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Forum => Kenya Discussion => Topic started by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 05:00:55 PM

Title: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 05:00:55 PM
About 18 days from now and it will dismiss Judiciary as an appendage of the Executive, curse the judges for auctioning  Kenya's future for 30 pieces of cowrie shells
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement
Post by: Kadame6 on August 16, 2017, 05:10:37 PM
Evidence or none, I doubt there is any NASA supporter who believes the court could change the result. I already said to Robina last week I thought going to court was a complete waste of time. This is because I religiously followed the 2013 case and came to that conclusion. NASA may have zero evidence, but even if they had tonnes, the court wouldnt do anything. And who is the idiot that would in a post Msando world? I certainly wouldnt. Just like I used to say I thought the people who gave evidence of PEV were very brave and stupid souls. I wouldnt do that for anything in a country like this. Might as well testify against Al Capone.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement
Post by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 05:12:08 PM
I have never seen how hacking servers would affect a manual process. I take it to be a sensationalist barking; stuffing ballots is so 1960s as opposed to servers,algorithms,programming,hacking...

It's a good thing IEBC denied them access to their servers. Now they can only obtain access under a court order and with at least part of their petition covering the hacking angle. This will give IEBC and Jubilee lawyers an easy time dismantling their wild claims.


Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement
Post by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 05:22:10 PM
Evidence or none, I doubt there is any NASA supporter who believes the court could change the result. I already said to Robina last week I thought going to court was a complete waste of time. This is because I religiously followed the 2013 case and came to that conclusion. NASA may have zero evidence, but even if they had tonnes, the court wouldnt do anything. And who is the idiot that would in a post Msando world? I certainly wouldnt. Just like I used to say I thought the people who gave evidence of PEV were very brave and stupid souls. I wouldnt do that for anything in a country like this. Might as well testify against Al Capone.

I agree with you for different reasons.
The courts have really humiliated Jubilee in the past, the idea that 2013 favored Jubilee under either blackmail of inducement is a belief firmly founded on your political loyalties and nothing else.

It is capital insanity for Jubilee to entertain killing SCOK judges or even letting one dies under their watch. Public spectacle on the case immunizes them from assasination attempts. NASWA threats at this point are as effective on the courts as Jubilee's.

The reason it is futile going to court is because there is ZERO evidence for NASWA claims. If there were irregularities, they are the normal, negligible stuff.

The courts are a face saving exercise as opposed to meekly conceding amidst teargas,deaths,angry speeches and basically ignominy of a thorough thrashing, not to mention the eternal question, 'why couldn't you do this earlier?', 'what took you so long?', 'what has changed since Sunday?'
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement
Post by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 05:30:53 PM
Jubilee is already celebrating :lolz:


They know
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: Kadame6 on August 16, 2017, 06:00:02 PM
Sorry but my judgment of SCOK is based on 2013 and not "my political loyalties". I remember even PUNDIT saying on the second day that he could forsee "injustice" due to the courts reliance on "time". He already forgot, lol, but I remember it.

vooke, I'm fully aware of and transparent with my support of NASA and rejection of Jubilee. That doesnt mean I have lost use of my faculties, so tafadhali dont try to tell me what I believe or why I believe it. Its obvious you have a serious bias against NASA but I dont bring that up as a counter point to things you say, I just stick to what you say and challenge it in its own right so I would appreciate it if you gave me the same courtesy.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 06:05:32 PM
Sorry but my judgment of SCOK is based on 2013 and not "my political loyalties". I remember even PUNDIT saying on the second day that he could forsee "injustice" due to the courts reliance on "time". He already forgot, lol, but I remember it.

vooke, I'm fully aware of and transparent with my support of NASA and rejection of Jubilee. That doesnt mean I have lost use of my faculties, so tafadhali dont try to tell me what I believe or why I believe it. Its obvious you have a serious bias against NASA but I dont bring that up as a counter point to things you say, I just stick to what you say and challenge it in its own right so I would appreciate it if you gave me the same courtesy.
Your faculties notwithstanding, NASWA is headed for an epic loss and all the accompanying whines of less time, uncooperative IEBC,bribed judges, poor choice of lawyers bla de bla.


