Afya theft of billions - Mailu & Murugaru need to quit with EACC moving in

[RV Pundit]

The legacy of Ndegwa commission of 70s. This need to be illegal. You cannot do business when in gov services. Your wife and kids cannot do business with goK either.

The former EACC chairman philip kinisu company was one of the company that received the money. If the eacc chairman is part of the corruption of the investigative body ,how can corruption end or be reduced. The big problem is a lot of people do business with government through their wives and family which is clear conflict of interest. I once heard Jakoyo Midiwo openly admitting on NTV that all of them do business with government and explaining it that legally there's no reason not to.

[Georgesoros]

Its called Ethics. Nobody follows any ethical principals in Kenya. Taxpayers receive the tab for these unethical behaviors.
DISGUSTING!!!

The legacy of Ndegwa commission of 70s. This need to be illegal. You cannot do business when in gov services. Your wife and kids cannot do business with goK either.

The former EACC chairman philip kinisu company was one of the company that received the money. If the eacc chairman is part of the corruption of the investigative body ,how can corruption end or be reduced. The big problem is a lot of people do business with government through their wives and family which is clear conflict of interest. I once heard Jakoyo Midiwo openly admitting on NTV that all of them do business with government and explaining it that legally there's no reason not to.

[Georgesoros]

Auditors are criminal investigators, and anyone who does not think outside the box should not be an auditor. Criminals dont show you where they hid the body, its your imagination that finds the body. Uhuru knows where the bodies are hidden, that is why he has been trying to contrain the AG.

We cannot fight corruption through Magufuli kind of antics - where PORK is all over - this may work in the short term but in the long term what will work are strong institutions. That mean a strong Auditor General offices doing it's work as defined by the constitution and the laws. I am not sure at what point the auditor general felt he needed to investigate everyone including  budget controller, central bank of kenya and US, JP Morgan US and all the institution. This is not audit. This someone who picks stuff from the media (raila) and goes on wild goose chase. That is domain of EACC - who act on whistle blowers and can go all the way. The job of the auditor starts somwhere - and it doesn't definitely start in the going to China to ascertain sgr loan or going to Newyork to check Eurobond. It starts where the budget controller ends - where money has been disbursed to a ministry or to commission.

Rather than seeking to constrain himself to doing just enough to get a salary, I am for a robust AG sniffing and finding whatever he can in the name of maximum transparency.  As long he is not breaking any laws.  Is there any law you are aware of that he is breaking?  Me neither.  Which is all the more alarming that the man is still not able to get to the bottom of the question now going on 2 years.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

We cannot fight corruption through Magufuli kind of antics - where PORK is all over - this may work in the short term but in the long term what will work are strong institutions. That mean a strong Auditor General offices doing it's work as defined by the constitution and the laws. I am not sure at what point the auditor general felt he needed to investigate everyone including  budget controller, central bank of kenya and US, JP Morgan US and all the institution. This is not audit. This someone who picks stuff from the media (raila) and goes on wild goose chase. That is domain of EACC - who act on whistle blowers and can go all the way. The job of the auditor starts somwhere - and it doesn't definitely start in the going to China to ascertain sgr loan or going to Newyork to check Eurobond. It starts where the budget controller ends - where money has been disbursed to a ministry or to commission.

Rather than seeking to constrain himself to doing just enough to get a salary, I am for a robust AG sniffing and finding whatever he can in the name of maximum transparency.  As long he is not breaking any laws.  Is there any law you are aware of that he is breaking?  Me neither.  Which is all the more alarming that the man is still not able to get to the bottom of the question now going on 2 years.

Wasn't the jubilant bitching the other day that he can't do a Magufuli because his hands are tied?  It's been mentioned elsewhere, kamwana can expose the thieves.  He can even make life hard for them.  All within his power without violating a single law. 

And he can do this even as the institutions play catch up.  In fact it may be what they need to spur them to action.  He could even use it to expand his campaign platform beyond I am your tribe.  But he won't.  And it is not because he has exhausted all options.

Do you know of any law that the Auditor General is breaking? Me neither.

[MOON Ki]

We cannot fight corruption through Magufuli kind of antics - where PORK is all over - this may work in the short term but in the long term what will work are strong institutions. That mean a strong Auditor General offices doing it's work as defined by the constitution and the laws. I am not sure at what point the auditor general felt he needed to investigate everyone including  budget controller, central bank of kenya and US, JP Morgan US and all the institution. This is not audit. This someone who picks stuff from the media (raila) and goes on wild goose chase. That is domain of EACC - who act on whistle blowers and can go all the way. The job of the auditor starts somwhere - and it doesn't definitely start in the going to China to ascertain sgr loan or going to Newyork to check Eurobond. It starts where the budget controller ends - where money has been disbursed to a ministry or to commission.

