NASWA claims 100+,KNCHR claims 24

[KenyanPlato]

I know this guy vooke is a turncoat. He is a sadist he is hiding behind government official statements.. KHRC is not what it used to be. I wonder where they got this slow woman

[Omollo]

Not quite. He just exercises his powers of debate. He usually admits when he is proven wrong.

I know this guy vooke is a turncoat. He is a sadist he is hiding behind government official statements.. KHRC is not what it used to be. I wonder where they got this slow woman

[Nefertiti]

Omollo - what is this "cholera scare" business? Do you suggest there has been no cholera outbreak?

[vooke]

75 deaths known ONLY to NASWA and NOBODY ELSE is a huge joke. Tell me, does a higher body count work for or against NASWA?

I believe Orengo on death count. The media has been gagged for this reason. We also had the story of body bags during campaigns. In 2008 the deaths were many more than the official 1600 - same as the phony 3000 deaths of US 9-11. Govts lie all the time to "maintain order". I find this suppressing of the truth for security reasons to be valid.

I'm allergic to conspiracy theories.

Waki/CIPEV Commission did the investigation and arrived at 1,163. They visited morgues,hot spots,interviewed hundreds of witnesses,cops...before arriving at 1,163 So unless you are insinuating that they were compromised, then you should back up your claims.

KNCHR is credible, and unless Omorlo can spin another yarn of how Jubilated they are, I got no reason to quadruple their figure

Matiang'i and KNHRC are lying for the same reason the US lied over 9-11 - national image.

KNCHR is lying for GoK? What else, Uhunye is drinking blood of the protestors?

KNCHR is lying for Kenya - same reason I think there should be no riots and all disputes must be resolved in court. Not everyone is sapped into the Uhuru-NASA zerosum game.

Robina you are not sober. You so badly want to buy NASWA unsubstantiated nonsense and you are willing to throw your otherwise rational approach to politics through the window.

For the umpteenth time, WHY should I believe NASWA a partisan entity and depart from an independent body?

[vooke]

Vooke,
Where are the bodies? In the mortuary or in Government dumpsites? when a protester is killed who investigates? I saw Commissioner Njenga saying that those killed are looters and that investigations will carried. Why is the minister claiming no live ammunition is used when evidence points to live ammunition being used indiscriminately?

I have been following news reports and SM. That alone goes beyond 24 by far. There are photos of bodies by International Journalists who braved the Cholera scare.

ALL have bullets as usual.

vooke is playing his favorite game about the Kisumu dead after Uthamaki killings.

The best approach is to tell him nobody died and ask him to relax and go join the celebrations in Gatundu.

Omorlo, extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence.
Right now,NASWA has discredited anyone and anything that contradicts their narrative from Kerry to ELOG. So discrediting KNCHR is a natural. Problem is NASWA has nothing supporting their claims.

75 families are currently looking for their sons. That's IMPOSSIBLE to hide in such small areas as Kisumu,Siaya and Homa Bay.

So the deaths may be 100 or even 300, but absence of evidence, of any shred of evidence followed by 'don't even look for evidence because GoK has hid the bodies' is unremarkable.

If this claim was made by a cabinet secretary, I'm pretty certain you would mock them

[vooke]

National Police Service says it's neither 100 nor 24

It's 11

CLARIFICATION ON FALSE ALLEGATIONS AGAINST POLICE.

The National Police Service takes great exception to... https://t.co/vA61quZTVi

— National Police Service-Kenya (@NPSOfficial_KE) August 13, 2017

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

If just one person is killed under the conditions being reported, that is a tragedy and the Matiangis of this world should be held accountable.

[vooke]

AFP says 11

NASWA is alone with it's ridiculous 100+

Invalid Tweet ID

[vooke]

If just one person is killed under the conditions being reported, that is a tragedy and the Matiangis of this world should be held accountable.

Injuries let alone death are just as bad.

What NASWA can't do is go past its shitty rigging claims and assume the activist role hoping we will all forget Babu is busy subverting democracy because he's on it's receiving end

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

If just one person is killed under the conditions being reported, that is a tragedy and the Matiangis of this world should be held accountable.

Injuries let alone death are just as bad.

What NASWA can't do is go past its shitty rigging claims and assume the activist role hoping we will all forget Babu is busy subverting democracy because he's on it's receiving end

One of your passions appears to be to normalize and minimize the excesses of the Jubilant regime.  Suppose Baba is subverting democracy, how does it explain this tweet?