You can also tuck in your Msando fears somewhere there.

I'm most curious about what evidence they will produce
Server logs have been trashed already
Leaked IEBC extract of results as well

Babu hinted at something Omorlo had previously mentioned;
Ungazetted polling stations.

That's the only fun bit; claims/'evidence'
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: Kadame6 on August 16, 2017, 06:11:23 PM
Yes we all know the outcome: thats the point! Lol! :D

But since youve started the lets burn my own thread strategy, see ya!

Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 06:17:19 PM
Yes we all know the outcome: thats the point! Lol! :D

But since youve started the lets burn my own thread strategy, see ya!


If I was a NAZI, I'd  marry fatalism for your exact same reasons; after the loss, I can still keep my head high and claim I was right all along about stolen victory bla de bla.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: Kim Jong-Un's Pajama Pants on August 16, 2017, 06:25:31 PM
Yes we all know the outcome: thats the point! Lol! :D

But since youve started the lets burn my own thread strategy, see ya!



But vooke somehow feels he deserves a pat on the back for figuring that out.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 06:29:26 PM
Full text.



Quote
‘KENYANS SAY NO TO COMPUTER-GENERATED LEADERS’

My fellow Kenyans,
For the third straight election in a row, the voice of the people has been stilled, and for the third time in a decade, the candidate who lost the election has been declared President.

This year, Kenyans excitedly voted in a peaceful election that even the most democratic nations in the world would have been proud of.
But this democratic promise abruptly evaporated when those who wield power clung to their old, no-holds-barred script of rejecting the people’s democratic will and holding on to their rule by whatever means.

Once the polls closed last Tuesday, the IEBC began streaming so-called provisional presidential results not backed by Form 34As as required by law.
Yesterday, IEBC CEO Ezra Chiloba finally made the stunning admission that the Commission was not able to supply all Form34As yet. This means that both the provisional and final results announced last week are null and void and that Uhuru Kenyatta was not lawfully declared winner.

From the start, the IEBC was illegally releasing unverified results to create the expectation of an Uhuru Kenyatta victory. This was the equivalent of guaranteeing violence if the final verified results indicated Uhuru had lost.

Then there was the bizarre phenomenon of Uhuru Kenyatta’s “lead” staying at around a consistent 11 percent throughout the release of the “results!” surprisingly, this same pattern also occurred in many gubernatorial races across the country.
Such a fixed margin has never been maintained throughout any democratic election anywhere in the world. But it happened here because an algorithm had been introduced to rig the outcome. It happened in full view of all our people and all the election observers.

Then finally, at midnight last Friday, we saw the IEBC announce that Uhuru Kenyatta had been elected president, even though the Commission continued to acknowledge that only about 29,000 of the 41,000 verified Forms 34As had been tallied!

Why was there this fanatical rush to judgment on the most vital matter that any democratic nation EVER faces, the election of its President for the next five years? And why did the IEBC refuse to address the set of questions about vote tallying that that NASA had submitted?

IEBC might have declared Uhuru Kenyatta president, but a vast number of Kenyans have not accepted the legitimacy of the decision, and will not accept it until they have answers to profoundly disturbing questions that have been raised. Indeed, the Carter Centre, in its preliminary findings has questioned this rush and its overall impact on the outcome. The Centre says:

“Although election day voting and counting processes functioned smoothly, the electronic transmission of results from the polling stations to the 290 constituency centers, where official results are tallied, proved unreliable. Unofficial results were also transmitted to the national tally center, where they were posted on its website. Unfortunately, the early display of vote tallies at the national level was not accompanied by the scans of polling station results forms as planned, nor labeled unofficial, leading to some confusion regarding the status of official results.”

No one should believe, and especially not those behind this election fraud, that Kenyans are sheep who will willingly go along with democracy’s slaughter. This country is now divided between those prepared to live under autocracy and the forces of freedom and democracy.

