NASWA claims 100+,KNCHR claims 24

[Kadame6]

I think believing the people involved (actual witnesses) in the absence of any contradictory evidence is still tonnes better than immediately making up a story that has no basis or source anywhere and places 100% of the blame on the hurt person saying that police came to their house, beat them up including their baby who as sure as day is in hospital nearly dying.  It earily reminds me of those days a woman was accused of causing her own rape as a knee-jerk response the very moment she reported it. Sure, there are women who have lied before, but a knee-jerk reaction to an accusation of an injured person being immediately (and WITHOUT facts) "she probably caused it" also says a lot. Here you are extremely biased vooke. And it's showing.

[Nefertiti]

Folks please factor in that vooke is a pastor - why would he lie or spin voodoo

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

vooke's logic?  I don't believe it, therefore it is not true.. Have the cops even denied this story?  Do they even have a version or are we supposed to believe anybody's made up version until they cobble up a narrative?

[vooke]

I think believing the people involved (actual witnesses) in the absence of any contradictory evidence is still tonnes better than immediately making up a story that has no basis or source anywhere and places 100% of the blame on the hurt person saying that police came to their house, beat them up including their baby who as sure as day is in hospital nearly dying.  It earily reminds me of those days a woman was accused of causing her own rape as a knee-jerk response the very moment she reported it. Sure, there are women who have lied before, but a knee-jerk reaction to an accusation of an injured person being immediately (and WITHOUT facts) "she probably caused it" also says a lot. Here you are extremely biased vooke. And it's showing.

They are not mutually exclusive; Manono's script was believable. The couple's script too. You can work with that while being skeptical. Skepticism doesn't mean dismissing an account

[vooke]

vooke's logic?  I don't believe it, therefore it is not true.. Have the cops even denied this story?  Do they even have a version or are we supposed to believe anybody's made up version until they cobble up a narrative?

Cops rejecting it won't change you if your past is anything to go by. NASWA spewed shiet on IEBC 'leaks' and you ran around just because IEBC had yet to deny. They tore it apart a few hours later and you pretended not to see the debunking.

They have denied more obvious and less disgusting stuff, so you can bet they will deny this or spin another yarn

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

vooke's logic?  I don't believe it, therefore it is not true.. Have the cops even denied this story?  Do they even have a version or are we supposed to believe anybody's made up version until they cobble up a narrative?

Cops rejecting it won't change you if your past is anything to go by. NASWA spewed shiet on IEBC 'leaks' and you ran around just because IEBC had yet to deny. They tore it apart a few hours later and you pretended not to see the debunking.

They have denied more obvious and less disgusting stuff, so you can bet they will deny this or spin another yarn

It should be easy to link to evidence demonstrating your claim about leaks.  It is possible I missed the response for some reason, including the flooding of this place with unnecessary new threads.

[Kadame6]

I think believing the people involved (actual witnesses) in the absence of any contradictory evidence is still tonnes better than immediately making up a story that has no basis or source anywhere and places 100% of the blame on the hurt person saying that police came to their house, beat them up including their baby who as sure as day is in hospital nearly dying.  It earily reminds me of those days a woman was accused of causing her own rape as a knee-jerk response the very moment she reported it. Sure, there are women who have lied before, but a knee-jerk reaction to an accusation of an injured person being immediately (and WITHOUT facts) "she probably caused it" also says a lot. Here you are extremely biased vooke. And it's showing.

They are not mutually exclusive; Manono's script was believable. The couple's script too. You can work with that while being skeptical. Skepticism doesn't mean dismissing an account

Well, with respect, what you've displayed here is a tad different. Its not just sjepticism, there is an addes layer of what behaviours you think are believable for cops and for this couple. Not only is your benefit of the doubt already with the cops, with their history in this country, but you have dismissed this couple's story outright even without a competing story to pick sides on.

Is it more sensible to believe that it is below a cop to intentionally endanger a baby but well believable for its own parents to put it in harm's way? One could be forgiven for believing that you expect more empathy for a six month old from an anti-riot cop in Kenya than it gets from its own parents. I mean I've heard of HOUSE-HELPs who shielded babies/todlers in house robberies that got them harmed. All people Ive seen even those who have never been parents instinctively cover a baby they are holding/are responsible for in chaotic environments. Its not even a conscious calculation. Danger comes closer to a baby and you pounce on it and get it outta their.

