Endless queues for British compensation lawsuit in Bomet and Kericho.

[RV Pundit]

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Everyone born before 1960 has been queuing to fill in as victims of British Colonial Land grab for weeks now. Yesterday I had to drop somebody by 6pm and the queues were already long. This has been going on I hear for sometime now. This was his third attempt to register. He told me you just pick a tea estate and claim to have been born there before being kicked out.


http://www.the-star.co.ke/news/45000-join-sh2trn-case-against-uk

This was long overdue case.

Will the British pay?

I would urge Prof Chepkwony Kericho governor and initiator of this to go further and Kick the british owned tea companies out of Kericho-Bomet and give shares to everyone who has claimed to be a victim.

[Kadudu]

it will be a big hurdle. I am not so sure if the national govt will support this move.
The same case could be applied to land in Central and Coast regions. Guess who are the persons owning this land today? Your guess is as good as mine. The case is going nowhere and the Kericho governor should just hope he can keep the momentum till 2017 elections after which he will abandon this pet subject.

I would urge Prof Chepkwony Kericho governor and initiator of this to go further and Kick the british owned tea companies out of Kericho-Bomet and give shares to everyone who has claimed to be a victim.

[RV Pundit]

I'm not sure how far the case filled at UK will go..but they've a very good case. Colonial gov forcefully evicted folks unlike say in Maasai land where they signed some fake agreement with lenana. To compound it the forceful eviction of Talai (including children) under Laibon Removal ordinance act of 1930s from kericho all the way to Gwasi Island inhabited by tse tse fly will stink the Brits.

This kind of law which British enacted will be hard to defend.

https://books.google.co.ke/books?id=QltJYZJItzMC&pg=PA870&lpg=PA870&dq=Laibon+Removal+ordinance+act+1934&source=bl&ots=dW5IN-m8QZ&sig=Qcp1UiLICsFslFadLWa0IaRVDhU&hl=en&sa=X&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=Laibon%20Removal%20ordinance%20act%201934&f=false

Of course the British will maintain they transferred all legal responsibilities and liabilities to present kenya gov.

The tea estate only enjoy protection of 99 land lease (many of them have expired and were underhandedly extended) as long as the process of acquiring was not manifestly illegal.

The land is trust land..and county gov are the owners. They don't have to listen to National Gov (NLC) unless the land was forest which falls under NLC.

If Prof and Isaac have cojones..they should just do a zimbwabwe land grab. They already have a thousands of folks who have laid legal claim to that land.

But I'm glad something is being done. In Nandi, the county gov have refused to extend the leases that are expiring and so Nandis will get to own those tea estates.

The British should not be allowed to go scot free after visiting injustices to kalenjin, maasai, gema and coastal people.

The writting is on the wall for British land owners to give up the land now or wait until it is forcefully taken.

it will be a big hurdle. I am not so sure if the national govt will support this move.
The same case could be applied to land in Central and Coast regions. Guess who are the persons owning this land today? Your guess is as good as mine. The case is going nowhere and the Kericho governor should just hope he can keep the momentum till 2017 elections after which he will abandon this pet subject.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

I think the Brits already compensated Kenya, but the Kenyattas, Njonjos, Mois etc took the lions share.  These are the people they should be going after.

[RV Pundit]

When was the compensation. British gave kenyans soft loan to buy back the land. The loan was repaid.

I think the Brits already compensated Kenya, but the Kenyattas, Njonjos, Mois etc took the lions share.  These are the people they should be going after.

[Kadudu]

Who has has the land that was bought with the loan? That is the question we should ask ourselves.

British gave kenyans soft loan to buy back the land. The loan was repaid.

[RV Pundit]

Pretty much everyone who is settled in former white highlands. It was willing seller willing buyer. Some British like delamare choose to hold onto the land and became kenyan citizen. There are few that need to give up the land.

Who has has the land that was bought with the loan? That is the question we should ask ourselves.

[Georgesoros]

Pundit
A very very dangerous move. What about the land akin Kenyattas, Koinanges grabbed and sold after British left? Don't open a can of worms. Status quo is sometime good.

