Nipate
Forum => Kenya Discussion => Topic started by: RV Pundit on November 19, 2019, 12:32:56 PM
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I couldn't agree more. Uhuru or Mt kenya are in fix without any clear successor. Any attempt to extend Uhuru term is as good as declaring a civil war.
https://www.facebook.com/AmosSaningoRolex/videos/1593899707426595/?t=132
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No need to declare war on Uhuru. He cannot even sell that idea in his background. Who wants another 10 years of Uhuru with his disastrous economic record?
I couldn't agree more. Uhuru or Mt kenya are in fix without any clear successor. Any attempt to extend Uhuru term is as good as declaring a civil war.
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Even if he was an angel - we need term limits as one of our key foundation for democracy - that we need to draw a red-line.
No need to declare war on Uhuru. He cannot even sell that idea in his background. Who wants another 10 years of Uhuru with his disastrous economic record?
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Ngeno is just a loud mouth and a reckless politician. He is smarting after mau eviction. If they could not block mau eviction how will they block Uhuru from becoming PM? Once BBI sail through, referendum ..uhuru PM seat is secure. Please let us complete the journey with Uhuru.
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Which journey? To amargeddon? Let Uhuru have his rest after partying in SH for the last 7 years. He can go and continuing partying in Gatundu but please nowhere near any executive post in Kenya.
Ngeno is just a loud mouth and a reckless politician. He is smarting after mau eviction. If they could not block mau eviction how will they block Uhuru from becoming PM? Once BBI sail through, referendum ..uhuru PM seat is secure. Please let us complete the journey with Uhuru.
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I had rather we vote Abduba Dida in than Uhuru. We cannot allow term limits to be messed up with. That is redline back to dictatorship. Look at Uganda...36yrs later...and Museveni just about got started. Once you allow someone to entrench themselves..it's become harder and harder to remove him....even when he is 95 yr old cabbage like Mugabe.
Which journey? To amargeddon? Let Uhuru have his rest after partying in SH for the last 7 years. He can go and continuing partying in Gatundu but please nowhere near any executive post in Kenya.
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Very correct. Only problem with Abduba Dida is we will have 3 first ladies to fund and in the end of his first tenure they will be 7 in total.
I had rather we vote Abduba Dida in than Uhuru. We cannot allow term limits to be messed up with. That is redline back to dictatorship. Look at Uganda...36yrs later...and Museveni just about got started. Once you allow someone to entrench themselves..it's become harder and harder to remove him....even when he is 95 yr old cabbage like Mugabe.
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Ngeno is just a loud mouth and a reckless politician. He is smarting after mau eviction. If they could not block mau eviction how will they block Uhuru from becoming PM? Once BBI sail through, referendum ..uhuru PM seat is secure. Please let us complete the journey with Uhuru.
.... It is not only "they" (Rv politicians) who want Ouru gone like yesterday, the whole country is unanimous on this.
If that is what BBI is all about then i think every sane person should reject it in totality. Wacha tungoje wailete tuone.
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Pundit - seems you've given up on Uhurutopia and other myths. :)
Anyway patel is right - no stopping BBI - Raila has run a circle around his arch nemesis. Latching onto PEV 2 is desperation - lots of wishful thinking - cause Ruto won't play that losing card. Ng'eno made some noises about Mau and fled to Dubai at the first rumor of trouble. Dude couldn't brave a night with fleas. The Atwolis, Kalonzos and Sonkos have been prepping the ground. And I hear Luo are happy with the arrangement to spite Ruto. The DP can't bring himself to speak freely against Uhuru. He is caged - how do you "fight to the death" when you have the hostages as key allies? Any whiff of PEV 2 and Ruto would be the biggest loser.
Not happening. This scaremongering is going nowhere and parliamentary is the best model. Great samples are all over the planet. Ruto needs to line up his post- BBI coalition. He is more likely to capitulate to avoid losing it all. That's the best play he has. I thought he has more MP's than Uhuru so why is he whining?
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There is difference from when I wear my dispassionate punditry and when I personal express my feelings.
Uhuru has entertained the possibility of extending his term.
And to me personally would be the nuclear option.
Even if Ruto attempted to do the same.
We would part ways.
In any case BBI ikuje tuone - we have waited for far too long.