I guess I'm just taken aback by the level of immorality you suspect them of having regarding their own child. This is a much more extraordinary claim than that the kid was beaten by a cop who was afterall illegally beating people up in houses.

[vooke]

Kadame,
I have lived in Kenia all my life and I have heard of stray bullets but I've never heard of cops clobbering a 6-month infant. 1982 coup never got us there, nor KDF deployment to Mt Elgon. Even the worst of Mungiki excesses, they had limits. Al shabaab too have limits. The closest we came to this is a Pokot raid where they killed a heavily pregnant woman sometimes early this year.

So I'm equally horrified by this account.

But on the basis of all I know about our disciplined forces, I can't help but express my skepticism.

I've seen gore, gunshot injuries, bodies in Kisumu yet I'm.not even trying to dispute that. I'm not even asking for context or corroboration. But clobbering a tiny immobile piece of humanity?

[vooke]

Kadame,
Concerning IEBC, NASWA has since elections made two sets of claims. The first was the so called IEBC server logs. There's a thread on that by Pundito.

The second one came later, they claimed to have received some leaks from an IEBC whistleblower showing the actual results which were differing from what was on the portal and what was being relayed on tv. The results were clustered by Counties showed Baba leading. They called a presser on this basis and demanded Baba be declared to be the winner. They also sent IEBC a letter to this effect. IEBC responded during their next presser and issued a letter.

I will try and get you the 'leak'. Here's the presser;

Here's IEBC's response which came about 3-4 hours later on Thursday. Can't fetch the relevant tweet but I saved a copy of the letter to my drive
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2rMMQJiqMB8T3lCLVRqV196blU/view?usp=drivesdk

Chebukati's presser on NASWA's demands

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Kadame,
I have lived in Kenia all my life and I have heard of stray bullets but I've never heard of cops clobbering a 6-month infant. 1982 coup never got us there, nor KDF deployment to Mt Elgon. Even the worst of Mungiki excesses, they had limits. Al shabaab too have limits. The closest we came to this is a Pokot raid where they killed a heavily pregnant woman sometimes early this year.

So I'm equally horrified by this account.

But on the basis of all I know about our disciplined forces, I can't help but express my skepticism.

I've seen gore, gunshot injuries, bodies in Kisumu yet I'm.not even trying to dispute that. I'm not even asking for context or corroboration. But clobbering a tiny immobile piece of humanity?

And here we are with the clobbered and now deceased infant.  Mere belief or disbelief manufactures new facts only in your mind.

[vooke]

Kadame,
I have lived in Kenia all my life and I have heard of stray bullets but I've never heard of cops clobbering a 6-month infant. 1982 coup never got us there, nor KDF deployment to Mt Elgon. Even the worst of Mungiki excesses, they had limits. Al shabaab too have limits. The closest we came to this is a Pokot raid where they killed a heavily pregnant woman sometimes early this year.

So I'm equally horrified by this account.

But on the basis of all I know about our disciplined forces, I can't help but express my skepticism.

I've seen gore, gunshot injuries, bodies in Kisumu yet I'm.not even trying to dispute that. I'm not even asking for context or corroboration. But clobbering a tiny immobile piece of humanity?

And here we are with the clobbered and now deceased infant.  Mere belief or disbelief manufactures new facts only in your mind.

Dead/alive, the story does not add up

[Kadame6]

Kadame,
Concerning IEBC, NASWA has since elections made two sets of claims. The first was the so called IEBC server logs. There's a thread on that by Pundito.

The second one came later, they claimed to have received some leaks from an IEBC whistleblower showing the actual results which were differing from what was on the portal and what was being relayed on tv. The results were clustered by Counties showed Baba leading. They called a presser on this basis and demanded Baba be declared to be the winner. They also sent IEBC a letter to this effect. IEBC responded during their next presser and issued a letter.

