Hullabaloo about Eurobond is bad politics gone wrong

[Kadudu]

I thought Rotich said he disbursed the loot to the ministries. What changed between now and then?

[RV Pundit]

Kibaki borrowed 60B as syndicated commerical loan and Eurobond was used to pay this. That was planned right from Eurobond prospectus. The other money was transferred to Treasury and was used by treasury to meet financial obligaiton of kenya including repaying debts. It plausible another 60B of Eurobond was used in debt repayment. On average the treasury spend about 35B paying debts monthly. This money can come from domestic debt (tbill/tbond), taxes or foreign debt(Eurobond).

Money was borrowed to retire the expensive commerical loan and for budgetary support.

Eurobond is scandal that was invented by desperate CORD and never flew.

The hulaballo about Eurobond is really lots of nonsenses.

Treasury annually borrows same amount of money via our domestic market. It not that suddenly coz we borrowed in Eurobond then we have some "more" 200B. So this extra "new money" should be visible.

Nope. We just have the same money we had planned to borrow. In stead of CMA here in Nairobi, we borrowed from CMA of Ireland.

Every month Treasury borrows BILLIONS of kshs from our banks, insurance companies and name them through Treasury BONDS. I don't see people running around say there is scandal.

[Kadudu]

Kenya borrowed the Eurobond cash explicit for investment in infrastructure as per the terms Kenya used to drum investors for the Eurobond.
So where is the infrastructure to match the cash borrowed?

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-11-10/kenya-to-use-2-billion-eurobond-proceeds-as-growth-springboard

Kibaki borrowed 60B as syndicated commerical loan and Eurobond was used to pay this. That was planned right from Eurobond prospectus. The other money was transferred to Treasury and was used by treasury to meet financial obligaiton of kenya including repaying debts. It plausible another 60B of Eurobond was used in debt repayment. On average the treasury spend about 35B paying debts monthly. This money can come from domestic debt (tbill/tbond), taxes or foreign debt(Eurobond).

Money was borrowed to retire the expensive commerical loan and for budgetary support.

Eurobond is scandal that was invented by desperate CORD and never flew.

The hulaballo about Eurobond is really lots of nonsenses.

Treasury annually borrows same amount of money via our domestic market. It not that suddenly coz we borrowed in Eurobond then we have some "more" 200B. So this extra "new money" should be visible.

Nope. We just have the same money we had planned to borrow. In stead of CMA here in Nairobi, we borrowed from CMA of Ireland.

Every month Treasury borrows BILLIONS of kshs from our banks, insurance companies and name them through Treasury BONDS. I don't see people running around say there is scandal.

[RV Pundit]

Don't invent your own facts. Where did Kenya say they are borrowing money explicit for infrastructure. The money was borrowed to retire debts and for budgetary support. And the budget had a lot of infrastructure projects.

Kenya borrowed the Eurobond cash explicit for investment in infrastructure as per the terms Kenya used to drum investors for the Eurobond.
So where is the infrastructure to match the cash borrowed?

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-11-10/kenya-to-use-2-billion-eurobond-proceeds-as-growth-springboard

Kibaki borrowed 60B as syndicated commerical loan and Eurobond was used to pay this. That was planned right from Eurobond prospectus. The other money was transferred to Treasury and was used by treasury to meet financial obligaiton of kenya including repaying debts. It plausible another 60B of Eurobond was used in debt repayment. On average the treasury spend about 35B paying debts monthly. This money can come from domestic debt (tbill/tbond), taxes or foreign debt(Eurobond).

Money was borrowed to retire the expensive commerical loan and for budgetary support.

Eurobond is scandal that was invented by desperate CORD and never flew.

The hulaballo about Eurobond is really lots of nonsenses.

Treasury annually borrows same amount of money via our domestic market. It not that suddenly coz we borrowed in Eurobond then we have some "more" 200B. So this extra "new money" should be visible.

Nope. We just have the same money we had planned to borrow. In stead of CMA here in Nairobi, we borrowed from CMA of Ireland.

Every month Treasury borrows BILLIONS of kshs from our banks, insurance companies and name them through Treasury BONDS. I don't see people running around say there is scandal.

[RV Pundit]

Here is the prospectus:
http://www.rich.co.ke/rcfrbs/docs/Republic%20of%20Kenya%20Preliminary%20Prospectus%20-%203%20June%202014.PDF

And here is relevant section:
Use of Proceeds...................

