Nipate

Forum => Kenya Discussion => Topic started by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 04:39:55 AM

Title: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 04:39:55 AM
Internet rumours..oka to join Azimio but kalonzo seen in Karen
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 05:13:35 AM
Had Nzioka talk in Citizen, He is vying for Machakos Governor under Wiper. It seems Kalonzo will go where Uhuru tells him.

Internet rumours..oka to join Azimio but kalonzo seen in Karen
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 07:39:49 AM
Uhuru wasted Nzoika..whom mj mentored in Safaricom..he should go back to Safaricom to head Ethiopia branch..siaya iko na wenyewe
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 08:48:16 AM
Siasa iko na wenyewe and Nzioka has been at the center of Handshake and Shoving Ruto out of power. So speaking he managed to contain Ruto and Raila by pitting them against each other while Uhuru ruled and looted stress free.
I would say he is good in Boardroom politics which ia essentially a trait required for Governor. Something which we have seen with Kamba Governors Mutua and Kibwana. Many thought Both wouldnt survive a year in politics 10 years later some are still asking how did they survive?

Uhuru wasted Nzoika..whom mj mentored in Safaricom..he should go back to Safaricom to head Ethiopia branch..siaya iko na wenyewe
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 08:54:53 AM
Nzioka manage to contain Ruto :) - you're kidding right.
He is spanner boy - Uhuru is the maestro.
Kalonzo is weak leader that is why Mutua, Ngilu and Kivutha can taunt him

Nzioka is technocrat - who cannot thrive in politics - politics requiring dealing mps, mcas, and dirty wananichi. This political role that Uhuru has given to Raila - because he cannot hack it - neither can any of his st mary boys.

Uhuru is an epic political failure - now almost hated by everyone in mt kenya despite doing lots of work - and his project Raila is drinking water - and next few months - these Nziokas will be running to exile if not dealing with court cases.

Uhuru himself is in serious trouble in six months time unless Raila does the improbable and wins.

Because Ruto will crush him and the Mois in six months - politics is cut throat - dont expect if Uhuru loses that Kenyatta empire will survive - nobody will spare him - KRA dogs will be send to crush them - gov contracts frozen - regulators will not turn a blind eye - they will be forced to sell their business for cheap.

Kenyatta and Moi empires have survived by being in gov or friendly gov - but the prospect of new broom of Ruto and his hungry young new elites descending on their empire is nigh - their empires will be easiest to loot for the new boys.

Siasa iko na wenyewe and Nzioka has been at the center of Handshake and Shoving Ruto out of power. So speaking he managed to contain Ruto and Raila by pitting them against each other while Uhuru ruled and looted stress free.
I would say he is good in Boardroom politics which ia essentially a trait required for Governor. Something which we have seen with Kamba Governors Mutua and Kibwana. Many thought Both wouldnt survive a year in politics 10 years later some are still asking how did they survive?
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 09:20:21 AM
Look like Kalonzo not happy - wants to be given ticket of Azimio or he joins Ruto. Uhuru has a big problem. After Uhuru dismiss his MOU NASA issues and told him the focus is on greater enemy Ruto - Kalonzo drove to Karen to see Ruto.

Now it's appear mission aborted for now. Kalonzo has to prayed for this and will play his cards well if he is not an idiot.

1) Best move - Demand to be Azimio ticket holder - Raila has to step aside - for MOUs and being unsellable in GEMA.
2) 2nd best move - Demand DPORK from either camps.
3) 3rd best move - Demand for 1/3 of gov from either camps.

Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 09:25:21 AM
Im a Ruto supporter and its a fact . Ruto was contained in the second Term. He was too powerful in first term dare I say running the government single handedly . In second term he found himself in the cold together with his supporters me included. In parliament Senate and CoG Ruto was defeated in all aspects , so defeated were we that our only saviour became the Courts. This Uhuru did by copying Mois poltical book from 1999 to 2002 .
Luckily for Ruto he had and has the people . As confirmed by Mois last era you can always win with politicians for a while . People will always prevail. Just as People prevailed in 2002 election Ruto and people  will prevail in 2022 elections. All Uhuru victories werw pryrric victories.
Now with Raila this guy was a thorn in flesh im Kibakis and Mois rule.Uhuru managed to contain him and also curtailed last minute suprise from him (Moi knows what happened to him). Not only was he contained but also finished politically. In as much as I think Uhuru has been the worst Kenyan leader in his second term, I do give him for doing a childs play out of Raila who people thought was an "enigma".