I will try and get you the 'leak'. Here's the presser;

Here's IEBC's response which came about 3-4 hours later on Thursday. Can't fetch the relevant tweet but I saved a copy of the letter to my drive
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B2rMMQJiqMB8T3lCLVRqV196blU/view?usp=drivesdk

Chebukati's presser on NASWA's demands

If you notice, Im not saying anything about NASA claims. This is an environment where the media has been deliberately excluded. That alone makes all my alarms go up. I cant just "buy" the "official narrative": this is are forces that EJKs problematic individuals like suspected thieves, terrorists, mungiki members, you name it. Kenyan security forces and brutality go together like bread and jam. So if I have a dead baby, its parents, and their non-contradicted version of events, I'm going with it.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Kadame,
I have lived in Kenia all my life and I have heard of stray bullets but I've never heard of cops clobbering a 6-month infant. 1982 coup never got us there, nor KDF deployment to Mt Elgon. Even the worst of Mungiki excesses, they had limits. Al shabaab too have limits. The closest we came to this is a Pokot raid where they killed a heavily pregnant woman sometimes early this year.

So I'm equally horrified by this account.

But on the basis of all I know about our disciplined forces, I can't help but express my skepticism.

I've seen gore, gunshot injuries, bodies in Kisumu yet I'm.not even trying to dispute that. I'm not even asking for context or corroboration. But clobbering a tiny immobile piece of humanity?

And here we are with the clobbered and now deceased infant.  Mere belief or disbelief manufactures new facts only in your mind.

Dead/alive, the story does not add up

What does that even mean?  All you have said is you don't believe it, in not so few words.  So what? as Kichwa would ask.  You might as well ask the parents not to believe their lying eyes.

[Kadame6]

Kadame,
I have lived in Kenia all my life and I have heard of stray bullets but I've never heard of cops clobbering a 6-month infant. 1982 coup never got us there, nor KDF deployment to Mt Elgon. Even the worst of Mungiki excesses, they had limits. Al shabaab too have limits. The closest we came to this is a Pokot raid where they killed a heavily pregnant woman sometimes early this year.

So I'm equally horrified by this account.

But on the basis of all I know about our disciplined forces, I can't help but express my skepticism.

I've seen gore, gunshot injuries, bodies in Kisumu yet I'm.not even trying to dispute that. I'm not even asking for context or corroboration. But clobbering a tiny immobile piece of humanity?

And here we are with the clobbered and now deceased infant.  Mere belief or disbelief manufactures new facts only in your mind.

Dead/alive, the story does not add up

There are no inconsistencies in the story, vooke: it "adds up"

[vooke]

Kadame,
Concerning IEBC, NASWA has since elections made two sets of claims. The first was the so called IEBC server logs. There's a thread on that by Pundito.

The second one came later, they claimed to have received some leaks from an IEBC whistleblower showing the actual results which were differing from what was on the portal and what was being relayed on tv. The results were clustered by Counties showed Baba leading. They called a presser on this basis and demanded Baba be declared to be the winner. They also sent IEBC a letter to this effect. IEBC responded during their next presser and issued a letter.

I will try and get you the 'leak'. Here's the presser;


Here's IEBC's response which came about 3-4 hours later on Thursday. Can't fetch the relevant tweet but I saved a copy of the letter to my drive


Chebukati's presser on NASWA's demands

If you notice, Im not saying anything about NASA claims. This is an environment where the media has been deliberately excluded. That alone makes all my alarms go up. I cant just "buy" the "official narrative": this is are forces that EJKs problematic individuals like suspected thieves, terrorists, mungiki members, you name it. Kenyan security forces and brutality go together like bread and jam. So if I have a dead baby, its parents, and their non-contradicted version of events, I'm going with it.

Sorry, it was Termie who asked for IEBC's response. I replied with these clips and document but he's decidedly blind.

Pole

[vooke]

Kadame,
I have lived in Kenia all my life and I have heard of stray bullets but I've never heard of cops clobbering a 6-month infant. 1982 coup never got us there, nor KDF deployment to Mt Elgon. Even the worst of Mungiki excesses, they had limits. Al shabaab too have limits. The closest we came to this is a Pokot raid where they killed a heavily pregnant woman sometimes early this year.