Kenya expects the net cash proceeds of the issue of the Notes to
amount to US$ , which Kenya expects to use for general
budgetary purposes, including for the funding of infrastructure
projects and repayment of a US$600 million loan incurred in 2011/12
that matures in August 2014.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

The latest on the saga.  Supposing the Patrick Njoroge is right and this information cannot be legally disclosed to ODM because it is a third party.  Why can't the ODM demand this evidence from the National Assembly?

And if in fact Njoroge has this information, why can't he just publicize the information, even if he does not agree to meet with Raila?  If the Eurobond was handled correctly, why can't he just say so?

http://www.standardmedia.co.ke/article/2000199004/cbk-governor-njoroge-declines-to-meet-raila-over-eurobond

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

It would appear that a director in State House thinks that publicizing how the Eurobond was handled would undermine the credibility of Kenya's institutions.  Even if he does not explain how, he sees no point in taking such a risk to their credibility to stop Raila's tantrums.

"The country cannot afford to sacrifice the credibility of its institutions just to pacify Raila and stop his tantrums."

http://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2016/04/21/raila-not-interested-in-eurobond-facts-craving-attention-state-house_c1336880?platform=hootsuite

[RV Pundit]

Raila is not interested in any information but to politicize and try to scandalize all sort of folks in this fake scandal. Is Raila now a foresnic investigator to go around examining CBK books.CBK has explained severally that all the money came in. Through a wire transfer to treasury account & via direct purchase by CBK.

If Raila feel aggrieved he can always seek a court order to compell CBK to release this info. He'll need a good reason to do so. There are institutions mandate to do this job..parliament, senate,budget controller, auditor general, eacc and treasury.

The latest on the saga.  Supposing the Patrick Njoroge is right and this information cannot be legally disclosed to ODM because it is a third party.  Why can't the ODM demand this evidence from the National Assembly?

And if in fact Njoroge has this information, why can't he just publicize the information, even if he does not agree to meet with Raila?  If the Eurobond was handled correctly, why can't he just say so?

[Nefertiti]

Raila is a street-smart operative of kingmaker calibre. But he lacks the mould to scale the Rubicon. His strength lies in opponent weakness which makes him perfect for the job. After NYS he has to ensure Jubilee has no means monetary and political to leverage in 2017. Without him we would be sold on Jubilee koolaid of a baloon economy and imaginary prosperity. It is precisely due to Raila's loudmouth that Uhuru has to account for every penny.

On fighting corruption :

Raila A
Uhuru D

[Empedocles]

Raila is a street-smart operative of kingmaker calibre. But he lacks the mould to scale the Rubicon. His strength lies in opponent weakness which makes him perfect for the job. After NYS he has to ensure Jubilee has no means monetary and political to leverage in 2017. Without him we would be sold on Jubilee koolaid of a baloon economy and imaginary prosperity. It is precisely due to Raila's loudmouth that Uhuru has to account for every penny.

On fighting corruption :

Raila A
Uhuru D

Raila is the king of doublespeak.

Asking to meet the CBK governor at his convenience in his offices on the Eurobond after saying this to Rotich who is senior to the governor:

http://www.nation.co.ke/news/politics/Come-brief-me-in-my-office/-/1064/2984070/-/py7ru9/-/index.html

Raila is playing around, really doesn't want to engage. He should also get a D.

Uhuru's D, though I find it very generous, still stands.

[RV Pundit]

Raila is beyond senility. He is as effective as civil society now.

Raila is a street-smart operative of kingmaker calibre. But he lacks the mould to scale the Rubicon. His strength lies in opponent weakness which makes him perfect for the job. After NYS he has to ensure Jubilee has no means monetary and political to leverage in 2017. Without him we would be sold on Jubilee koolaid of a baloon economy and imaginary prosperity. It is precisely due to Raila's loudmouth that Uhuru has to account for every penny.

On fighting corruption :

Raila A
Uhuru D

[Nefertiti]

On fighting corruption :

Raila A
Uhuru D

Raila is the king of doublespeak.