You are encouraged to read the Public Audit Act (Kenya).   Among other things, you should note the requirement the audit is to be carried out to international standards.    I believe the AG's office uses the International Standards of Supreme Audit.  In that, you are encouraged to look at the sections on public-sector auditing.   You will note that the auditor is to

obtain sufficient and appropriate evidence to enable the auditor to express an opinion as to whether the financial information is free from material misstatement due to fraud or error

And that is to include "financial records, financial systems, transactions ...".    (Further, the Public Audit Act leaves it to the AG to decide what it is that he needs to look into; someone like Uhuru has no say in such matters.) 

That is what the AG is trying to do in his audit of the "National Exchequer Account".   In particular, the "Disclaimer of Opinion" in relation to the Eurobond indicates that so far he has not been able to "obtain sufficient and appropriate evidence to provide a basis for an audit opinion".   Apparently he wishes to improve on that.

You have an interesting view on where the AG's job starts.   As a matter of fact (and common sense) one of the AG's functions that is "right up there" is to confirm that money that is supposed to be in the Consolidated Fund is actually there; he cannot simply take anybody's---Treasury, Controller of Budget, etc.---on that.  (You are also encouraged to appreciate the difference between the "financial" part and the "performance" and "compliance" parts of a public-sector audit.)

[RV Pundit]

That is an overreaching mangufuli who need to be fired. There are many institutions involve in running gov and unless magufuli ouko is alleging some grand conspiracy running all the way from Nairobi to NewYork he need to take the controller of budget word that she saw the money --central bank word that they bought the dollars- and work backwards - and focus the light on the ministries. The money that came in went through the budget line. In any case let him continue with wild goose chase - we will see in some few months what come of out there - besides the per diem. After those months - he'll need to resign.

He is going to end up messing the good work he has done auditing ministries and other gov department by playing Dr Ndii kind of baseless politics. He has fallen link, hook and sinker into Odinga propaganda and is definitely home bound with his international standard of BS while dr ndii and raila will continue earning from playing politics. If you ask the treasury and they say they got the money, then controller of budget confirms, then central banks say they bought the dollars - that should be enough! What do you hope to get by writing to JP Morgan or Fed Reserve Bank of us

We cannot fight corruption through Magufuli kind of antics - where PORK is all over - this may work in the short term but in the long term what will work are strong institutions. That mean a strong Auditor General offices doing it's work as defined by the constitution and the laws. I am not sure at what point the auditor general felt he needed to investigate everyone including  budget controller, central bank of kenya and US, JP Morgan US and all the institution. This is not audit. This someone who picks stuff from the media (raila) and goes on wild goose chase. That is domain of EACC - who act on whistle blowers and can go all the way. The job of the auditor starts somwhere - and it doesn't definitely start in the going to China to ascertain sgr loan or going to Newyork to check Eurobond. It starts where the budget controller ends - where money has been disbursed to a ministry or to commission.

You are encouraged to read the Public Audit Act (Kenya).   Among other things, you should note the requirement the audit is to be carried out to international standards.    I believe the AG's office uses the International Standards of Supreme Audit.  In that, you are encouraged to look at the sections on public-sector auditing.   You will note that the auditor is to

obtain sufficient and appropriate evidence to enable the auditor to express an opinion as to whether the financial information is free from material misstatement due to fraud or error

And that is to include "financial records, financial systems, transactions ...".    (Further, the Public Audit Act leaves it to the AG to decide what it is that he needs to look into; someone like Uhuru has no say in such matters.) 

That is what the AG is trying to do in his audit of the "National Exchequer Account".   In particular, the "Disclaimer of Opinion" in relation to the Eurobond indicates that so far he has not been able to "obtain sufficient and appropriate evidence to provide a basis for an audit opinion".   Apparently he wishes to improve on that.

You have an interesting view on where the AG's job starts.   As a matter of fact (and common sense) one of the AG's functions that is "right up there" is to confirm that money that is supposed to be in the Consolidated Fund is actually there; he cannot simply take anybody's---Treasury, Controller of Budget, etc.---on that.  (You are also encouraged to appreciate the difference between the "financial" part and the "performance" and "compliance" parts of a public-sector audit.)