Invalid Tweet ID

[Kichwa]

It reminds me of what one Israeli official said after they killed Palestinian demonstrators, "I hate the Palestinians for making our boys kill them".  That is the crap Pastor Vooke is trying to sell here-that he hates Raila for making their boys kill innocent Kenyans. I wanted to use a certain well known analogy to further make the point but I know Robina and the ladies on this board will kill me.

If just one person is killed under the conditions being reported, that is a tragedy and the Matiangis of this world should be held accountable.

Injuries let alone death are just as bad.

What NASWA can't do is go past its shitty rigging claims and assume the activist role hoping we will all forget Babu is busy subverting democracy because he's on it's receiving end

One of your passions appears to be to normalize and minimize the excesses of the Jubilant regime.  Suppose Baba is subverting democracy, how does it explain this tweet?

Invalid Tweet ID

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

It reminds me of what one Israeli official said after they killed Palestinian demonstrators, "I hate the Palestinians for making our boys kill them".  That is the crap Pastor Vooke is trying to sell here-that he hates Raila for making their boys kill innocent Kenyans. I wanted to use a certain well known analogy to further make the point but I know Robina and the ladies on this board will kill me.

If just one person is killed under the conditions being reported, that is a tragedy and the Matiangis of this world should be held accountable.

Injuries let alone death are just as bad.

What NASWA can't do is go past its shitty rigging claims and assume the activist role hoping we will all forget Babu is busy subverting democracy because he's on it's receiving end

One of your passions appears to be to normalize and minimize the excesses of the Jubilant regime.  Suppose Baba is subverting democracy, how does it explain this tweet?

Invalid Tweet ID

The blame anybody but the perp strategy.  If you are victimized by cops, you must have done something wrong, so goes the thinking. 

Below is the story.  What part of the law are they enforcing or even obeying with house to house raids?

http://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2017/08/13/agony-as-6-month-old-infant-slips-into-coma-after-police-beating_c1615805?platform=hootsuite

[vooke]

If just one person is killed under the conditions being reported, that is a tragedy and the Matiangis of this world should be held accountable.

Injuries let alone death are just as bad.

What NASWA can't do is go past its shitty rigging claims and assume the activist role hoping we will all forget Babu is busy subverting democracy because he's on it's receiving end

One of your passions appears to be to normalize and minimize the excesses of the Jubilant regime.  Suppose Baba is subverting democracy, how does it explain this tweet?

Invalid Tweet ID

There's nothing human about clobbering a baby. I don't believe they did that.

The thug probably hit a cop and was chased right up to his house. He took his baby for body shield.

There's the famous thing in a green Jersey who was clobbered till he fainted during anti-IEBC demos. His alibi? He was walking to Westland for a job interview as an Uber driver.....until another photo surfaced where he was armed with stones.

[vooke]

Termie I kid you not. This thug grabbed my neighbor's infant to save himself from an angry mob baying for his blood.

Even at their worst, you've never heard of cops beating an infant. The baby is not even moving. Something about this just doesn't add up.

Anyways, no amount of police brutality covers NASWA's baseless claims of rigging.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Are you saying the guy must have used his own baby as a human shield?  Is that also the excuse the police are giving?  That you saw another guy using some else's baby as a shield.  Is that your evidence?

[vooke]

Are you saying the guy must have used his own baby as a human shield?  Is that also the excuse the police are giving?  That you saw another guy using some else's baby as a shield.  Is that your evidence?

Nope, I'm saying it doesn't make sense clobbering an immobile and totally unthreatening infant. I don't know the other half of the account, and I have seen a goon spin a long yarn that fell apart a few photos later.

[Kadame6]

Are you saying the guy must have used his own baby as a human shield?  Is that also the excuse the police are giving?  That you saw another guy using some else's baby as a shield.  Is that your evidence?

Nope, I'm saying it doesn't make sense clobbering an immobile and totally unthreatening infant. I don't know the other half of the account, and I have seen a goon spin a long yarn that fell apart a few photos later.

But in your own version you have these cops clobbering a baby because it was being used as a shield. I am unsure how you think this makes the situation even 0.1% better.

About sense: It makes about as much sense to say the guy used his own baby as a shield. Except this is totally made up by you, vooke without any evidence.

Also, a guy "shielding" himself is obviously not endangering anyone, why exactly was he getting clobbered with a club rather than getting arrested or left alone?

