One of my favorite adages is the question: When a lion & a widow separately say 'he was a good man', do they mean the same thing? I always ask this of people who don't inflect for dissonance. The answer: The women's husband is dead and the lion ate him! Raila and Uhuru have conflicting objectives.in fact their objectives are diametrically opposed. Each is trying to use the other.

As for Muturi: an apparatchik with no backbone will say anything and even eat his own puke moments later. His words mean zero. He's brought his office into disrepute. It's almost impossible to believe Sir Humphrey Slade and Fred Mbiti once occupied that seat. He's even beaten the dismal record of Kaparo & Ngeno. You got the AG: a piece of a slum toilet batshit.

Offline Nowayhaha

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2021, 12:01:20 PM »
Look like they are very determined to have the referendum soon however unpopular the BBI.
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/politics/muturi-hints-at-earlier-bbi-vote-3280422

Only the judiciary can save itself and us...by delaying this ruBBIsh and giving us yes/no for 2022.

Judiciary is under siege , first you have a compromised acting SG and then you have a captured JSC . It will take a courageous Judge  to agree for an injunction . With that the will be no need to go for a referendum post Aug 2021 .If this fails the it goes to a referendum  . The best option is to deny the legitimacy of the referendum by keeping away from the polls. This will also deny Raila and ODM what they have been yearning for a Us Vs Them for building momentum into the 2022 elections and lastly We will see Pro Raila politicians and weed them out come 2022.

Raila was a nobody till death of Wamalwa and exit of Moi which gave him Mois (RV/COAST/Part Of Luhya) and Wamalwas(Part of Luhya)  constituency in  2005 - He thinks he can replacate that with Mt Kenya and this is through a referendum wih support of P.K. and Murathes . However Mt Kenya is whole different ball game alltogether 

Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2021, 12:46:09 PM »
If judiciary accept BBI to go on - they will forever be damned. For now - there is nothing uhuru can do - it just need a judge to injunct it - and play time -

As for boycott - that is rather dumb - because these guys don't care about legitimacy.

The are in a corner.


Look like they are very determined to have the referendum soon however unpopular the BBI.
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/politics/muturi-hints-at-earlier-bbi-vote-3280422

Only the judiciary can save itself and us...by delaying this ruBBIsh and giving us yes/no for 2022.

Judiciary is under siege , first you have a compromised acting SG and then you have a captured JSC . It will take a courageous Judge  to agree for an injunction . With that the will be no need to go for a referendum post Aug 2021 .If this fails the it goes to a referendum  . The best option is to deny the legitimacy of the referendum by keeping away from the polls. This will also deny Raila and ODM what they have been yearning for a Us Vs Them for building momentum into the 2022 elections and lastly We will see Pro Raila politicians and weed them out come 2022.

Raila was a nobody till death of Wamalwa and exit of Moi which gave him Mois (RV/COAST/Part Of Luhya) and Wamalwas(Part of Luhya)  constituency in  2005 - He thinks he can replacate that with Mt Kenya and this is through a referendum wih support of P.K. and Murathes . However Mt Kenya is whole different ball game alltogether 


Offline Kadudu

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2021, 05:11:49 PM »
Why did you not use the same words during the 2nd round 2017 presidential elections?

If judiciary accept BBI to go on - they will forever be damned. For now - there is nothing uhuru can do - it just need a judge to injunct it - and play time -

As for boycott - that is rather dumb - because these guys don't care about legitimacy.

The are in a corner.

Offline Nowayhaha

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2021, 08:37:04 AM »
Raila does not care about BBI all he wants is a contest . Ruto is not stupid to give him one .
Voters will boyot the referendum if there is going to be one . Uhuru will lose his image of Mt Kenya Kingpin , Raila will be confined as Luo Kingpin only and Ruto will save energy and go proper for 2022 elections .
Inside Ruto circles this is done and sealed - To keep the momentum and prepare for the boycott they have to keep Kenyans energized

If judiciary accept BBI to go on - they will forever be damned. For now - there is nothing uhuru can do - it just need a judge to injunct it - and play time -

As for boycott - that is rather dumb - because these guys don't care about legitimacy.