Pundit - seems you've given up on Uhurutopia and other myths. :)
Anyway patel is right - no stopping BBI - Raila has run a circle around his arch nemesis. Latching onto PEV 2 is desperation - lots of wishful thinking - cause Ruto won't play that losing card. Ng'eno made some noises about Mau and fled to Dubai at the first rumor of trouble. Dude couldn't brave a night with fleas. The Atwolis, Kalonzos and Sonkos have been prepping the ground. And I hear Luo are happy with the arrangement to spite Ruto. The DP can't bring himself to speak freely against Uhuru. He is caged - how do you "fight to the death" when you have the hostages as key allies? Any whiff of PEV 2 and Ruto would be the biggest loser.
Not happening. This scaremongering is going nowhere and parliamentary is the best model. Great samples are all over the planet. Ruto needs to line up his post- BBI coalition. He is more likely to capitulate to avoid losing it all. That's the best play he has. I thought he has more MP's than Uhuru so why is he whining?
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Parliamentary is a competitive and accountable system. You said yourself how lazy Uhuru cannot survive. The Leader of the Majority party or coalition could be anyone - including Raila, Ruto or Kiunjuri. You can scaremonger to thwart BBI but I don't see it working. Noone outside Kalenjin and Kikuyu can tell the difference between Uhuru and Ruto - same old tribal duopoly. Raila is sacrificing to ensure a fairer, more accountable government and that is a solid argument. Ruto needs to do the same.
There is difference from when I wear my dispassionate punditry and when I personal express my feelings.
Uhuru has entertained the possibility of extending his term.
And to me personally would be the nuclear option.
Even if Ruto attempted to do the same.
We would part ways.
In any case BBI ikuje tuone - we have waited for far too long.
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Ruto should coil his tail and join the parliamentary system bandwagon even if it means singing praises of Duale for seeing the light on his behalf. It would be a very good strategy because in a parliamentary system, if he is as strong as Pundit wants us to believe, it can be possible to impeach Uhuru as PM from the benches while praising Jubilee from the other side of his mouth. If you can reach him, help him to stop wagging his tail.
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Ruto should coil his tail and join the parliamentary system bandwagon even if it means singing praises of Duale for seeing the light on his behalf. It would be a very good strategy because in a parliamentary system, if he is as strong as Pundit wants us to believe, it can be possible to impeach Uhuru as PM from the benches while praising Jubilee from the other side of his mouth. If you can reach him, help him to stop wagging his tail.
Ruto's trouble is Raila's willingness to retire as ceremonial president. Ruto did the same in 2012 and cannot pretend to be righteous. He may have to settle for Kiongozi wa Upinzani - hold GoK accountable in the new robust system - and try his luck in future.
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William Ruto would make a fabulous Opposition Leader. He is as hyperactive as Raila in his heyday. Great energy. Articulate. But he is hare-brained, polarizing, corrupt and not a good CEO.
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William Ruto would make a fabulous Opposition Leader. He is as hyperactive as Raila in his heyday. Great energy. Articulate. But he is hare-brained, polarizing, corrupt and not a good CEO.
Greatest asset as op leader is that he would know where the loopholes are. He would also be seeking to settle scores.
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Is it selective amnesia or what, Pundito has no qualms with Ruto doing another ten as president yet he claims that Ruto is Uhuru’s equal so basically co-President,but should Uhuru say return as PM that’s messing term limits?
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Ngeno is just a loud mouth and a reckless politician. He is smarting after mau eviction. If they could not block mau eviction how will they block Uhuru from becoming PM? Once BBI sail through, referendum ..uhuru PM seat is secure. Please let us complete the journey with Uhuru.
I don't agree. But there are some fun facts that the hustler and his people are learning. That is funny.
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Is it selective amnesia or what, Pundito has no qualms with Ruto doing another ten as president yet he claims that Ruto is Uhuru’s equal so basically co-President,but should Uhuru say return as PM that’s messing term limits?
Blinkers are involuntary. :) Moses Kuria can't inherit Gema as he is from Gatundu. But the country is still ripe for more of the tribal duopoly.
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I am with Pundit on this one! Drawing the Red line on Term Limits on anyone. Even if BBI is comprehensive on other issues, they'd better not piggyback "Term Extension" on BBI in any sort or form...M7 Style or Vladimir Style. We know that demon and we must reject it in no uncertain terms. We shouldn't even be having this discussion.
There is difference from when I wear my dispassionate punditry and when I personal express my feelings.
Uhuru has entertained the possibility of extending his term.
And to me personally would be the nuclear option.