2) EVEN MORE SO WHEN THERE WAS A FREAKIN BABY IN THE WAY?????????????

The unyama of a cop who goes ahead to clobber a baby because its being used as shield is exactly the same as one who clobbers one just because. Normal people don't swing clubs at babies whatever the reason.

I also AM NOT giving KENYA's security forces ANY benefit of the doubt:

-There brutality is legendary
-There is a media gag

That means things are going on that someone doesnt want to be caught in camera likely to avoid a situation like the 2008 PEV cop in Kisumu who was seen committing murder on KTN and eventually convicted based on that footage.

[vooke]

Are you saying the guy must have used his own baby as a human shield?  Is that also the excuse the police are giving?  That you saw another guy using some else's baby as a shield.  Is that your evidence?

Nope, I'm saying it doesn't make sense clobbering an immobile and totally unthreatening infant. I don't know the other half of the account, and I have seen a goon spin a long yarn that fell apart a few photos later.

But in your own version you have these cops clobbering a baby because it was being used as a shield. I am unsure how you think this makes the situation even 0.1% better.

About sense: It makes about as much sense to say the guy used his own baby as a shield. Except this is totally made up by you, vooke without any evidence.

Also, a guy "shielding" himself is obviously not endangering anyone, why exactly was he getting clobbered with a club rather than getting arrested or left alone?

2) EVEN MORE SO WHEN THERE WAS A FREAKIN BABY IN THE WAY?????????????

The unyama of a cop who goes ahead to clobber a baby because its being used as shield is exactly the same as one who clobbers one just because. Normal people don't swing clubs at babies whatever the reason.

I also AM NOT giving KENYA's security forces ANY benefit of the doubt:

-There brutality is legendary
-There is a media gag

That means things are going on that someone doesnt want to be caught in camera likely to avoid a situation like the 2008 PEV cop in Kisumu who was seen committing murder on KTN and eventually convicted based on that footage.

I do not know the other side of the account and neither do you. All I did was give possible narrative.No looters/rioters will admit as much. BTW it's also possible many hid in his house and teargas was lobbed to flush them out....ad nauseum.

The current account is reprehensible but it doesn't make any sense.

[Kadame6]

I do not know the other side of the account and neither do you. All I did was give possible narrative.No looters/rioters will admit as much. BTW it's also possible many hid in his house and teargas was lobbed to flush them out....ad nauseum.

The current account is reprehensible but it doesn't make any sense.

vooke, just step back a bit and look at what you're saying: the narrative you propose is based on completely ignoring the testimony of the people who were involved and appears to be done in order to make people known for their brutality look better. Step one is therefore throwing away the only info we have that is based in reality and then step two is replacing it with one thats not. I dont understand why you think that aporoach is more sensible. For me, I think its beyter to accept the account of these PARENTS whose baby is lying nearly dead in a hospital until we have other contradictory information.

[vooke]

I do not know the other side of the account and neither do you. All I did was give possible narrative.No looters/rioters will admit as much. BTW it's also possible many hid in his house and teargas was lobbed to flush them out....ad nauseum.

The current account is reprehensible but it doesn't make any sense.

vooke, just step back a bit and look at what you're saying: the narrative you propose is based on completely ignoring the testimony of the people who were involved and appears to be done in order to make people known for their brutality look better. Step one is therefore throwing away the only info we have that is based in reality and then step two is replacing it with one thats not. I dont understand why you think that aporoach is more sensible. For me, I think its beyter to accept the account of these PARENTS whose baby is lying nearly dead in a hospital until we have other contradictory information.

All we have is an infant fighting for her life and having head injuries. If IPOA was to investigate,they'd do more than run with the account because they are sensible enough to know that it could be biased.

I don't intend to make you doubt it as I do. I remain skeptical with good reasons; it is not corroborated.

I don't doubt the injuries but the circumstances which could have been embellished to absolve the parents

Again, Boniface Manono convinced the entire nation that he was an honest jobseeker caught up in anti-IEBC protests....until evidence emerged that he was actually one of the stone throwing goons.

Please note, it's not a question of excessive/disproportionate force but a sole lying witness. A rioter earns less public sympathy than an innocent jobseeker.


Here's Manono

#Kivumbi2017 Remember the Boniface Manono incident? Was the policeman ever punished? Why should we expect those involved now to be? @KTNNews pic.twitter.com/BgfkgMuWAb

— gathara (@gathara) August 13, 2017