Asking to meet the CBK governor at his convenience in his offices on the Eurobond after saying this to Rotich who is senior to the governor:

He said he was too senior to be invited by the Finance Cabinet Secretary Henry Rotich to his office.

http://www.nation.co.ke/news/politics/Come-brief-me-in-my-office/-/1064/2984070/-/py7ru9/-/index.html

Raila is playing around, really doesn't want to engage. He should also get a D.

Uhuru's D, though I find it very generous, still stands.

That is what I meant -- doublespeak is a hatchet job. The effect of his ramblings is that a penny drop or whiff would be "clear evidence" and vindication of the narrative. You see the likes of Youth Fund's Bruce Odhiambo stepping aside with less fanfare because official corruption is in the spotlight. A

Obviously Cord has no solution offers of its own better than Jubilee's. On top of this stellar anti-corruption performance Kenyans will still need better than "It's our turn" or "Mwizi wa mashamba" manifesto.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Not to downplay Raila and the politics.  Still Patrick Njoroge says the information being sought is privileged.  He also also says his institution has handed over the information that EACC wants.  The implication I gather is that Eurobond, like many others, should now safely belong in the under investigation tray.  Not subject to nosy politicians any longer.  Patrick's letter does not mention the Auditor General.  That the Auditor General, who is said to be also furiously investigating the same, has not yet talked to CBK would appear to be a fact.

The silence from the parliamentary CORD is deafening.  Why haven't they demanded this information from their perches National Assembly?  Do they care?  The Ababu Namwamba's, the Mbadi's, Midiwos...As far as I can tell Raila is a normal civilian.  Why is he the one demanding this information?

I believe Raila is wrong to claim the money was stolen abroad.  I don't think any Kenyan would take such a risk.  They would not if they have been following ICC, Chickengate and the Sam Gichuru saga.  In any case, the documents provided by the treasury seem to support the fact that the money finds its way to Kenya.  And there is hard documentation to prove it.

What is not clear , as I mention in another thread, is how the last portion, the famous 999 gets into the Consolidated Fund; this would seem to be something that Patrick would be in as good a position as anyone to easily confirm or deny with documentation.  He can silence the CORD crew with simple documents that show the money trail.  But he says this is privileged information.  If this is true.  What are the relevant provisions in the law/constitution? 

[RV Pundit]

You don't want CBK or FedBank of US responding to every wild claim out there. Eurobond has been stolen. Money has been printed. Gold has been carted away. Yes CBK has history of scandal...during the Goldenburg....but I believe if Raila was serious...he should have at very least honoured Rotich invite to go to Treasury. The client of CBK here is Treasury. Rotich invited him and the civilian Raila claimed he was a prime minister.. a clear sign of mental delusion and senility...and Rotich should go with his papers there.

I am not sure how far the Freedom of Information Act has gone....but certainly some information held by banks are privelleged. This information related to their client the Treasury.

Raila is trying to invent a scandal to become relevant and has written comical letters from here to the US.

Not to downplay Raila and the politics.  Still Patrick Njoroge says the information being sought is privileged.  He also also says his institution has handed over the information that EACC wants.  The implication I gather is that Eurobond, like many others, should now safely belong in the under investigation tray.  Not subject to nosy politicians any longer.  Patrick's letter does not mention the Auditor General.  That the Auditor General, who is said to be also furiously investigating the same, has not yet talked to CBK would appear to be a fact.

The silence from the parliamentary CORD is deafening.  Why haven't they demanded this information from their perches National Assembly?  Do they care?  The Ababu Namwamba's, the Mbadi's, Midiwos...As far as I can tell Raila is a normal civilian.  Why is he the one demanding this information?

I believe Raila is wrong to claim the money was stolen abroad.  I don't think any Kenyan would take such a risk.  They would not if they have been following ICC, Chickengate and the Sam Gichuru saga.  In any case, the documents provided by the treasury seem to support the fact that the money finds its way to Kenya.  And there is hard documentation to prove it.

What is not clear , as I mention in another thread, is how the last portion, the famous 999 gets into the Consolidated Fund; this would seem to be something that Patrick would be in as good a position as anyone to easily confirm or deny with documentation.  He can silence the CORD crew with simple documents that show the money trail.  But he says this is privileged information.  If this is true.  What are the relevant provisions in the law/constitution? 