Nzioka manage to contain Ruto :) - you're kidding right.
He is spanner boy - Uhuru is the maestro.
Kalonzo is weak leader that is why Mutua, Ngilu and Kivutha can taunt him

Nzioka is technocrat - who cannot thrive in politics - politics requiring dealing mps, mcas, and dirty wananichi. This political role that Uhuru has given to Raila - because he cannot hack it - neither can any of his st mary boys.

Uhuru is an epic political failure - now almost hated by everyone in mt kenya despite doing lots of work - and his project Raila is drinking water - and next few months - these Nziokas will be running to exile if not dealing with court cases.

Uhuru himself is in serious trouble in six months time unless Raila does the improbable and wins.

Because Ruto will crush him and the Mois in six months - politics is cut throat - dont expect if Uhuru loses that Kenyatta empire will survive - nobody will spare him - KRA dogs will be send to crush them - gov contracts frozen - regulators will not turn a blind eye - they will be forced to sell their business for cheap.

Kenyatta and Moi empires have survived by being in gov or friendly gov - but the prospect of new broom of Ruto and his hungry young new elites descending on their empire is nigh - their empires will be easiest to loot for the new boys.

Siasa iko na wenyewe and Nzioka has been at the center of Handshake and Shoving Ruto out of power. So speaking he managed to contain Ruto and Raila by pitting them against each other while Uhuru ruled and looted stress free.
I would say he is good in Boardroom politics which ia essentially a trait required for Governor. Something which we have seen with Kamba Governors Mutua and Kibwana. Many thought Both wouldnt survive a year in politics 10 years later some are still asking how did they survive?
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 09:34:40 AM
Ruto survived Uhuru purge and became even more popular - and has taken his mt kenya stronghold.
Uhuru as we speak has a shell of Jubilee - left with 15 mps (reducing daily) - out of 170Mps in Jubilee - if not 200!
That is an epic failure - and his 2022 project is stillborn
What Ruto lost is basically the eating opportunities in this term. Nothing more.
When it come to Raila - I think Uhuru has pushed himself into a corner - where he has to back Raila or Ruto.
Both will be keen to finish him as their 1st political assingment.
That is not being smart - that is being stupid.
If Uhuru was politically smart - he would have long identified someone who'd be friendly to Kenyatta and MOi empires.
But when you force yourself into a corner - where you have to chose two bad options (for you) - then you're not smart.
In short Uhuru is now in great panic despite being PORK and in charge of gov machinery - and his family money.
Neophyes like Nzioka and Njees have made him look like a fool.
But for you - they have been geniuses :) :) - for just moving Ruto cheese in the dinner table.
To be a genius - they needed to finish Ruto or weaken him severely - not strengthen him.
They had to cut his throat or at least his legs - not just deny him cheese.
Political genius is someone like Daniel Moi - steal for 24yrs and get away with it.
Uhuru and his boys - if Raila or Ruto wins - will be eating raw beans.
If Raila get the swords - the 1st person he will knife is Uhuru - followed by Gideon.
They will be of no use - with zero Mps. Raila will negotiate with Ruto so he can eat in peace.
That is why they are panicking and entering politics - :)  - Nziokas & Ngatias & Natembeyas now boiling in political heat.
Matiangi has resigned himself to fate - and so have kibichos & others.
The EACC files on them are going to dusted - and Matiangi will be busy in courts - and the same for the rest.
Im a Ruto supporter and its a fact . Ruto was contained in the second Term. He was too powerful in first term dare I say running the government single handedly . In second term he found himself in the cold together with his supporters me included. In parliament Senate and CoG Ruto was defeated in all aspects , so defeated were we that our only saviour became the Courts. This Uhuru did by copying Mois poltical book from 1999 to 2002 .
Luckily for Ruto he had and has the people . As confirmed by Mois last era you can always win with politicians for a while . People will always prevail. Just as People prevailed in 2002 election Ruto and people  will prevail in 2022 elections. All Uhuru victories werw pryrric victories.
Now with Raila this guy was a thorn in flesh im Kibakis and Mois rule.Uhuru managed to contain him and also curtailed last minute suprise from him (Moi knows what happened to him). Not only was he contained but also finished politically. In as much as I think Uhuru has been the worst Kenyan leader in his second term, I do give him for doing a childs play out of Raila who people thought was an "enigma".
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 11:02:25 AM
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 11:09:34 AM
For Uhuru to eat massively he had to edge out Ruto and  make Raila shut up. He achived that .This was his short term strategy. Long term we are keenly watching . I opine that he is now negotiating with Ruto and take this to the bank .Uhuru will not be touched by neither Ruto nor Raila. The Nziokas, Njees, Matiangi Kibicho etc are in hot soup once Ruto takes Presidency. As you can see Nzioka is already raising the white flag and had nothing but praises and good words for Ruto yesterday.
You seem to forget Uhuru is not competing in 2022 elections. All he needs to do is like Mudavadi and Wetangula call Ruto and do a deal. Then he is safe. Also it would be foolish Ruto going against Uhuru after becomimg President Kiraitu and Raila tried that with Moi and thw realised its not tennable. Ruto will try as much as poasible to appease Mt Kenya a small mistake will make his re-election in 2027 very difficult.
Then again you are not Ruto .In politics you take some losses for future wins, Jommo did that, Moi did that, Kibaki did that, Uhuru did that and Ruto did that in his second term.
I now see why you have never accepted Raila lost in 2007. If he wouls have gracefully accepted 2007 loss he would have become President in 2013 but like you kifua tu. You and Raila arw cut from thw same cloth.