The are in a corner.


Look like they are very determined to have the referendum soon however unpopular the BBI.
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/politics/muturi-hints-at-earlier-bbi-vote-3280422

Only the judiciary can save itself and us...by delaying this ruBBIsh and giving us yes/no for 2022.

Judiciary is under siege , first you have a compromised acting SG and then you have a captured JSC . It will take a courageous Judge  to agree for an injunction . With that the will be no need to go for a referendum post Aug 2021 .If this fails the it goes to a referendum  . The best option is to deny the legitimacy of the referendum by keeping away from the polls. This will also deny Raila and ODM what they have been yearning for a Us Vs Them for building momentum into the 2022 elections and lastly We will see Pro Raila politicians and weed them out come 2022.

Raila was a nobody till death of Wamalwa and exit of Moi which gave him Mois (RV/COAST/Part Of Luhya) and Wamalwas(Part of Luhya)  constituency in  2005 - He thinks he can replacate that with Mt Kenya and this is through a referendum wih support of P.K. and Murathes . However Mt Kenya is whole different ball game alltogether 


Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2021, 09:07:31 AM »
Boycott how? I think it good for them not get into this BBI train until IEBC announce there is referendum and campaign period. Ruto cannot run away from the responsibility of opposing BBI when the times comes.

But first BBI has to surmount many hurdles.

I would concentrate my energies on delaying BBI through courts. Uhuru has 1yr to go.

Raila does not care about BBI all he wants is a contest . Ruto is not stupid to give him one .
Voters will boyot the referendum if there is going to be one . Uhuru will lose his image of Mt Kenya Kingpin , Raila will be confined as Luo Kingpin only and Ruto will save energy and go proper for 2022 elections .
Inside Ruto circles this is done and sealed - To keep the momentum and prepare for the boycott they have to keep Kenyans energized

If judiciary accept BBI to go on - they will forever be damned. For now - there is nothing uhuru can do - it just need a judge to injunct it - and play time -

As for boycott - that is rather dumb - because these guys don't care about legitimacy.

The are in a corner.


Look like they are very determined to have the referendum soon however unpopular the BBI.
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/politics/muturi-hints-at-earlier-bbi-vote-3280422

Only the judiciary can save itself and us...by delaying this ruBBIsh and giving us yes/no for 2022.

Judiciary is under siege , first you have a compromised acting SG and then you have a captured JSC . It will take a courageous Judge  to agree for an injunction . With that the will be no need to go for a referendum post Aug 2021 .If this fails the it goes to a referendum  . The best option is to deny the legitimacy of the referendum by keeping away from the polls. This will also deny Raila and ODM what they have been yearning for a Us Vs Them for building momentum into the 2022 elections and lastly We will see Pro Raila politicians and weed them out come 2022.

Raila was a nobody till death of Wamalwa and exit of Moi which gave him Mois (RV/COAST/Part Of Luhya) and Wamalwas(Part of Luhya)  constituency in  2005 - He thinks he can replacate that with Mt Kenya and this is through a referendum wih support of P.K. and Murathes . However Mt Kenya is whole different ball game alltogether 


Offline Njuri Ncheke

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2021, 09:11:57 AM »
Previously I thought opposing will work but not with drunk uhuru and deranged baba unfortunately nthurakus have to kumiria and vote it down. Its something we must do.

Offline Nowayhaha

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2021, 09:30:11 AM »

What are the political benefits for Ruto playing into the contest ?

Its evident his plan is as follows
1. Have court interfere with the BBI schedule and if possible have it with 2022 elections
2.If the above does not work -  Subdue Uhuru to multiple choice referendum ( Uhuru if realizes that it will be opposed in Referendum - He will eventually give in - )
3. If Uhuru still adamant - Boycott the referendum .