Most Kenyans do not agree that our democracy is a charade, a game, in which people campaign their hearts out for leaders they want, but are then given a winner pre-determined by the darkest forces in our society and beyond.

We also have the no less bizarre situation where some observers grossly violated their mandate and started calling upon NASA to concede – even before the IEBC officially announced the election’s outcome.
We Kenyans will not let such impunity continue any longer. We have the right, and indeed the high responsibility to defend the Constitution and the people’s will. Peaceful assembly is guaranteed by the Constitution, so is civil disobedience. So is the right for labour to strike.

And yet our people are being admonished not to protest an election they are convinced has been stolen. The State unleashed unprecedented violence against perceived NASA supporters in their homes and houses. The police have shot, bludgeoned, and cut short the lives of innocents like infant Baby Samantha Pendo at six months and Stephanie Moraa Nyarang’i a young girl of 9 years using crude weapons and live bullets.

Yet as Kenyans are butchered and their civil liberties trumped upon, they are being told not to protest against a leader they believe is being imposed on them through a computer-generated fraud.
The entire world knows that there were nationwide protests in the US after the last elections. We also know that to date, there are investigations going on by the Justice Department and Congress to establish whether the US elections were hacked by foreign agencies.

Fellow Kenyans,

We refuse to sit and watch the Jubilee turn our country into a banana republic and a playground.
Accepting such a crime for the third election in a row would irredeemably entrench the triumph of anti-democratic impunity and the permanent death of democracy. Future elections would be a sham. NASA shall not be party to it.

The Constitution gives us the incontrovertible right to protest injustice peacefully, and wage a peaceful campaign of civil disobedience. We will preach peace, and we have done so. But we will uphold our rights to assemble and protest. We shall hold vigils, moments of silence, beat drums and do everything else to peacefully draw attention to the gross electoral injustices being meted on our country and demand redress. Kenyans have no need to use violence to achieve justice.

We also emphasize that the struggle here is not just about this moment or this election or this nation. It is about Africa and it is about democracy.

If Kenya, one of Africa’s most vibrant democracies except at election time, can be so easily intimidated to surrender, then what hope is there for the rest of Africa?

It is in this regard that we call upon all African democrats to publicly show solidarity with Kenyans.

Fellow Kenyans,

The merchants of State violence expected NASA to walk Kenyans into death traps. They dispatched merchants of death to carefully selected parts of the country. The people are held now under a hostage siege. The intent is murder and mayhem. Wanton murder, rape and violence are being committed against the people to pacify them against seeking justice. This is why the government is violently demobilizing civil society organizations for daring authoritarianism and seeking justice.

We had said we will not go court. But with the raid on civil society and determination to silence all voices that could seek legal redress like AFRICOG and the Kenya Human Rights Commission, we have now decided to move to the Supreme Court and lay before the world the making of a computer-generated leadership.

By going to court, we are not legitimizing misplaced calls by some observers for us to concede but are seeking to give to those who braved the long lines in the morning chill and hot afternoon on Tuesday August 8th 2017; mothers with their children tied on their backs; the sick, people with disabilities, old and young a chance to be heard.

Furthermore, we act on behalf of those who have been blocked from seeking redress in courts such as the sustained clampdown on the civil society that have attempted to go to court. NASA wants to show the world what transpired in the fraud.

Even as we go to Court, we are cognizant of the fact that ever since Uhru Kenyatta and William Ruto publicly warned the Judiciary, the IEBC has not lost a single case in court. We have decided to move to the Supreme Court despite the history and other recent circumstances. In similar circumstances in 2013, we moved to the Supreme Court to challenge the declaration by IEBC of Uhuru as President-elect. The manner in which the Court handled that petition was a travesty of justice. The Court decided all interim applications in favour of Kenyatta. The Court also allowed the counter petition filed in favour of Kenyatta but disallowed the two petitions against him. Uhuru won 100 per cent and we lost 100 per cent in court.