Ruto survived Uhuru purge and became even more popular - and has taken his mt kenya stronghold.
Uhuru as we speak has a shell of Jubilee - left with 15 mps (reducing daily) - out of 170Mps in Jubilee - if not 200!
That is an epic failure - and his 2022 project is stillborn
What Ruto lost is basically the eating opportunities in this term. Nothing more.
When it come to Raila - I think Uhuru has pushed himself into a corner - where he has to back Raila or Ruto.
Both will be keen to finish him as their 1st political assingment.
That is not being smart - that is being stupid.
If Uhuru was politically smart - he would have long identified someone who'd be friendly to Kenyatta and MOi empires.
But when you force yourself into a corner - where you have to chose two bad options (for you) - then you're not smart.
In short Uhuru is now in great panic despite being PORK and in charge of gov machinery - and his family money.
Neophyes like Nzioka and Njees have made him look like a fool.
But for you - they have been geniuses :) :) - for just moving Ruto cheese in the dinner table.
To be a genius - they needed to finish Ruto or weaken him severely - not strengthen him.
They had to cut his throat or at least his legs - not just deny him cheese.
Political genius is someone like Daniel Moi - steal for 24yrs and get away with it.
Uhuru and his boys - if Raila or Ruto wins - will be eating raw beans.
If Raila get the swords - the 1st person he will knife is Uhuru - followed by Gideon.
They will be of no use - with zero Mps. Raila will negotiate with Ruto so he can eat in peace.
That is why they are panicking and entering politics - :)  - Nziokas & Ngatias & Natembeyas now boiling in political heat.
Matiangi has resigned himself to fate - and so have kibichos & others.
The EACC files on them are going to dusted - and Matiangi will be busy in courts - and the same for the rest.
Im a Ruto supporter and its a fact . Ruto was contained in the second Term. He was too powerful in first term dare I say running the government single handedly . In second term he found himself in the cold together with his supporters me included. In parliament Senate and CoG Ruto was defeated in all aspects , so defeated were we that our only saviour became the Courts. This Uhuru did by copying Mois poltical book from 1999 to 2002 .
Luckily for Ruto he had and has the people . As confirmed by Mois last era you can always win with politicians for a while . People will always prevail. Just as People prevailed in 2002 election Ruto and people  will prevail in 2022 elections. All Uhuru victories werw pryrric victories.
Now with Raila this guy was a thorn in flesh im Kibakis and Mois rule.Uhuru managed to contain him and also curtailed last minute suprise from him (Moi knows what happened to him). Not only was he contained but also finished politically. In as much as I think Uhuru has been the worst Kenyan leader in his second term, I do give him for doing a childs play out of Raila who people thought was an "enigma".
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 11:17:02 AM
I dont see how either Raila or Ruto will spare the Kenyattas and Mois - it's not about touching them - but their enormous wealth and control is going to be a big target. This is especially true now that kenya gov is broke.
Let me give you an example.
Timsales - Kenyatta will lose the forest license. Moi's will lose Raiply - unless the Rais run with billions.
 
Fuliza & digital loans that key planks of NCBA will be regulated and the interest of 300 percent (annually) crushed to 15 percent.