[Georgesoros]

Jericho used to look great, but nowadays it looks like a slum. Kipsigis need to stop breeding like rabbits

[RV Pundit]

Dangerous in what way. The land was forcefully taken. Now that is very dangerous.

Pundit
A very very dangerous move. What about the land akin Kenyattas, Koinanges grabbed and sold after British left? Don't open a can of worms. Status quo is sometime good.

[Kadudu]

You are opening a can of worms which the ruling elite led by Kenyatta family will not want to open. The Ndungu report on land issues is gathering dust in Harambee House and you want to say you do not understand why this is dangerous?
Forget this issue of land as long as the current ruling class has the say in Kenya. Maybe revisit it when Jomo Jnr. is president in 2055.

Dangerous in what way. The land was forcefully taken. Now that is very dangerous.

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

When was the compensation. British gave kenyans soft loan to buy back the land. The loan was repaid.

I think the Brits already compensated Kenya, but the Kenyattas, Njonjos, Mois etc took the lions share.  These are the people they should be going after.

Ok.  That's what I had in mind.  Anyhow, this seems like a very questionable waste of taxpayer funds by the county.  I don't know the legalities behind it, but my hunch is that they get chewed up in court by British govt. Queens Counsel and we just see scarce money down the drain by Kericho.

[RV Pundit]

British choose to settle with MauMau for the same historical cases. It worth a shot.Certainly the people approve of this action going by endless queues that have lasted nearly a month now. My maternal relatives were evicted from those tea estates. I know it hard for folks coming from areas the British didn't consider "empty" or "prize" to understand the kind of injustices the british meted on people...moving them from prized pastures...to small reserves. This didn't happen in places like most of Nyanza and whole of Western kenya. Therefore you cannot relate with what people feel. From my father side, they lived in Manga for like 30 yrs before Mzungu brough tractors in 1940s and evicted them to small reserves in Bomet.

Kipsigis lost lots of land..from Muhoroni in Nyanza now (sugar belt), to whole of now Borabu 10KM belt that rans more than 100Km, to the land around tea estates and the whole of kipkelion-londiani.

The land upon exit of European remained either with British or was sold on willing buyer willing seller to non-kalenjin(Luo or Gusii) or Kikuyus.

And that is genesis of PEV. Not Moi. Not Ruto. Not Biwott.

Solving this or having a closure on this case will prevent more bloodshed in the future.

At least the Talai case is special. Moving the whole community from Kericho town to some island deep in Nyanza infested with tsetsefly where they were sort of under communal arrest. Just because some folks had raped a british woman in Naivasha.

Those people were brought back after 1963 only to find their land stolen..and now are living like squattors around kericho and Kipkelion town.

Ok.  That's what I had in mind.  Anyhow, this seems like a very questionable waste of taxpayer funds by the county.  I don't know the legalities behind it, but my hunch is that they get chewed up in court by British govt. Queens Counsel and we just see scarce money down the drain by Kericho.

[RV Pundit]

Although the likes of Raila and Kapenguria seven claims to be longest political detainees...there is no doubt that Kipchomber Kochichlim arap Koilegen the son of Kipnyolei arap turgat and the brother of Koitatel Samoei who was initially appointed as kipsigis paramount chief and sat in present day Kericho town is one of longest detainee who was imprisoned for nearly 27yrs  in places like Lamu eventually dying in muranga fort hall. Koilegen initially had opposed the Nandi resistance and persuaded kipsigis to welcome the Brits..but after the treacherous killing of his brother Koitalele arap Samoei..he revolted...was quickly imprisoned and send via the new railway to Lamu island.

[patel]

This is good. Gema and those evicted through tribal clashes should do the same take kalenjins to court and seek compensation for lose of lives, livelihood and destruction of property. Someone should start registering Idp starting with early 90s first respondent should be moi

[RV Pundit]

You cannot equate the work of criminal gangs with real gov  like the colonial British.