Our decision to go to court constitutes a second chance for the Supreme Court. The Court can use this chance to redeem itself, or, like in 2013, it can compound the problems we face as a country.
We will show how they shamelessly cooked results from non-existent polling stations and fake un-gazetted Presiding and Returning officers. They gave figures from non-existent Forms 34A and 34B; they scrambled to manufacture such forms; switched vote numbers; and how they openly swindled to reach predetermined consistent vote numbers. They cooked numbers to the extent that vote tallies often surpassed registered voters in polling stations.
Kenya is always much larger than my individual ambition. But Kenya is definitely not too large for all of us to ensure that anyone who wins the people’s votes, and not the loser, is declared President. This is just the beginning. We will not accept and move on.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 06:41:01 PM
So NASWA is going to court because others are not? AFRICOG was and KHRC were raided yesterday...how messianic of NASWA to scramble a petition move in under 24hrs

Quote
We had said we will not go court. But with the raid on civil society and determination to silence all voices that could seek legal redress like AFRICOG and the Kenya Human Rights Commission, we have now decided to move to the Supreme Court and lay before the world the making of a computer-generated leadership.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: Omollo on August 16, 2017, 06:46:41 PM
The Nasa decision has GEMA shitting bricks.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: RV Pundit on August 16, 2017, 07:20:29 PM
Supreme Court Judges are no joke.I mean ask Mutunga what rubbish Cord gave them.NASA better have evidence that can make 9 people overturn the decision of 15m.The threshold is the  highest ever.That is why you have 28 days.No miguna style scatter gun approach.Get one single fact.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: Kadame6 on August 16, 2017, 07:23:45 PM
Supreme Court Judges are no joke.I mean ask Mutunga what rubbish Cord gave them.NASA better have evidence that can make 9 people overturn the decision of 15m.The threshold is the  highest ever.That is why you have 28 days.No miguna style scatter gun approach.Get one single fact.
9? When did they become 9? Thought they were 7? Damn, so many changes I'm unaware of.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: Kichwa on August 16, 2017, 07:34:32 PM
The court must apply the correct evidentiary standard.  I believe the evidentiary standard here is "substantial evidence" and not "beyond reasonable doubt" as you are trying to suggest.  This is also a court of equity and may decide to move beyond the narrow confines of the law if they detect an un injustice that the laws in the books cannot cure. Mutunga court took the easy way out and decided to stick to the "law" even when the outcome was clearly not equitable and that is why we are here today. The maraga court should not kick the can down the road again. They have the power to make history if they rise beyond petty politics.

Supreme Court Judges are no joke.I mean ask Mutunga what rubbish Cord gave them.NASA better have evidence that can make 9 people overturn the decision of 15m.The threshold is the  highest ever.That is why you have 28 days.No miguna style scatter gun approach.Get one single fact.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: RV Pundit on August 16, 2017, 07:42:34 PM
The standard is simple..1.5m vote difference..what material evidence of iebc mess or irregularities can bridge that.Concede already otherwise prepare for another white wash.I wish you guys had other options like war or I don't know..you have one option...concede..concede..that only option from ever reliable friend pundit
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 07:43:29 PM
The court must apply the correct evidentiary standard.  I believe the evidentiary standard here is "substantial evidence" and not "beyond reasonable doubt" as you are trying to suggest.  This is also a court of equity and may decide to move beyond the narrow confines of the law if they detect an un injustice that the laws in the books cannot cure. Mutunga court took the easy way out and decided to stick to the "law" even when the outcome was clearly not equitable and that is why we are here today. The maraga court should not kick the can down the road again. They have the power to make history if they rise beyond petty politics.

Supreme Court Judges are no joke.I mean ask Mutunga what rubbish Cord gave them.NASA better have evidence that can make 9 people overturn the decision of 15m.The threshold is the  highest ever.That is why you have 28 days.No miguna style scatter gun approach.Get one single fact.

Kichwa, you make good points but your binary thinking ruins it all. You are in as many words saying any judgement unfavorable to NASWA is bad for the nation. So it's either NASWA way or the wrong way.

To date, all NASWA claims have proven empty right from KDF, Al Ghurair,server logs to 'leaked results extracts'. I think even for a Babu fanatic you need to pretend to be neutral and qualify your statement by new evidence.

