How Pastors Get Rich before Dyin Tryin

[kadame]

vooke, so if I was born poor I will simply die poor? That is according to what you implly above.
I believe that being poor yesterday doesn't equiate to being poor tommorow. That's a lie and in contravention to christian faith sir!

No one is obligated to be rich or poor. That is the point. God provides all with different means, gifts, talents, opportunities and so forth. We are to do our best with what God has put in our hands. And there is nothing to stop God from putting more in our hands if he so pleases. But if we make the pursuit of wealth an end in itself, as if its the highlight of this life we live, then we are no different than worldlings who pursue earthly things with extreme fervor--status, wealth, power, fame, looks etc--thinking that's all there is to life. Christians should know happiness comes from our grounding in God's love for us, which is free, permanent, guaranteed, and unmeritable, that provides for us in all sorts of ways at every single moment of our existence, most of which we are not even aware. Just because someone is poor, it doesn't mean he is not blessed. To think the poor or those who face misfortunes are cursed is an affront to God's love for all his children. They are no more cursed than you, in the sense that their "curse" is to live in a fallen world which even Jesus lived in for 33 years.

[vooke]

bittertruth,
That's your own unwarranted CONCLUSION which you are attacking. Very Nuff Sed-esque. I can't defend your conclusions
Am working so hard so that my kids and their kids can live better than me.My life and my family is far much better than what it was when i was much younger. Poverty on a personal or community level is not terminal but it is inevitable and most certainly not incompatible with Christianity. The poor you will always have with you. This is not fatalism but realism that hits you the moment you open your eyes.

You on the other hand are up against brutal reality and ZERO scriptural basis for your stance. Why are you clinging to this poisonous doctrine? Have you ever evangelized among the poor?

I have discovered something both here and .com. Trust negroes to defend they doctrines with all they have and if necessary scriptures

vooke, so if I was born poor I will simply die poor? That is according to what you imply above.
I believe that being poor yesterday doesn't equate to being poor tommorow. That's a lie and in contravention to christian faith sir!

[bittertruth]

Kadame, Please stop being ignorant.
I clearly listed the causes of poverty as laziness, fear, disobedience, generations curses etc.
Now you put a blanket and say "BT says that when you are poor is because you are cursed".  You should instead critique the above statement and tell me which of these is incorrect and why. This is spurious reasoning.

To think the poor or those who face misfortunes are cursed is an affront to God's love for all his children.

[bittertruth]

Poverty on a personal or community level is not terminal but it is inevitable and most certainly not incompatible with Christianity. The poor you will always have with you. This is not fatalism but realism that hits you the moment you open your eyes.

[vooke]

Ever wondered why Lazarus died despite being resurrected?
Why do Christians die just like everybody else? Is their faith insufficient to overcome mortality? 

[bittertruth]

You ask why Christians die? I cant put it better than Paul did

Ever wondered why Lazarus died despite being resurrected?
Why do Christians die just like everybody else? Is their faith insufficient to overcome mortality? 

[bittertruth]

I would only answer this if asked by a pagan, one who doesn't understand the purpose of life.

Is their faith insufficient to overcome mortality?

[vooke]

Just as Faith in God and His infinite abilities does not spare you from death  the same don't spare believers from sailing in varying states of wealth and health ranging from filthy rich to dirt poor

Am sure nobody in their right mind would equate the inevitability of death to God's inability/weakness

You ask why Christians die? I cant put it better than Paul did

[bittertruth]

vooke,
Your post just portrays Christ a liar when he said If we have faith nothing will be impossible, if we believe?
You focus on what Faith cannot do rather than what Faith can do. That is a misguided view of Faith sir!
Matthew 17:20 He replied, "Because you have so little faith. I tell you the truth, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you. "

Just as Faith in God and His infinite abilities does not spare you from death  the same don't spare believers from sailing in varying states of wealth and health ranging from filthy rich to dirt poor[/b]
Am sure nobody in their right mind would equate the inevitability of death to God's inability/weakness

You ask why Christians die? I cant put it better than Paul did

[GeeMail]

BT, few other Protestants even dare mention the second death. I'm touched.