[MOON Ki]

That is an overreaching mangufuli who need to be fired. There are many institutions involve in running gov and unless magufuli ouko is alleging some grand conspiracy running all the way from Nairobi to NewYork he need to take the controller of budget word that she saw the money

As I have tried to explain, his function as an auditor does not include taking anybody's word.    That is a matter of common sense; but even if one does not have that, his duties do include auditing the "National Exchequer Account", which is where the Consolidated Fund is located.

If you ask the treasury and they say they got the money, then controller of budget confirms, then central banks say they bought the dollars

Since the AG's job also includes auditing Treasury and Controller of Budget's office, simple logic indicates that he should not and must not take their word on anything.   Indeed, the Eurobond is not the only place where the AG's Treasury-audit opinions indicates that there is something to be desired; read the report.

work backwards - and focus the light on the ministries.

See the last sentence in my previous "post".

[RV Pundit]

Okay let us wait for magufuili to next write to the pope! I share Uhuru sentiment here 100% - something is wrong with Ouko - and - need to be send home. Let us give him six months and we will hear from NewYork Fed Reserve Bank of the US.

That is an overreaching mangufuli who need to be fired. There are many institutions involve in running gov and unless magufuli ouko is alleging some grand conspiracy running all the way from Nairobi to NewYork he need to take the controller of budget word that she saw the money

As I have tried to explain, his function as an auditor does not include taking anybody's word.    That is a matter of common sense; but even if one does not have that, his duties do include auditing the "National Exchequer Account", which is where the Consolidated Fund is located.

If you ask the treasury and they say they got the money, then controller of budget confirms, then central banks say they bought the dollars

Since the AG's job also includes auditing Treasury and Controller of Budget's office, simple logic indicates that he should not and must not take their word on anything.   Indeed, the Eurobond is not the only place where the AG's Treasury-audit opinions indicates that there is something to be desired; read the report.

work backwards - and focus the light on the ministries.

See the last sentence in my previous "post".

[MOON Ki]

Okay let us wait for magufuili to next write to the pope! I share Uhuru sentiment here 100% - something is wrong with Ouko - and - need to be send home. Let us give him six months and we will hear from NewYork Fed Reserve Bank of the US.

Ouko's job is to find the facts ("audit evidence") and then make a determination on the situation ("audit opinion").   Perhaps Eurobond money was eaten, and perhaps not.     His job is to find out and tell us, and that is all he needs to do; the idea that he will somehow have failed if it turns out that no money was stolen simply misses the point.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Okay let us wait for magufuili to next write to the pope! I share Uhuru sentiment here 100% - something is wrong with Ouko - and - need to be send home. Let us give him six months and we will hear from NewYork Fed Reserve Bank of the US.

Ouko's job is to find the facts ("audit evidence") and then make a determination on the situation ("audit opinion").   Perhaps Eurobond money was eaten, and perhaps not.     His job is to find out and tell us, and that is all he needs to do; the idea that he will somehow have failed if it turns out that no money was stolen simply misses the point.

I have nothing more to add.

[RV Pundit]

No problem except he would have wasted our time and money - and worse would have impeded our ability to float another eurobond - by discouraging the would be bond holders. The time and money he would have use to audit many of our counties that totally lack any systems or controls - but control more billions than EUROBOND every year. The auditor need to know when to stop looking.

Remember to float Eurobond we had to pay Angoleasing some 1.5B!! Now thanks to many fools who want to play baseless politics we might end up not being able to float more and more eurobonds - and will resort to domestic borrowing - further squeezing out private individual and families ability to borrow from local banks.

What is so special about 2.5B eurobond..when treasury this year is projected to borrow 4B USD from treasury bonds. It only special because Raila and his groupies wanted to play politricks.

Ouko's job is to find the facts ("audit evidence") and then make a determination on the situation ("audit opinion").   Perhaps Eurobond money was eaten, and perhaps not.     His job is to find out and tell us, and that is all he needs to do; the idea that he will somehow have failed if it turns out that no money was stolen simply misses the point.

[MOON Ki]

The time and money he would have use to audit many of our counties that totally lack any systems or controls -

He also audits counties, as he is required to do.   You can find the relevant reports here:

http://www.kenao.go.ke/index.php/reports/cat_view/2-reports/11-county-governments/79-county-government-reports-2014

[RV Pundit]

He has yet to scratch the surface. I met a guy from his office who just move to the county. The Kenao are now opening county office. All along they were operating from regional or provincial office. So clearly this Ouko fellow has more priorities than go on a wild goose chase in fed reserve bank of us. Our counties are a BIG MESS.