What will Ruto lose if he boycotts  the referendum ?


Boycott how? I think it good for them not get into this BBI train until IEBC announce there is referendum and campaign period. Ruto cannot run away from the responsibility of opposing BBI when the times comes.

But first BBI has to surmount many hurdles.

I would concentrate my energies on delaying BBI through courts. Uhuru has 1yr to go.

Raila does not care about BBI all he wants is a contest . Ruto is not stupid to give him one .
Voters will boyot the referendum if there is going to be one . Uhuru will lose his image of Mt Kenya Kingpin , Raila will be confined as Luo Kingpin only and Ruto will save energy and go proper for 2022 elections .
Inside Ruto circles this is done and sealed - To keep the momentum and prepare for the boycott they have to keep Kenyans energized

If judiciary accept BBI to go on - they will forever be damned. For now - there is nothing uhuru can do - it just need a judge to injunct it - and play time -

As for boycott - that is rather dumb - because these guys don't care about legitimacy.

The are in a corner.


Look like they are very determined to have the referendum soon however unpopular the BBI.
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/politics/muturi-hints-at-earlier-bbi-vote-3280422

Only the judiciary can save itself and us...by delaying this ruBBIsh and giving us yes/no for 2022.

Judiciary is under siege , first you have a compromised acting SG and then you have a captured JSC . It will take a courageous Judge  to agree for an injunction . With that the will be no need to go for a referendum post Aug 2021 .If this fails the it goes to a referendum  . The best option is to deny the legitimacy of the referendum by keeping away from the polls. This will also deny Raila and ODM what they have been yearning for a Us Vs Them for building momentum into the 2022 elections and lastly We will see Pro Raila politicians and weed them out come 2022.

Raila was a nobody till death of Wamalwa and exit of Moi which gave him Mois (RV/COAST/Part Of Luhya) and Wamalwas(Part of Luhya)  constituency in  2005 - He thinks he can replacate that with Mt Kenya and this is through a referendum wih support of P.K. and Murathes . However Mt Kenya is whole different ball game alltogether 


Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2021, 10:30:59 AM »
If Ruto boycott then will rig and gives us a bad constitution.
These are not things we should joke with.
They have a long way - but if comes to referendum - Ruto will have no option but to lead NO.

Why do you want to give Uhuru a free pass???????????????

Are you afraid of him or youre a closeted supporter.

Doesn't make sense.

For me Ruto must oppose BBI - but should not waste time - talking BBI instead of hustler nation.


What are the political benefits for Ruto playing into the contest ?

Its evident his plan is as follows
1. Have court interfere with the BBI schedule and if possible have it with 2022 elections
2.If the above does not work -  Subdue Uhuru to multiple choice referendum ( Uhuru if realizes that it will be opposed in Referendum - He will eventually give in - )
3. If Uhuru still adamant - Boycott the referendum .

What will Ruto lose if he boycotts  the referendum ?

Offline Njuri Ncheke

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2021, 12:55:18 PM »
Ruto has to run Uhuru Mutheca hard when push comes to pull. But i agree he needs to try reach a sort of consensus with Mutheca especially on the contentious issues.

Offline Omollo

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2021, 03:32:36 PM »
Boycotts don't work in Africa. Limited in Asia. They are effective in Europe and to an extent North America.

As for constitution: Right now they are torn between rigging and not. 50:50. The decision will be based on whether they smwant to shaft Raila early or after the plebiscite. He'll definitely be shafted. So a bad constitution is half guaranteed. Remember governments rarely allow selves to lose referenda and that's why Germany banned them. It's just how you sell it and if you can give people a bogeyman to blame.




If Ruto boycott then will rig and gives us a bad constitution.
These are not things we should joke with.
They have a long way - but if comes to referendum - Ruto will have no option but to lead NO.

Why do you want to give Uhuru a free pass???????????????

Are you afraid of him or youre a closeted supporter.

Doesn't make sense.