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

You don't want CBK or FedBank of US responding to every wild claim out there. Eurobond has been stolen. Money has been printed. Gold has been carted away. Yes CBK has history of scandal...during the Goldenburg....but I believe if Raila was serious...he should have at very least honoured Rotich invite to go to Treasury. The client of CBK here is Treasury. Rotich invited him and the civilian Raila claimed he was a prime minister.. a clear sign of mental delusion and senility...and Rotich should go with his papers there.

I am not sure how far the Freedom of Information Act has gone....but certainly some information held by banks are privelleged. This information related to their client the Treasury.

Raila is trying to invent a scandal to become relevant and has written comical letters from here to the US.

Not to downplay Raila and the politics.  Still Patrick Njoroge says the information being sought is privileged.  He also also says his institution has handed over the information that EACC wants.  The implication I gather is that Eurobond, like many others, should now safely belong in the under investigation tray.  Not subject to nosy politicians any longer.  Patrick's letter does not mention the Auditor General.  That the Auditor General, who is said to be also furiously investigating the same, has not yet talked to CBK would appear to be a fact.

The silence from the parliamentary CORD is deafening.  Why haven't they demanded this information from their perches National Assembly?  Do they care?  The Ababu Namwamba's, the Mbadi's, Midiwos...As far as I can tell Raila is a normal civilian.  Why is he the one demanding this information?

I believe Raila is wrong to claim the money was stolen abroad.  I don't think any Kenyan would take such a risk.  They would not if they have been following ICC, Chickengate and the Sam Gichuru saga.  In any case, the documents provided by the treasury seem to support the fact that the money finds its way to Kenya.  And there is hard documentation to prove it.

What is not clear , as I mention in another thread, is how the last portion, the famous 999 gets into the Consolidated Fund; this would seem to be something that Patrick would be in as good a position as anyone to easily confirm or deny with documentation.  He can silence the CORD crew with simple documents that show the money trail.  But he says this is privileged information.  If this is true.  What are the relevant provisions in the law/constitution? 

While the FED reserve has a leg to stand on if it advanced the privileged information argument, they are not relevant anymore.  Because this information request was made to Patrick Njoroge of CBK.

Rotich whose invite to Raila was declined eventually through the treasury, has shared what he can; the invite and decline is not relevant anymore as far I can tell.  Treasury has shared some documentation that proves that at least a portion of the money was handled correctly, if in a delayed manner.  And there is no similar documentation for the final 999 that has been shared.

Would you consider information proving that public money was handled correctly to be privileged?

[RV Pundit]

That is already taken care of. CBK & Treasury has shared all the information. Adhiambo [Raila relative] the Budget Controller who approves any money that goes out of Consolidated Account has said she saw the money except for some which was paid directly to Syndicated Banks [Law was changed to allow for this..no need bring the money here and then wiring it back]. She saw the money come and she saw the money leave to approved budget lines. EACC have been told to look into it. The Auditor General [another Raila man] will do a postmorteum of this.

What is this fishing expedition suppose to do? Why meet CBK governor? Except to waste time, play politics and possibly scandalize the poor fellow. What information does Raila wants from CBK? Sniff Patrick Njunguna opus dei pants for some scandal.

Would you consider information proving that public money was handled correctly to be privileged?

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

That is already taken care of. CBK & Treasury has shared all the information. Adhiambo [Raila relative] the Budget Controller who approves any money that goes out of Consolidated Account has said she saw the money except for some which was paid directly to Syndicated Banks [Law was changed to allow for this..no need bring the money here and then wiring it back]. She saw the money come and she saw the money leave to approved budget lines. EACC have been told to look into it. The Auditor General [another Raila man] will do a postmorteum of this.

What is this fishing expedition suppose to do? Why meet CBK governor? Except to waste time, play politics and possibly scandalize the poor fellow. What information does Raila wants from CBK? Sniff Patrick Njunguna opus dei pants for some scandal.

Would you consider information proving that public money was handled correctly to be privileged?

The handling of the syndicated loan is not an issue in any major way as far as I can tell.  There might be legal technicalities which one can let slide; I haven't seen anything suspicious otherwise.  Whenever it is brought up it only makes it difficult to talk about the 999 million USD at the heart of the issue; a casual observer would think it's the same thing.  Henry Rotich and Patrick Njoroge are hardly casual observers one would assume.