KQ will be killed...next gov will not waste another 25B on KQ when they have nothing to lose...Kenyattas will get 7B kshs hit...now it's probably 20B with interest sitting somewhere in NCBA balance sheets.

Brookside will be declared a monopoly by regulatory body and small dairies promoted...if not Ruto will allow Museveni milk to flood the market.

Ruto and Raila will force Kenyattas to sell their land to them or it's acquired complusory - this hot potatos.

The mois the same. Any future favours or deals forget about it.

They will either pay up or be crushed.

I dont see how Raila or Ruto can forgive or even allow kenyattas and Moi to thrive - they will crush them.

Within a year - it possible for Kenyatta to lose 20B - and Moi's 20B -

For Uhuru to eat massively he had to edge out Ruto and  make Raila shut up. He achived that .This was his short term strategy. Long term we are keenly watching . I opine that he is now negotiating with Ruto and take this to the bank .Uhuru will not be touched by neither Ruto nor Raila. The Nziokas, Njees, Matiangi Kibicho etc are in hot soup once Ruto takes Presidency. As you can see Nzioka is already raising the white flag and had nothing but praises and good words for Ruto yesterday.
You seem to forget Uhuru is not competing in 2022 elections. All he needs to do is like Mudavadi and Wetangula call Ruto and do a deal. Then he is safe. Also it would be foolish Ruto going against Uhuru after becomimg President Kiraitu and Raila tried that with Moi and thw realised its not tennable. Ruto will try as much as poasible to appease Mt Kenya a small mistake will make his re-election in 2027 very difficult.
Then again you are not Ruto .In politics you take some losses for future wins, Jommo did that, Moi did that, Kibaki did that, Uhuru did that and Ruto did that in his second term.
I now see why you have never accepted Raila lost in 2007. If he wouls have gracefully accepted 2007 loss he would have become President in 2013 but like you kifua tu. You and Raila arw cut from thw same cloth.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 11:54:36 AM
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 11:55:52 AM
Siasa iko na wenyewe and Nzioka has been at the center of Handshake and Shoving Ruto out of power. So speaking he managed to contain Ruto and Raila by pitting them against each other while Uhuru ruled and looted stress free.
I would say he is good in Boardroom politics which ia essentially a trait required for Governor. Something which we have seen with Kamba Governors Mutua and Kibwana. Many thought Both wouldnt survive a year in politics 10 years later some are still asking how did they survive?

Uhuru wasted Nzoika..whom mj mentored in Safaricom..he should go back to Safaricom to head Ethiopia branch..siaya iko na wenyewe
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 12:03:05 PM
That was fake Wanjigi account -
https://twitter.com/JimiWanjigi
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Dear Mami on February 02, 2022, 12:27:47 PM
I dont see how either Raila or Ruto will spare the Kenyattas and Mois - it's not about touching them - but their enormous wealth and control is going to be a big target. This is especially true now that kenya gov is broke.
Let me give you an example.
Timsales - Kenyatta will lose the forest license. Moi's will lose Raiply - unless the Rais run with billions.
 
Fuliza & digital loans that key planks of NCBA will be regulated and the interest of 300 percent (annually) crushed to 15 percent.

KQ will be killed...next gov will not waste another 25B on KQ when they have nothing to lose...Kenyattas will get 7B kshs hit...now it's probably 20B with interest sitting somewhere in NCBA balance sheets.

Brookside will be declared a monopoly by regulatory body and small dairies promoted...if not Ruto will allow Museveni milk to flood the market.

Ruto and Raila will force Kenyattas to sell their land to them or it's acquired complusory - this hot potatos.

The mois the same. Any future favours or deals forget about it.

They will either pay up or be crushed.

I dont see how Raila or Ruto can forgive or even allow kenyattas and Moi to thrive - they will crush them.

Within a year - it possible for Kenyatta to lose 20B - and Moi's 20B -

If they do this, even if it's Ruto, I will support him. I will support anybody who starts the culture of returning back the loot to the country!

I don't care for jailing anybody. I don't think it's good for nation-building even if it may feel good to punish people who've wronged the country, that's temporary only. You would want the whole country behind you in recovering loot, not for it to be used to divide and create tensions. So, no jail terms. But kurudisha mali na shamba na pesa??? I'm with them allll the way, because even them (the new President)...one day they will be out of govt and if they've hidden their own loot, it'll be returned by the next president wjo will want the legacy points to keep up with the predecessor.