This is good. Gema and those evicted through tribal clashes should do the same take kalenjins to court and seek compensation for lose of lives, livelihood and destruction of property. Someone should start registering Idp starting with early 90s first respondent should be moi

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

British choose to settle with MauMau for the same historical cases. It worth a shot.Certainly the people approve of this action going by endless queues that have lasted nearly a month now. My maternal relatives were evicted from those tea estates. I know it hard for folks coming from areas the British didn't consider "empty" or "prize" to understand the kind of injustices the british meted on people...moving them from prized pastures...to small reserves. This didn't happen in places like most of Nyanza and whole of Western kenya. Therefore you cannot relate with what people feel. From my father side, they lived in Manga for like 30 yrs before Mzungu brough tractors in 1940s and evicted them to small reserves in Bomet.

Kipsigis lost lots of land..from Muhoroni in Nyanza now (sugar belt), to whole of now Borabu 10KM belt that rans more than 100Km, to the land around tea estates and the whole of kipkelion-londiani.

The land upon exit of European remained either with British or was sold on willing buyer willing seller to non-kalenjin(Luo or Gusii) or Kikuyus.

And that is genesis of PEV. Not Moi. Not Ruto. Not Biwott.

Solving this or having a closure on this case will prevent more bloodshed in the future.

At least the Talai case is special. Moving the whole community from Kericho town to some island deep in Nyanza infested with tsetsefly where they were sort of under communal arrest. Just because some folks had raped a british woman in Naivasha.

Those people were brought back after 1963 only to find their land stolen..and now are living like squattors around kericho and Kipkelion town.

Ok.  That's what I had in mind.  Anyhow, this seems like a very questionable waste of taxpayer funds by the county.  I don't know the legalities behind it, but my hunch is that they get chewed up in court by British govt. Queens Counsel and we just see scarce money down the drain by Kericho.

I am all for justice.  But given this particular effort is probably costing something, without guaranteed returns, I just felt a county like Kericho, most likely dominated by youngsters born in the 80s and 90s, might have more pressing priorities.  But if this is what they want, they should do it.

[RV Pundit]

If UhuRuto and Sang can afford legal counsel, surely the county can afford to pursue this case. I cannot think of a more pressing issue than this. This is way long overdue. Most of the victims are dead or dying.

I am all for justice.  But given this particular effort is probably costing something, without guaranteed returns, I just felt a county like Kericho, most likely dominated by youngsters born in the 80s and 90s, might have more pressing priorities.  But if this is what they want, they should do it.

[MOON Ki]

I am all for justice.  But given this particular effort is probably costing something, without guaranteed returns ...

In the USA, it is not unusual for lawyers to labour on the basis of "contingency fees".   Elsewhere things are a bit more "straightforward": a deposit + "billable hours".   Lawyer + sucker.   

In the former cases, the "target" might decide that it is less costly to pay rather to litigate---a "nuisance fee" that could well be covered by insurance---but do the "clients" always check the "fine print" to see who's getting the best chunk of any settlement?

Apart from that, such cases can be good for some: brownie points for pro bono work and a "reputational bonus" for a win (even without money coming in).   

[MOON Ki]

If UhuRuto and Sang can afford legal counsel, surely the county can afford to pursue this case.

I'm not sure I see the point here.   Uhuru and Ruto did not ask for ICC financial support and specifically noted that they did not need it; doing so would have required them to be forthcoming about their financial affairs.    Sang, on the other hand, did ask, as is his right; and all his legal costs are covered by the ICC.   

The ICC also covers certain costs that are applicable to all three.   For example, even though Uhuru's case is over, his team did get certain Mungiki types into the Witness Protection Program, all of which costs are still being covered by the ICC. 

I cannot think of a more pressing issue than this.

I can easily think of more pressing matters, especially when: (a) people wake up so late after the fact, and it's not exactly some medical condition; (b) the worst cases of land-grabbing etc. have taken place much later; and (c) even if they win, the likelihood of any real money ending up in their pockets is quite remote. 

British choose to settle with MauMau for the same historical cases.

That case started about 15 years ago, with a claim that was around $8 billion.   At settlement, the British agreed to around $30 million, in "full and final compensation".   

Apart from the difference between "billion" and "million", exactly how much has any victim seen?

Should such cases be pursued?

Purely as "a matter of principle", absolutely!   But to the extent that anyone believes that victims will benefit, I have to ask: what is the basis for such belief?