For me Ruto must oppose BBI - but should not waste time - talking BBI instead of
... [the ICC case] will be tried in Europe, where due procedure and expertise prevail.; ... Second-guessing Ocampo and fantasizing ..has obviously become a national pastime.- NattyDread

Offline Nowayhaha

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2021, 03:35:40 PM »
Far from the merits and demerits of the constituion ,in 2010 Ruto created the current constituion together with Uhuru but he ended up opposing it after Raila decided to support it simply because he needed to score politically.

Same case we have now Uhuru has played Raila with this BBI , If truth be told from BBI 1 , BBI 2 to BBI 3 , all Raila propasals have been thrown away from IEBC, Powerful PM, Regional Governments you name it and to the contrary  Majority of Rutos propasals especially the ones he articulated during the launch of BBI2 have been incorporated but you still see Raila pretending to be BBIs biggest supporter simply for political reasons   the bottomline for him is poltical reasons (contest) outweighs propasals not being incorpared in BBI.

Ruto is a politician his priority as at now is winning 2022 elections   for this  he needs to consolidate his voting base and hunt in the opposition base , he has done well .
The  contesious issue in constituion as it stands is the balooning wage issue,  over representation , capturing judiciary. About 35%  that one though not practical is what pro BBI proponents are using to sell BBI. You cant openly oppose , that should be handled differently.

Point incase is the Judiciary, they are a big player in Kenyas constituional order  ,they cant and shouldnt shy away from safeguarding judiciary interests bearimg in mind they form a third of Kenyas Government. The incomming CJ, LSK and activists majority being lawyers should play a role in ensuring the BBI propasals watering down or interfering in their work do not come to pass. This one just like in 2010 constituion should not be left to politicians .they played a major role in ensuring Judiciary became this indipendent in 2010 constituion .


I dont fear Uhuru, I supported him in 2002, parted with him in 2005, blame him for 2007 P.E.V . For giving Raila KANU,  supported him in 2013 and 2017 and dissapointed with him for the handshake.

Forget about Uhuru he is gone and a gone case. He is not a player in 2022 elections we cannot in anyway play into Raila hands of a contest our eyes should be on the goal and this is 2022 thats what we agreed after the 2018 handshake , focus is to make Ruto the President come 2022 and in some cases it might need to plan with the mind and not heart.

If Ruto boycott then will rig and gives us a bad constitution.
These are not things we should joke with.
They have a long way - but if comes to referendum - Ruto will have no option but to lead NO.

Why do you want to give Uhuru a free pass???????????????

Are you afraid of him or youre a closeted supporter.

Doesn't make sense.

For me Ruto must oppose BBI - but should not waste time - talking BBI instead of hustler nation.


What are the political benefits for Ruto playing into the contest ?

Its evident his plan is as follows
1. Have court interfere with the BBI schedule and if possible have it with 2022 elections
2.If the above does not work -  Subdue Uhuru to multiple choice referendum ( Uhuru if realizes that it will be opposed in Referendum - He will eventually give in - )
3. If Uhuru still adamant - Boycott the referendum .

What will Ruto lose if he boycotts  the referendum ?

Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2021, 07:48:28 AM »
Beyond politics, BBI is very bad document, that ought to be rejected in toto. If Ruto is elected under BBI, he will be like Moi. We should rejected BBI in totality.

I am glad there are 5 petition in court

Offline Nowayhaha

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2021, 09:08:48 AM »
You are still going into the merits and demerits of the document. What you mention is the Irony of the matter at hand , Raila and his ilk will rally for this constitution to be amended but come September 2022 after losing elections will be the first people to say the constitution is bad and agitate for another amendment (Same Case with  2010 constitution Okoa Kenya/BBI ) .Raila will never stop referendum call until he sees the constitution is nearly the same as the Bomas draft .



Beyond politics, BBI is very bad document, that ought to be rejected in toto. If Ruto is elected under BBI, he will be like Moi. We should rejected BBI in totality.