I think Uhuru won fair and square, and parliament if nothing else proves it. But I'm open to compelling evidence and arguments from NASWA against the outcome. Follow the case with a similar mindset.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: Kichwa on August 16, 2017, 09:10:17 PM
Not at all.  We do not even know what NASA's complaint is going to be as of yet.  I can only guess that it is going to be something to do with IEBC not conducting the elections in general or the tallying in particular as stipulated in the constitution.

What I will think of the courts final decision is immaterial because the courts decision will stand regardless of what I think of it.  I think we can agree that the country is divided and Jubilee supporters will applaud the court if it upholds the IEBC ruling and castigate the court if it overturns IEBC ruling. The same will be true for NASA. That's ok.  The court is quit aware of that but they must be completely be above that.

This court, its history, and the way it is constituted is very conservative and more likely to rule to maintain status quo-I get it.  However, I supported taking this case to go to court for several reasons 1) we in NASA have nothing to lose if it goes against us but everything to gain if in the unlikely case we win  2) it gives us a platform, an audience and unprecedented opportunity to not only to rally/consolidate our base but also to show the world what we were talking about when we said the elections was rigged  3) to show that we respect the constitution and the rule of law and to call the bluff of Jubilee and the international community who insisted that we needed to go to court 4) to buy time  to rally the opposition so that we can sustain a vibrant opposition and save this country from being plunged back into the Kenyattaa and Moi Kanu days of de jure and defacto single party state. Too many people suffered, died for this democracy to just watch it slide back to the Kanu days without a fight.

The court must apply the correct evidentiary standard.  I believe the evidentiary standard here is "substantial evidence" and not "beyond reasonable doubt" as you are trying to suggest.  This is also a court of equity and may decide to move beyond the narrow confines of the law if they detect an un injustice that the laws in the books cannot cure. Mutunga court took the easy way out and decided to stick to the "law" even when the outcome was clearly not equitable and that is why we are here today. The maraga court should not kick the can down the road again. They have the power to make history if they rise beyond petty politics.

Supreme Court Judges are no joke.I mean ask Mutunga what rubbish Cord gave them.NASA better have evidence that can make 9 people overturn the decision of 15m.The threshold is the  highest ever.That is why you have 28 days.No miguna style scatter gun approach.Get one single fact.

Kichwa, you make good points but your binary thinking ruins it all. You are in as many words saying any judgement unfavorable to NASWA is bad for the nation. So it's either NASWA way or the wrong way.

To date, all NASWA claims have proven empty right from KDF, Al Ghurair,server logs to 'leaked results extracts'. I think even for a Babu fanatic you need to pretend to be neutral and qualify your statement by new evidence.

I think Uhuru won fair and square, and parliament if nothing else proves it. But I'm open to compelling evidence and arguments from NASWA against the outcome. Follow the case with a similar mindset.
Title: Re: NASWA's Next Major Announcement: Korti Bandia
Post by: vooke on August 16, 2017, 11:39:17 PM
Kichwa,
I don't see how a petition can rally the opposition. Are they divided?

I agree the court is an opportunity to air evidence, but this is a two-edged sword. Should all the evidence be as bogus, Babu's legacy goes up in smokes as the perennial loser

I disagree that going to court shows you respect constitution; fact remains, the decision came after pressure from EVERYWHERE,and after vowing to disregard constitution. Barely days ago on Sunday, Orengo claimed there were other (unspecified and unconstitutional) 'constitutional' means at their disposal.

Again I don't see how it rallies opposition. A crushing defeat is likely to demoralize opposition even harder.

I'm quite glad that unlike IEBC, NASWA has no time to discredit Judiciary. Means even if the ruling is unfavorable, it will be difficult to trash the decision. And if it's difficult to trash the decision, PEV is over.

Is Kenya divided? Yes it is, and it'd have remained divided had Babu won. Uniting Kenya will take both.

My hope and prayers is the absolute majority in parliament will not be stupid.