The important thing is to start the culture! When the Coalition govt started the infrustructure thing, the next govt wanted to outdo them for legacy points. This is why Maraga's move to nullify the election was also so incredibly important! Now people like Pundit who were insulting them here have been reaping the benefits of a bold and independent judiciary, and all they needed was a BOLD first example to start the ball rolling. So if the next president starts this loot-recovery ball rolling, I'm going to be behind then 10,000%. Political will is everything.

President Kiraitu and Raila tried that with Moi and thw realised its not tennable. . . . You and Raila arw cut from thw same cloth.

Wewe Nowayhaha, try to be objective. It was Raila who stopped the NARC govt in 2003 from going after Moi, with kina Moody Awori saying its ok for the Bosire commission to summon him for questioning. Raila was still powerful and influential in the coalition, and he said, "Leave mzee alone, ameshatoka kwa kiti." Try to be fair sometimes. Ata afadhali Pundit, you are 100% one-sided.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 12:35:57 PM
Look like the usual motions - I guess Kalonzo hesitant to commit to Raila
https://www.the-star.co.ke/news/2022-02-02-kalonzo-gideon-to-breath-life-in-oka-through-new-deal/
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Dear Mami on February 02, 2022, 12:42:04 PM
But, even though it would be great if the next president recovered loot, the reality is they won't! It's in their personal interest not to start a culture of going after the last president because it may come back to haunt them. So it won't ever happen. This is why when Democrats were salivating over the prospects of Trump getting federally tried, I knew it'd be a waste of time. Someway, somehow, Biden was always going to find a way of preventing it. It's selfish human interests.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 12:52:19 PM
Kibaki is the one who stopped Moi attack. Raila had promised before elections to jail Moi , after elections NARC Ministers including Raila, Anyang Nyongo ,Murungaru and Kiraitu were baying for Mois blood and had even made it an agenda in Cabinets meeting only for Kibaki to refuse to Okei it. They then requested instead to go after Biwott, Kulei etc and Kibaki told them thats as well going after Moi.
The RV you praising has his theory that it was because of Boinett who had cut a deal with U.S.
Truth of the matter Moi and Kibaki were political rivals but vwry good friends . Kibaki was a post Independence Tycoon these people Moi let them accumulate wealth during his reign.
The reality was seen in 2007 elections when Moi supported Kibaki against Raila and was instrumental in asking Kibaki not to give in as  he had won 2007 elections outrightly.
In 2010 Raila was still on Mois neck attacking him and threatening him even going ahead and trying to reclaim tea factories he had only for Uhuru and Ruto to thwart that.
These are facts Kamami Raila is one person you can never trust. Even with coalition agreements  show me one he has stuck with ans I will show you the 11th Planet.

Quote

Wewe Nowayhaha, try to be objective. It was Raila who stopped the NARC govt in 2003 from going after Moi, with kina Moody Awori saying its ok for the Bosire commission to summon him for questioning. Raila was still powerful and influential in the coalition, and he said, "Leave mzee alone, ameshatoka kwa kiti." Try to be fair sometimes. Ata afadhali Pundit, you are 100% one-sided.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 01:11:22 PM
OKA
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Dear Mami on February 02, 2022, 01:12:26 PM
Kibaki is the one who stopped Moi attack. Raila had promised before elections to jail Moi , after elections NARC Ministers including Raila, Anyang Nyongo ,Murungaru and Kiraitu were baying for Mois blood and had even made it an agenda in Cabinets meeting only for Kibaki to refuse to Okei it. They then requested instead to go after Biwott, Kulei etc and Kibaki told them thats as well going after Moi.
The RV you praising has his theory that it was because of Boinett who had cut a deal with U.S.
Truth of the matter Moi and Kibaki were political rivals but vwry good friends . Kibaki was a post Independence Tycoon these people Moi let them accumulate wealth during his reign.
The reality was seen in 2007 elections when Moi supported Kibaki against Raila and was instrumental in asking Kibaki not to give in as  he had won 2007 elections outrightly.
In 2010 Raila was still on Mois neck attacking him and threatening him even going ahead and trying to reclaim tea factories he had only for Uhuru and Ruto to thwart that.
These are facts Kamami Raila is one person you can never trust. Even with coalition agreements  show me one he has stuck with ans I will show you the 11th Planet.
I'm not 'praising RV,' . . . the man was here yesterday insulting me like a village drunk over a non-issue  :D I'm just saying when it comes to RAO, you are 100% biased. I remember RAO on TV myself telling journalists to leave the mzee alone, he had already left office and there was no point in going after him. It was Moody Awori who was justifying the Goldenberg Commission summons, saying "He'll just be questioned, it's not a big thing like people are making it out to be." So, no. Either your memory is not very good or you are just totally biased when it comes to recalling Raila's history.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 01:14:57 PM
Read this recent interview from Kiraitu. Both of you are NAIVE
1) You think there is some BRO CODE that say dont touch me; so I wont touch you; WRONG Politics is CUT THROAT
2) You only insulate yourself by cleaning your acts - but definitely your business will go down.
3) New politicians and their large entourage are coming in like hungry packs of wolves - and they are not going to spare anything & anybody until they are full - then they can relax.