I am glad there are 5 petition in court

Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #16 on: February 07, 2021, 09:15:01 AM »
The politics of it - has been handled by Hustler Nation - but we need to actually LINDA KATIBA- and therefore if you don't desire a political battle until 2022 - judiciary can buy us time. Therefore it need more court petition in many courts to injunct it.
You are still going into the merits and demerits of the document. What you mention is the Irony of the matter at hand , Raila and his ilk will rally for this constitution to be amended but come September 2022 after losing elections will be the first people to say the constitution is bad and agitate for another amendment (Same Case with  2010 constitution Okoa Kenya/BBI ) .Raila will never stop referendum call until he sees the constitution is nearly the same as the Bomas draft .

Offline Nowayhaha

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Re: Muturi say they will short circuit BBI - and pass it in a month
« Reply #17 on: February 07, 2021, 01:59:15 PM »
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/politics/ruto-i-have-not-said-i-oppose-bbi-3282422

Deputy President William Ruto Saturday ended his three-day tour of the Coast region with a message to the two Building Bridges Initiative (BBI) principals – President Uhuru Kenyatta and ODM leader Raila Odinga – to “give the people the document to read for themselves”.

But while he was harsh in his criticism of the proponents of the proposed constitutional changes, Dr Ruto said he is not pushing for a No vote.

“I have not said I oppose BBI, but I am saying the people are asking questions, come give them answers. Bring them the copies and they will decide. They are not stupid, they will decide,” he said.

During his entire visit of Kwale, Kilifi and Mombasa counties, where he held at least eight meetings with local leaders and youth, he poked holes into the BBI programme without out-rightly asking the electorate to reject it at the referendum.

Provide copies
At his final meeting at Frere Town Grounds in Nyali, Mombasa Saturday, he asked those pushing for the BBI referendum to first provide copies of the report, whose contents he said ordinary people do not know.

He said for the longest time now, the BBI proponents, especially ODM leader Raila Odinga, have been using him as a punching bag by accusing him of campaigning against the BBI, yet wananchi are yet to read the document.

“Stop using me as an excuse,” he said.

“Please bring copies to these people because they want to read and understand where and for whom is the Constitution being changed. These people do not want to be told what is in the report, they need to know.”

35 per cent revenue
Dr Ruto questioned the provision of the 35 per cent revenue to counties as proposed in the BBI Bill, expressing doubt that the funds will be made available at a time when the national government is already finding it hard to provide the current 15 per cent.

“Counties have debts of about 100 per cent; where will 35 per cent come from if we cannot have the 15 per cent? The people want to know if 35 per cent will come to the counties why not do it now because the current Constitution allows it, as it says we can provide a minimum of 15 per cent — which means it can be increased,” he said.

The DP also poked holes into the recommendation to have more representatives in the National Assembly, which he said would burden the wananchi. He said the people want to know how they will benefit from having an additional 200 MPs proposed in the BBI Bill.

Creating positions
He reiterated his position that the BBI is about creating positions for a few leaders and how they will share power.

He noted that Kenya cannot be a place of discussions of sharing of power and positions only.

“As we talk about power and positions we must also talk about ordinary jobs for ordinary Kenyans. We must also talk about more resources and creating wealth for these people down here,” he said.

He also criticised on the issue of dynasties versus hustlers narrative which he said his competitors are framing as a class war. The DP said there is not class war in the country, but a discussion about the poor which he said is currently taking shape.

He said now, in every political forums held by leaders, the conversation has been about wheelbarrow and the hustlers.

"I told you we will change the discussion in this country. It will not be about leaders and finally the discussion has changed. We are happy because every meeting is talking about the wheelbarrows and hustlers," said Dr Ruto.

The DP also launched a scathing attack on Mr Odinga and his Nasa leaders whom he said are waiting for endorsement from President Kenyatta. He said Mr Odinga and his brigade, who were together in Nasa coalition, are clueless leaders who do not know whether they are in opposition or in government.