So I'm equally horrified by this account.

But on the basis of all I know about our disciplined forces, I can't help but express my skepticism.

I've seen gore, gunshot injuries, bodies in Kisumu yet I'm.not even trying to dispute that. I'm not even asking for context or corroboration. But clobbering a tiny immobile piece of humanity?

And here we are with the clobbered and now deceased infant.  Mere belief or disbelief manufactures new facts only in your mind.

Dead/alive, the story does not add up

There are no inconsistencies in the story, vooke: it "adds up"

It is a consistent one sided spin.

[vooke]

Kadame,
I have lived in Kenia all my life and I have heard of stray bullets but I've never heard of cops clobbering a 6-month infant. 1982 coup never got us there, nor KDF deployment to Mt Elgon. Even the worst of Mungiki excesses, they had limits. Al shabaab too have limits. The closest we came to this is a Pokot raid where they killed a heavily pregnant woman sometimes early this year.

So I'm equally horrified by this account.

But on the basis of all I know about our disciplined forces, I can't help but express my skepticism.

I've seen gore, gunshot injuries, bodies in Kisumu yet I'm.not even trying to dispute that. I'm not even asking for context or corroboration. But clobbering a tiny immobile piece of humanity?

And here we are with the clobbered and now deceased infant.  Mere belief or disbelief manufactures new facts only in your mind.

Dead/alive, the story does not add up

What does that even mean?  All you have said is you don't believe it, in not so few words.  So what? as Kichwa would ask.  You might as well ask the parents not to believe their lying eyes.

Means exactly that. Why can't you get over my skepticism?

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Kadame,
I have lived in Kenia all my life and I have heard of stray bullets but I've never heard of cops clobbering a 6-month infant. 1982 coup never got us there, nor KDF deployment to Mt Elgon. Even the worst of Mungiki excesses, they had limits. Al shabaab too have limits. The closest we came to this is a Pokot raid where they killed a heavily pregnant woman sometimes early this year.

So I'm equally horrified by this account.

But on the basis of all I know about our disciplined forces, I can't help but express my skepticism.

I've seen gore, gunshot injuries, bodies in Kisumu yet I'm.not even trying to dispute that. I'm not even asking for context or corroboration. But clobbering a tiny immobile piece of humanity?

And here we are with the clobbered and now deceased infant.  Mere belief or disbelief manufactures new facts only in your mind.

Dead/alive, the story does not add up

What does that even mean?  All you have said is you don't believe it, in not so few words.  So what? as Kichwa would ask.  You might as well ask the parents not to believe their lying eyes.

Means exactly that. Why can't you get over my skepticism?

Because you think your skepticism is more important than the evidence.

[Kadame6]

It is a consistent one sided spin.

But it is not a spin. Its the only story we have. Literally. How do you know it is a spin when you dont have contradictory facts? I'm giving up now.  You and Termi keep fighting.

[vooke]

Kadame,
I have lived in Kenia all my life and I have heard of stray bullets but I've never heard of cops clobbering a 6-month infant. 1982 coup never got us there, nor KDF deployment to Mt Elgon. Even the worst of Mungiki excesses, they had limits. Al shabaab too have limits. The closest we came to this is a Pokot raid where they killed a heavily pregnant woman sometimes early this year.

So I'm equally horrified by this account.

But on the basis of all I know about our disciplined forces, I can't help but express my skepticism.

I've seen gore, gunshot injuries, bodies in Kisumu yet I'm.not even trying to dispute that. I'm not even asking for context or corroboration. But clobbering a tiny immobile piece of humanity?

And here we are with the clobbered and now deceased infant.  Mere belief or disbelief manufactures new facts only in your mind.

Dead/alive, the story does not add up

What does that even mean?  All you have said is you don't believe it, in not so few words.  So what? as Kichwa would ask.  You might as well ask the parents not to believe their lying eyes.

Means exactly that. Why can't you get over my skepticism?

Because you think your skepticism is more important than the evidence.

It's more important than a one sided account