Politics is cut throat - you can only get away like Moi - because YOU CAN. It's not because Kibaki was nice. It because he signed an MOU with Moi overseen by Boinnet & CIA - he got a jail free card long before he handed over - Only Kibaki & Moi knew the deal otherwise Moi had been prepared to hand over to Military - and Kalenjin elite had long declared Moi was a no go zone and if they had attempted to touch MOi - a war would have erupted.


READ BELOW - and I hope you know how to read btw the lines to get the subliminal message.

https://nation.africa/kenya/news/politics/kiraitu-murungi-how-mwai-kibaki-stopped-us-from-arresting-moi-3649836

Did you, alongside other ministers in the Kibaki government, plan to arrest Moi after his retirement in 2007? It is said that it took President Kibaki’s personal intervention to stop that.

I was the minister for Justice and Constitutional Affairs at the time. I had come from civil society where there was a lot of debate on how Moi had committed a lot of crimes and ought to be arrested. Some of the charges had already been drafted. That pressure to arrest Moi was immense, especially from civil societies.

At the time Joseph Boinnet was the head of intelligence and he was getting all this information, but Kibaki did not want us to fight Moi. The house Moi used to occupy at Kabarnet Gardens was meant for the Vice-President and there was pressure for us to evict him so that Kijana Wamalwa, the new VP, could occupy it.

We went to consult Kibaki about the eviction with Amos Kimunya, who was the minister for Lands at the time, but Kibaki told Kimunya to process a title deed for the property in Moi’s name and hand it over to the retired president, which he did.

Later on I made a statement that Mzee Moi should retire and go back home in Kabarak, where he should spend his days watching TV to see how good governments are run. This was around the time when it had been decided that no action would be taken against Moi, and I was sending the message that we would not be taking any action again him. But Kanu stalwarts accused me of abusing Moi.


Kibaki is the one who stopped Moi attack. Raila had promised before elections to jail Moi , after elections NARC Ministers including Raila, Anyang Nyongo ,Murungaru and Kiraitu were baying for Mois blood and had even made it an agenda in Cabinets meeting only for Kibaki to refuse to Okei it. They then requested instead to go after Biwott, Kulei etc and Kibaki told them thats as well going after Moi.
The RV you praising has his theory that it was because of Boinett who had cut a deal with U.S.
Truth of the matter Moi and Kibaki were political rivals but vwry good friends . Kibaki was a post Independence Tycoon these people Moi let them accumulate wealth during his reign.
The reality was seen in 2007 elections when Moi supported Kibaki against Raila and was instrumental in asking Kibaki not to give in as  he had won 2007 elections outrightly.
In 2010 Raila was still on Mois neck attacking him and threatening him even going ahead and trying to reclaim tea factories he had only for Uhuru and Ruto to thwart that.
These are facts Kamami Raila is one person you can never trust. Even with coalition agreements  show me one he has stuck with ans I will show you the 11th Planet.

Quote

Wewe Nowayhaha, try to be objective. It was Raila who stopped the NARC govt in 2003 from going after Moi, with kina Moody Awori saying its ok for the Bosire commission to summon him for questioning. Raila was still powerful and influential in the coalition, and he said, "Leave mzee alone, ameshatoka kwa kiti." Try to be fair sometimes. Ata afadhali Pundit, you are 100% one-sided.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 01:24:09 PM
I remember Rift Valley declaration when Moi was summoned to appear for Goldenburg and he refused - saying the lawyers were enough.

