China dismisses US human rights report

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

Kadame: in US defense didn't they attempt to intervene in Somalia in the post-Siad Barre civil war? Before they departed with a bloodied nose.

Ethiopia tried unilateralism in Somalia and left with an ever bigger bleed n their nose than the US. What should've happened in Somalia is a better version of what's happening now. How does America fly over an ocean and continent to fix things half a world away? Regional intervention, supported (not overtaken) by the UN/International System is the only way to go. Even we (+254) have only been mildly successful there because we quickly got our act together and handed things over to the auspices of regional outfits.

Even in our case (PEV), the Americans didn't just take over: they worked with the AU then used their muscle to push things through in the final stage. If things had gone well beyond the PEV (say a full-scale civil war) their intervention still wouldn't have helped without our neighbors running here (as a collective) to help us. We have to move towards structured multilateralism if we mean peace. Hii mambo ya Superman countries is not good for global peace.

True but I meant the US intervened without direct interests to protect. Are they (Americans) as amoral as you wish?

  They were there to prevent relief food from being looted by Aidid and his minions and make sure it reaches the starving masses. 

Their experience in the Mogadishu battle dampened American appetite for interventions in areas with nothing to offer in return and I believe that contributed to their reluctance to intervene in Rwanda.

[Dear Mami]

True but I meant the US intervened without direct interests to protect. Are they (Americans) as amoral as you wish?

As I wish? If you want a convo, rudeness is not how to get it with me, kapish?

I haven't studied American politics around Somalia, and I only have your unsupported declaration  that they had no interests to protect in Somalia when they tried an intervention. I find that a ridiculous assumption on your part, given their long history, but unlike you, I'll actually study the matter before I discuss their motives in this particular case. Heck, even Ethiopia and Kenya had interests motivating them and merely getting a bleeding nose and being unsuccessful in your attempt doesn't make you Mother Teresa.

[Dear Mami]

So, even without deep digging, already I'm finding a bazillion papers detailing Somalia's geostrategic importance to the US for decades. When I have time this weekend, I'll read them. I have no difficulty admitting when I find I'm wrong or ignorant because those are easily cured problems. For example, this case is not even relevant to the debate I was having with Termie, seeing as it was not some unilateral American intervention pretending to be done "for the greater good."

[Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants]

So, even without deep digging, already I'm finding a bazillion papers detailing Somalia's geostrategic importance to the US for decades. When I have time this weekend, I'll read them. I have no difficulty admitting when I find I'm wrong or ignorant because those are easily cured problems. For example, this case is not even relevant to the debate I was having with Termie, seeing as it was not some unilateral American intervention pretending to be done "for the greater good."

It wasn't unilateral.  But they were there to help Somalia at the request of the UN. 

[Dear Mami]

So, even without deep digging, already I'm finding a bazillion papers detailing Somalia's geostrategic importance to the US for decades. When I have time this weekend, I'll read them. I have no difficulty admitting when I find I'm wrong or ignorant because those are easily cured problems. For example, this case is not even relevant to the debate I was having with Termie, seeing as it was not some unilateral American intervention pretending to be done "for the greater good."

It wasn't unilateral.  But they were there to help Somalia at the request of the UN.

That makes it irrelevant to my points (Even though I already see they had serious interests to be involved in Somalia). If this is the definition of morality vs amorality we want to use, we will find China and many others (authoritarian places/ dictatorships/ banana republics like ourselves) similarly doing goodie things under the auspices of legal, structured multilateralism, particularly the UN.

[Georgesoros]

So, even without deep digging, already I'm finding a bazillion papers detailing Somalia's geostrategic importance to the US for decades. When I have time this weekend, I'll read them. I have no difficulty admitting when I find I'm wrong or ignorant because those are easily cured problems. For example, this case is not even relevant to the debate I was having with Termie, seeing as it was not some unilateral American intervention pretending to be done "for the greater good."

It wasn't unilateral.  But they were there to help Somalia at the request of the UN.

That makes it irrelevant to my points (Even though I already see they had serious interests to be involved in Somalia). If this is the definition of morality vs amorality we want to use, we will find China and many others (authoritarian places/ dictatorships/ banana republics like ourselves) similarly doing goodie things under the auspices of legal, structured multilateralism, particularly the UN.

So, is jailing citizens for using Whatsapp moral or what?
these are just basic human rights that am talking about.