Even if Ruto attempted to do the same.
We would part ways.
In any case BBI ikuje tuone - we have waited for far too long.
Pundit - seems you've given up on Uhurutopia and other myths. :)
Anyway patel is right - no stopping BBI - Raila has run a circle around his arch nemesis. Latching onto PEV 2 is desperation - lots of wishful thinking - cause Ruto won't play that losing card. Ng'eno made some noises about Mau and fled to Dubai at the first rumor of trouble. Dude couldn't brave a night with fleas. The Atwolis, Kalonzos and Sonkos have been prepping the ground. And I hear Luo are happy with the arrangement to spite Ruto. The DP can't bring himself to speak freely against Uhuru. He is caged - how do you "fight to the death" when you have the hostages as key allies? Any whiff of PEV 2 and Ruto would be the biggest loser.
Not happening. This scaremongering is going nowhere and parliamentary is the best model. Great samples are all over the planet. Ruto needs to line up his post- BBI coalition. He is more likely to capitulate to avoid losing it all. That's the best play he has. I thought he has more MP's than Uhuru so why is he whining?
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Being "co-president" is not same as being co-president. Uhuru is not eligible for any executive role post 2022. That would violate the spirit of the constitution.
Is it selective amnesia or what, Pundito has no qualms with Ruto doing another ten as president yet he claims that Ruto is Uhuru’s equal so basically co-President,but should Uhuru say return as PM that’s messing term limits?
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Unless you want to limit Exec PM tenure. Which is ok but unconventional. Why Putin? - he is a dictator more like Erdogan - the reverse to what BBI is doing. Angela Merkel is in her 4th term - 20 years. Bibi Netanyahu is on his 8th or something. Parliamentary is about equity and accountability. Every region deserves a shot which the direct vote does not allow. PM gets to be grilled, sued or subpoenaed by courts, fired by simple majority and generally held accountable. No hiding in SH or "symbol of national unity" - as in Uhuru now. If it is difficult or stressful he is welcome to quit. Kenya is not short of talent.
Now - if the PM is not impeachable - then either he is very good or not accountable. Which is the very imperialism BBI means to end. Raila is entertaining Uhuru 2.0 as a price for the BBI reforms. Change is not free. I support him and it would be so stupid to lose Uhuru's support. It is silly to conflate the tree for the forest. Parliamentary will be competitive and this is just another NARC or Jubilee pact. Once we have a better system, it is an open arena that ends the duopoly of power.
I am with Pundit on this one! Drawing the Red line on Term Limits on anyone. Even if BBI is comprehensive on other issues, they'd better not piggyback "Term Extension" on BBI in any sort or form...M7 Style or Vladimir Style. We know that demon and we must reject it in no uncertain terms. We shouldn't even be having this discussion.
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If we limit governors - we need to limit anybody with executive powers. It no brainer. Otherwise we will have prime ministers for life as they entrench themselves. Impeachment is nonsense if a PM has some political skills.
PM = Duale's aka Majority Leader - if we are retaining an elected president. We use to grill ministers and nothing really ever came out of it. Heck we even had Raila as Prime Minister - NOTHING CAME OUT OF IT - and he was in parliament daily & had appointed half the cabinet.
We cannot just become a developed issues -based country like UK with a stroke of a pen. It will take many years for us to nurture our democracy.
Unless you want to limit Exec PM tenure. Which is ok but unconventional. Why Putin? - he is a dictator more like Erdogan - the reverse to what BBI is doing. Angela Merkel is in her 4th term - 20 years. Bibi Netanyahu is on his 8th or something. Parliamentary is about equity and accountability. Every region deserves a shot which the direct vote does not allow. PM gets to be grilled, sued or subpoenaed by courts, fired by simple majority and generally held accountable. No hiding in SH or "symbol of national unity" - as in Uhuru now. If it is difficult or stressful he is welcome to quit. Kenya is not short of talent.
Now - if the PM is not impeachable - then either he is very good or not accountable. Which is the very imperialism BBI means to end. Raila is entertaining Uhuru 2.0 as a price for the BBI reforms. Change is not free. I support him and it would be so stupid to lose Uhuru's support. It is silly to conflate the tree for the forest. Parliamentary will be competitive and this is just another NARC or Jubilee pact. Once we have a better system, it is an open arena that ends the duopoly of power.