Sirma and WSR were leading it - They declared that RV would secede if Moi was touched. - Moi was not be summoned or questioned or asked anything - but respected as elder stateman. THIS WAS THE MOU KIBAKI SIGNED WITH MOI AND AMERICANS.

Remember at that point Kalenjin controlled the military and the police - and Ethiopia civil war would have erupted - but Kibaki listened to Boinnet and told the overzealous ministers to back off.

Raila -> I remember talked about Moi - when things have started going south and was courting KANU for partnership - maybe 2005?


Nairobi — A group of Kanu MPs from the Rift Valley yesterday threatened to agitate for Majimbo (a regional government system) "if the Narc Government continues to persecute the Kalenjin community."

They could even declare Rift Valley a state on its own
https://allafrica.com/stories/200302240117.html
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 01:33:41 PM
If I recall correctly - Biwott and his "hand over to the army" guys had approached Gen Sumbeiywo to take over power. Gen Sumbeiywo had been instrumental in South Sudan and had some political experience - flatly refused. Sumbeiyo had been promoted to Chief of Staff - thankfully Moi was wise and Sumbeiywo knew better than be part of the plot - and Brig Boinnet got Kibaki and the Americans to deal with Kalenjin elite anxieties. All of them had bought houses abroad in readiness to flee if things went south.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 01:46:27 PM
Look like they are likely to join up with Raila

Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Pajero on February 02, 2022, 02:43:01 PM
You will never win any argument with Pundito especially where Raila is involved.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 02:54:32 PM
Facts are stubborn. Not me.
You will never win any argument with Pundito especially where Raila is involved.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Pajero on February 02, 2022, 03:36:31 PM
Selective application of facts,you don't remember Railas speech in parliament saying the house will remain with Moi amidst applause by Kalenjin mps.Be fair sometimes and give credit where it's due.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 03:44:01 PM
I think we disagree on the timing. I dont think it was early in 2003 - but later when relationship with Mt Kenya went south.

I remember Raila after Kibaki betrayed him warming up to KANU - that eventually led to merge of LDP and KANU - into ODM.

I also remember Raila targeting Moi land in Mau forest in 2008


I see it was in July

25 JULY 2003
The East African Standard (Nairobi)
By Andrew Teyie
Nairobi — The Government will not evict former President Moi from his Kibera house, which used to be the official Vice-President's residence.

Subsequently, the Government will construct a house to accommodate, the current and future Vice-Presidents, Roads, Public Works and Housing Minister Raila Odinga told Parliament yesterday.



Selective application of facts,you don't remember Railas speech in parliament saying the house will remain with Moi amidst applause by Kalenjin mps.Be fair sometimes and give credit where it's due.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 04:54:49 PM

This is after Kibaki told the Ministers that Moi was untouchable.

I think we disagree on the timing. I dont think it was early in 2003 - but later when relationship with Mt Kenya went south.

I remember Raila after Kibaki betrayed him warming up to KANU - that eventually led to merge of LDP and KANU - into ODM.

I also remember Raila targeting Moi land in Mau forest in 2008


I see it was in July

25 JULY 2003
The East African Standard (Nairobi)
By Andrew Teyie
Nairobi — The Government will not evict former President Moi from his Kibera house, which used to be the official Vice-President's residence.

Subsequently, the Government will construct a house to accommodate, the current and future Vice-Presidents, Roads, Public Works and Housing Minister Raila Odinga told Parliament yesterday.



Selective application of facts,you don't remember Railas speech in parliament saying the house will remain with Moi amidst applause by Kalenjin mps.Be fair sometimes and give credit where it's due.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 04:56:33 PM

Any link to this story.Or part of the Kalenjin Supremacy myths ?

If I recall correctly - Biwott and his "hand over to the army" guys had approached Gen Sumbeiywo to take over power. Gen Sumbeiywo had been instrumental in South Sudan and had some political experience - flatly refused. Sumbeiyo had been promoted to Chief of Staff - thankfully Moi was wise and Sumbeiywo knew better than be part of the plot - and Brig Boinnet got Kibaki and the Americans to deal with Kalenjin elite anxieties. All of them had bought houses abroad in readiness to flee if things went south.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 05:16:30 PM
Trust my outstanding memory - okay? or read Sumbeiywo book - read btw the lines
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/revealed-army-secrets-of-moi-regime-s-last-days-522044?view=htmlamp

Its pages detail key moments – both public and private – in the handover from Kanu to Narc after the contest for State House became a two-horse race in the closing moments of 2002, and it became increasingly clear that Mr Kibaki would be elected as the next President.