Generally the treasury has shared documents that prove that the rest of the money was not misused.  Except the 999 million USD.  To be fair I don't know the specifics that Raila demanded from Njoroge.  It's still puzzling why Njoroge would not just release the documentation, even publishing it on a huge billboard saying, here are the details of how Eurobond was handled and let them sue him.

[MOON Ki]

Generally the treasury has shared documents that prove that the rest of the money was not misused.  Except the 999 million USD.  To be fair I don't know the specifics that Raila demanded from Njoroge.  It's still puzzling why Njoroge would not just release the documentation, even publishing it on a huge billboard saying, here are the details of how Eurobond was handled and let them sue him.

I believe that that this is a "Two-Step Monkey Business",  Step 1 in the USA, Step 2 in Kenya?   

Step 2: We await the a-g's report, which is now several months overdue.   (Death threats etc. can, I imagine, slow down one's good writing hand.)   "Government money" getting eaten in Kenya?   That would be some surprise! 

Step 1: So far all we have seen is documentation on purported transfers of the Eurobond money from X to Y.   But, even assuming all the money got transferred to Kenya (or however one puts it), why was large chunk of it apparently just sitting in the USA for something like a couple of months?   To answer that, one actually needs to see all transactions on that account during the relevant months.   Hint: How can you make money on speculations when you actually have no money to wager?

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Generally the treasury has shared documents that prove that the rest of the money was not misused.  Except the 999 million USD.  To be fair I don't know the specifics that Raila demanded from Njoroge.  It's still puzzling why Njoroge would not just release the documentation, even publishing it on a huge billboard saying, here are the details of how Eurobond was handled and let them sue him.

I believe that that this is a "Two-Step Monkey Business",  Step 1 in the USA, Step 2 in Kenya?   

Step 2: We await the a-g's report, which is now several months overdue.   (Death threats etc. can, I imagine, slow down one's good writing hand.)   "Government money" getting eaten in Kenya?   That would be some surprise! 

Step 1: So far all we have seen is documentation on purported transfers of the Eurobond money from X to Y.   But, even assuming all the money got transferred to Kenya (or however one puts it), why was large chunk of it apparently just sitting in the USA for something like a couple of months?   To answer that, one actually needs to see all transactions on that account during the relevant months.   Hint: How can you make money on speculations when you actually have no money to wager?

That chunk did sit for a good while before moving.  If some funny business happened with this money, before being transferred to Kenya, I imagine that would be under US jurisdiction.  While I don't know what the explanation for that delay is, I still wonder if they would risk it.  If the Americans start to investigate, how would the putative crooks stop them?  That is why I think nothing funny happened abroad, even if it was enternained.

[RV Pundit]

So everyone has been threatened? Very rich. If there was an opportunity for Raila to know stuff..then it was now. He has two of his appointee sitting at apex. Adhiambo & Ouko.

Now which money was not moved here. This has been explained severally. I am not suprised treasury & cbk are tired of doing this. Treasury paid syndicated loan from JP Morgan. It also asked JP morgan to wire part  of the money to their account in CBK. The final tranch was directly bought from treasury by CBK and JP morgan transferred the money to CBK's own account in FED Bank US.CBK then credited treasury account with similar Kshs amount. CBK are in this business of buying and selling dollars..so they can stabilize exchange rate...and normal do this with big dollar folks..like KTDA.

No scandal here fellows.

This remind me of ODM making similar claims during Safcom IPO. And Kimunya replied this was not a fish market. Safcom had been sold cheaply at 5sh per share while in actual sense treasury had valued safcom at 180B kshs...which was a real steal then.

Little knowledge is dangerous. And Raila can barely understand all these complicated stuff.

I believe that that this is a "Two-Step Monkey Business",  Step 1 in the USA, Step 2 in Kenya?   

Step 2: We await the a-g's report, which is now several months overdue.   (Death threats etc. can, I imagine, slow down one's good writing hand.)   "Government money" getting eaten in Kenya?   That would be some surprise! 

Step 1: So far all we have seen is documentation on purported transfers of the Eurobond money from X to Y.   But, even assuming all the money got transferred to Kenya (or however one puts it), why was large chunk of it apparently just sitting in the USA for something like a couple of months?   To answer that, one actually needs to see all transactions on that account during the relevant months.   Hint: How can you make money on speculations when you actually have no money to wager?