As a patriotic kenyan i am angered when I see people try to tarnish what we've worked so hard to get to. Our ability to freely float debt in international markets like most developed countries and tap in bottomless finances at very cheap interest. Now this ouko fool has decided to rubbish controller of budget, treasury, cbk, imf, wb and all those guys who already send him eft documents - and now want to go inside the fed reserve banks - and check the vaults:) to confirm if indeed our CBK has 7.5B USD worth of dollars there. What expensive nonsense is that.

Treasury is the meantime working hard on another roadshow to float another eurobond....and these kind of baseless useless sideshows that are now going the second yr WITHOUT aNY IOTa OF EDIVENCE..don't help. They don't help our national interest and AG paid by us - need to know better.

We should be celebrating our maiden eurobond as opportunity to be independent (no need to crawl at DC or China if we want to borrow...we present our fundamentals to the world of fund managers and they give us the money)..unless you're the fool (like Ouko) who think eurobond should be visible in projects! treasury borrows locally now twice the amount of eurobond they borrowed in 2014!  This is akin to prof nyongo claiming safaricom was being sold cheaply at 5shs per share you'd think some of the bozoos with phd had at least some basic understanding of modern finance.

The time and money he would have use to audit many of our counties that totally lack any systems or controls -

He also audits counties, as he is required to do.   You can find the relevant reports here:

http://www.kenao.go.ke/index.php/reports/cat_view/2-reports/11-county-governments/79-county-government-reports-2014

[MOON Ki]

Now this ouko fool has decided to rubbish controller of budget, treasury, cbk, imf, wb and all those guys who already send him eft documents -

For Treasury and Controller of Budget, see above.   What IMF said: the bond issue was successful, and GoK had access to the money.   That's it.   I don't recall anyone disputing that, least of all the AG "rubbishing" it.    Did the World Bank have anything else?  If so, what, and where and how did the AG "rubbish" it?

One more time: the AG's job is not just to accept whatever he is given by Treasury and COB; if it were that simple, then his job would not also include auditing Treasury and COB.  Is that really too complicated to understand?

[hk]

The corruption in governments seems to start in budgeting and allocation, then disbursement i.e IFMIS  http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Opinion-and-Analysis/Graft-war-must-start-with-IFMIS-loopholes/539548-3432368-item-0-mk8d36z/index.html .Whatever happened to office of management and budget  http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Treasury-stripped-of-budget-role-in-new-anti-graft-war/539546-2968928-rf3m0xz/index.html .

[RV Pundit]

Yeah that IFMIS system need to be seriously strengthen. Seem it free for all. It making corruption even easier. This is problem with badly thought out computerization.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

It has to start at the top.  Kimagufuli.  Anything else you might as well use toilet paper to plug a leakage.

[MOON Ki]

The corruption in governments seems to start in budgeting and allocation, then disbursement i.e IFMIS  http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Opinion-and-Analysis/Graft-war-must-start-with-IFMIS-loopholes/539548-3432368-item-0-mk8d36z/index.html .Whatever happened to office of management and budget  http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Treasury-stripped-of-budget-role-in-new-anti-graft-war/539546-2968928-rf3m0xz/index.html .

The real problem is in the people, not in the IFMIS or any other system.   The "sealing of loopholes" won't necessarily do much good, because at the end of the day there will, of necessity,  be people with all sorts of access and control, and if such people include scoundrels, then ...  What needs to be clearly understood, to start with, is that there is no technology that can make up for the lack of moral fibre.

Computerized systems and whatever can make it easier to detect theft, but detection has never been the problem in Kenya; whatever the scandal, the perpetrators are always known.   Big-time thieves in Kenya always get away with it, and they will continue in their mischief as long as that is the case.

[MOON Ki]

It has to start at the top.  Kimagufuli.  Anything else you might as well use toilet paper to plug a leakage.

Our His Excellency has stated it quite clearly: Make all the noise you care to make, lakini meat-eating will continue.

[Kadame5]

The 2010 constitution was a start but it needed to be mothered by a leader who gave two crap about it. Unfortunately, it was yanked by desperate ICC indictees and their cronies who now fill our legislature...you know, that body that's supposed to do checking, oversight and what-not. And we talk of institutions? Institutions are not created magically by documents, people. They are nurtured through persistent commitment until they become ubiquitous, 'the way things are' as a matter of course. At that point, you can absolve leadership of some responsibility. I haven't given up on our country but a half of us are not surprised in the least. We knew what we got when the duo took over.  I happen to think Uhuru is a good fellow deep down, but the man cannot extract himself from corruption whatever he does. Not because he does not want but because he needs it for his own political survival. It's the thing that got him where he is. He's not about to have a Saul of Tarsus Damascus moment anytime soon.