I am with Pundit on this one! Drawing the Red line on Term Limits on anyone. Even if BBI is comprehensive on other issues, they'd better not piggyback "Term Extension" on BBI in any sort or form...M7 Style or Vladimir Style. We know that demon and we must reject it in no uncertain terms. We shouldn't even be having this discussion.
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Kenya was parliamentary for a year before Jomo brought the imperial presidency. Presidents Jomo, Moi, Kibaki were less accountable than Uhuru.
We don't want Duale or Russia - we want UK, Germany - proper parliamentary. Ceremonial president is appointed for a fixed term say 10 years. It could even rotate countywise as in Malaysia. The PM loses the glamor and becomes a job. Moi never faced off with Kibaki on the floor or even TV debate. Kibaki never faced Raila. Uhuru answers questions or issues press statements only when he wishes. He is above the law. That needs to end.
There is nothing evolutionary or mature about accountability. Is Kenya too young to be accountable? It's an oxymoron. The equivalent of saying saving and investment is for the rich. Or exercising is for the fit and healthy.
You need parliamentary BECAUSE you are poor, tribal and corrupt.
If we limit governors - we need to limit anybody with executive powers. It no brainer. Otherwise we will have prime ministers for life as they entrench themselves. Impeachment is nonsense if a PM has some political skills.
PM = Duale's aka Majority Leader - if we are retaining an elected president. We use to grill ministers and nothing really ever came out of it. Heck we even had Raila as Prime Minister - NOTHING CAME OUT OF IT - and he was in parliament daily & had appointed half the cabinet.
We cannot just become a developed issues -based country like UK with a stroke of a pen. It will take many years for us to nurture our democracy.
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There is nothing evolutionary or mature about accountability. Is Kenya too young to be accountable? It's an oxymoron. The equivalent of saying saving and investment is for the rich. Or exercising is for the fit and healthy.
You need parliamentary BECAUSE you are poor, tribal and corrupt.
I agree. :D That's a good analogy.
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As long as Kenyatta Uhuru is planning to retire we can debate but let me try to extend his stay at his peril
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Your boy will need to square with Raila in non-Gema. Before taking on Kenyatta where he stands zero chance. I have read that he is capitulating. Smart.
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Karua warns Uhuru
https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/article/2001350320/forget-pm-post-karua-tells-uhuru
“As a good friend I am telling the president to not be tempted to preside over an unconstitutional post. Finish your term and let somebody else take the mantle,” Karua added. At the same time, she hinted at making a comeback to national politics in 2022.
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People pushing Uhuru to stay on are his family and the hangers-on around him. Personally he knows he has nothing to offer Kenyans, but some people are trying to convince him Kenya will cease to exist without him. In fact it is the opposite, Kenya will cease to exist in case he tries to hang on to power. He has no backing from his homeground and cannot depend on old Baba to give him enough support. Baba is a chameleon and can change route in the last minute if he notices that is a mission impossible.
Karua warns Uhuru
https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/article/2001350320/forget-pm-post-karua-tells-uhuru
“As a good friend I am telling the president to not be tempted to preside over an unconstitutional post. Finish your term and let somebody else take the mantle,” Karua added. At the same time, she hinted at making a comeback to national politics in 2022.
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Even now Karua is coming out making noise. She still has a grudge to grind with Uhuru. She believes she should have been the presidential candidate for Mt Kenya in 2013. Most likely she wouls have done a much more better job than the incompetent Uhuru, but her role in the 2007/2008 PEV shows she would not hesitate to become a ethnic warlord.
Don’t be tempted to go for PM post, Karua tells Uhuru
https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/article/2001350320/forget-pm-post-karua-tells-uhuru
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It's Raila propping up Uhuru 2.0 - as the price of reforming the system. Without Uhuru holding onto Gema - Raila will be floored by Ruto. So I see it as an opportunity cost - you get a better system and give Ruto the middle finger.
With the opaque, unaccoutable presidency - there is no difference between Uhuru and Ruto - and you are stuck with the tribal duopoly and electoral disruption. Uhuru 2.0 is a small price to repair the system.
People pushing Uhuru to stay on are his family and the hangers-on around him. Personally he knows he has nothing to offer Kenyans, but some people are trying to convince him Kenya will cease to exist without him. In fact it is the opposite, Kenya will cease to exist in case he tries to hang on to power. He has no backing from his homeground and cannot depend on old Baba to give him enough support. Baba is a chameleon and can change route in the last minute if he notices that is a mission impossible.