[bittertruth]

vooke,
Do you believe that Faith can affect our physical circumstances?

Do you believe that God can deliver person from poverty, disease or whichever other suffering they are in?

Just as Faith in God and His infinite abilities does not spare you from death  the same don't spare believers from sailing in varying states of wealth and health ranging from filthy rich to dirt poor

[vooke]

bittertruth,
FAITH is not a magic wand that is you wield to achieve ANY objective.
I gave you a simple illustration. Would you attain immortality by simply having FAITH that you won't die? Of course not because death is a given. Same case with poverty,pain,suffering. You cant 'faith' your way out of none of these sir!

FAITH I repeat is not commanding God to do our bidding. And again it is not a blank cheque. If you don't believe me try and create another sun by faith. Or even better, have faith and be God's EQUAL because that is certainly within the realm of 'POSSIBLE'

I don't understand how you are adept at twisting my words and scriptures to accommodate your illogical position. My thoughts and feelings MUST bow at the Word of God not the other way round.

Theology 101
1. God creation is 'good' and 'very good'
2. Man is tempted and falls into sin/rebellion resulting into the less than 'good' creation
3. Consequences of man's fall is separation from God and we see this in pain,suffering,disease,death
4. God is working a plan to restore creation to 'good'
5. Before God restores creation to 'good' the consequences in 4. are to be expected
6. No amount of technology,prayers,reciting scriptures will rid these consequences BEFORE God does away with them

vooke,
Your post just portrays Christ a liar when he said If we have faith nothing will be impossible, if we believe?
You focus on what Faith cannot do rather than what Faith can do. That is a misguided view of Faith sir!
Matthew 17:20 He replied, "Because you have so little faith. I tell you the truth, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you. "

[vooke]

Of course yes!
It's your turn now. DO you believe that FAITH can affect your gender, say transform you from bittertruth to Bettytruth or in short give you a sex-change?

vooke,
Do you believe that Faith can affect our physical circumstances?

Do you believe that God can deliver person from poverty, disease or whichever other suffering they are in?

[kadame]

I know I checked out but sometimes a post is too well written to go unrewarded. This post is perfect!!!

bittertruth,
FAITH is not a magic wand that is you wield to achieve ANY objective.
I gave you a simple illustration. Would you attain immortality by simply having FAITH that you won't die? Of course not because death is a given. Same case with poverty,pain,suffering. You cant 'faith' your way out of none of these sir!

FAITH I repeat is not commanding God to do our bidding. And again it is not a blank cheque. If you don't believe me try and create another sun by faith. Or even better, have faith and be God's EQUAL because that is certainly within the realm of 'POSSIBLE'

I don't understand how you are adept at twisting my words and scriptures to accommodate your illogical position. My thoughts and feelings MUST bow at the Word of God not the other way round.

Theology 101
1. God creation is 'good' and 'very good'
2. Man is tempted and falls into sin/rebellion resulting into the less than 'good' creation
3. Consequences of man's fall is separation from God and we see this in pain,suffering,disease,death
4. God is working a plan to restore creation to 'good'
5. Before God restores creation to 'good' the consequences in 4. are to be expected
6. No amount of technology,prayers,reciting scriptures will rid these consequences BEFORE God does away with them

[bittertruth]

bittertruth,
FAITH is not a magic wand that is you wield to achieve ANY objective.
I gave you a simple illustration. Would you attain immortality by simply having FAITH that you won't die? Of course not because death is a given. Same case with poverty,pain,suffering. You cant 'faith' your way out of none of these sir!

FAITH I repeat is not commanding God to do our bidding. And again it is not a blank cheque. If you don't believe me try and create another sun by faith. Or even better, have faith and be God's EQUAL because that is certainly within the realm of 'POSSIBLE'

I don't understand how you are adept at twisting my words and scriptures to accommodate your illogical position. My thoughts and feelings MUST bow at the Word of God not the other way round.

Theology 101
1. God creation is 'good' and 'very good'
2. Man is tempted and falls into sin/rebellion resulting into the less than 'good' creation
3. Consequences of man's fall is separation from God and we see this in pain,suffering,disease,death
4. God is working a plan to restore creation to 'good'
5. Before God restores creation to 'good' the consequences in 4. are to be expected
6. No amount of technology,prayers,reciting scriptures will rid these consequences BEFORE God does away with them

vooke,
Your post just portrays Christ a liar when he said If we have faith nothing will be impossible, if we believe?
You focus on what Faith cannot do rather than what Faith can do. That is a misguided view of Faith sir!
Matthew 17:20 He replied, "Because you have so little faith. I tell you the truth, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you. "

[vooke]

bittertruth,
I aksd those rhetorical questions to drill sense through your head and ultimately spirit by demonstrating the absurdity of your position of 'anything goes' because with God Nothing is IMPOSSIBLE. Looks like it worked!

The only thing am denying and fighting here is unscriptural and highly toxic doctrine of bliss-after-Christ. Jesus says His burden is light and His yoke is easy but by no means a life free of disease,pain,suffering and death. If you are going to convert a single soul to Christ please cease and desist from promising a disease,pain,suffering and death-free life because you will ruin that soul should they run into these later on.

When Jesus called Paul, He clearly showed him the many things he would suffer for His Name. Paul knew exactly what to expect


Would you be kind enough to ignore vooke but not even entertain opposing your Lord and Savior?

[bittertruth]

[vooke]

Bittertruth,
God's ability is not in question. You are one confused negro who can't follow logic if your life depended on it. How do you code?

This is my line of argument fully backed by scriptures and reality;
1. God CAN wipe off the face of the earth poverty,disease,pain  suffering and death
2. God HASN'T wiped off the face of the earth poverty,disease,pain,suffering and death
3. God DOESN'T wipe off a believer's life poverty,disease,suffering and death otherwise there would be millions of examples of the same seeing the world population has a decent proportion of Christians
4. Existence of poverty,disease,suffering and death does not negate God's omniscience
5. God WILL finally wipe off the face of the earth poverty,disease,suffering and death in the END
Is it clear now?

[bittertruth]

vooke,
You statements are either negative or futuristic....CAN, HASN'T, DOESN'T, WILL.
What makes it hard for you to acknowledge what God (HAS) done instead of what he (HASN'T, DOESN'T) do?

3. God DOESN'T wipe off a believer's life poverty,disease,suffering

Ati GOD DESN'T HEAL?

Your lack of faith is causing you to deny his power in the face of disease, suffering, poverty etc.

Gods word HAS delivered and Healed many lives.

[vooke]

Negro,
Healing in Christianity is a miracle, isolated event not a lifestyle promised to believers.
Can we say that resurrection has happened because Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead? No we can't; Lazarus resurrected and later died not to mention ALL saints born before 1900AD are dead

So God heals but diseases are part and parcel of the consequences of the Fall until the END. Contrary to your wishful thinking,God does not spare his children from the consequences of the Fall

Reciting scriptures and having faith that moves volcanoes DOES NOT spare NOBODY from the consequences of the Fall

vooke,
You statements are either negative or futuristic....CAN, HASN'T, DOESN'T, WILL.
What makes it hard for you to acknowledge what God (HAS) done instead of what he (HASN'T, DOESN'T) do?

3. God DOESN'T wipe off a believer's life poverty,disease,suffering

Ati GOD DESN'T HEAL?

Your lack of faith is causing you to deny his power in the face of disease, suffering, poverty etc.

Gods word HAS delivered and Healed many lives.