The Army decided to remain impartial and instal as its Commander-in-Chief whichever candidate won.

Mr Kibaki, for the combined Opposition, was running against Kanu's Uhuru Kenyatta, the preferred choice of Mr Moi, who was stepping down as President and Commander-in-Chief after 24 years in power.

In the book, Gen Sumbeiywo reveals that civil servants refused to accept the possibility that the Kanu candidate would lose.

Kenya: How Generals Won Battle for Transition - allAfrica.comhttps://allafrica.com › stories
22 Mar 2004 — But the military top brass strongly advised against it - and won. ... Gen Kibwana and the Army Commander Lt General Sumbeiywo in particular ...


Any link to this story.Or part of the Kalenjin Supremacy myths ?
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Dear Mami on February 02, 2022, 05:16:38 PM
I think we disagree on the timing. I dont think it was early in 2003 - but later when relationship with Mt Kenya went south.

I remember Raila after Kibaki betrayed him warming up to KANU - that eventually led to merge of LDP and KANU - into ODM.

I also remember Raila targeting Moi land in Mau forest in 2008


I see it was in July

25 JULY 2003
The East African Standard (Nairobi)
By Andrew Teyie
Nairobi — The Government will not evict former President Moi from his Kibera house, which used to be the official Vice-President's residence.

Subsequently, the Government will construct a house to accommodate, the current and future Vice-Presidents, Roads, Public Works and Housing Minister Raila Odinga told Parliament yesterday.



Selective application of facts,you don't remember Railas speech in parliament saying the house will remain with Moi amidst applause by Kalenjin mps.Be fair sometimes and give credit where it's due.

Mau forest is a separate story. Raila spoke up literally on TV to journalists about Moi being summoned to the Goldenberg Commission for questioning. Moody Awori defended those pushing it and Raila said Mzee to be left alone. That is something I saw and heard for myself right when the debates for the summons were going on and No, Raila hadn't fallen out with Kibaki yet. In fact, after that, the debate pretty much died, at least from the news cycle where it was hot.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 05:23:09 PM
Kalenjin leaders were crying foul as early as feb 2002. Raila speaks in parliament in July. When Kimunya and Kiraitu had already communicated that Raila as housing minister needed to build new VP house in Karen.

If I recall initially NARC won - the fallout btw Raila and Kibaki started almost immediately.

Also the call for MOi to account started almost immediately - with Raila & Nyayo torture chambers - Ouko probe - and later the goldenburg commission headed by Bosire. These were early months of NARC.

Raila only warmed up to KANU when Mt Kenya mafia told him the MOU btw NAK & LDP was not worthy of the paper it was written of

Mau forest is a separate story. Raila spoke up literally on TV to journalists about Moi being summoned to the Goldenberg Commission for questioning. Moody Awori defended those pushing it and Raila said Mzee to be left alone. That is something I saw and heard for myself right when the debates for the summons were going on and No, Raila hadn't fallen out with Kibaki yet. In fact, after that, the debate pretty much died, at least from the news cycle where it was hot.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 05:26:17 PM
NOwayah - if I recall the kitchen cabinet intrigues - the Young turks led by Ruto and Uhuru had no problem with hand over to Kibaki - they had no skletons- Biwott and his group of old KANU we very fearful - and explored the military options - they approached the army - Gen Sumbeiywo flatly objected. Boinett shared those plans with the Americans. The Americans were of course very interested player then in ensuring a peaceful transition of kenya. They had Kibaki and  Moi signed an Mou that spared Moi of all crimes - and in turn he would not oppose the incoming gov in anyway.

Kibaki would late fire almost everyone but retained Boinnet for two more years...until in 2005..when again Boinnet told Kibaki he would lose the referendum and the men around Kibaki went for Boinnet.

Boinnet is one of kenya unsung patriots.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 05:47:42 PM

Doesnt corroborate what you are saying The CIA American story.

Trust my outstanding memory - okay? or read Sumbeiywo book - read btw the lines
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/revealed-army-secrets-of-moi-regime-s-last-days-522044?view=htmlamp

Its pages detail key moments – both public and private – in the handover from Kanu to Narc after the contest for State House became a two-horse race in the closing moments of 2002, and it became increasingly clear that Mr Kibaki would be elected as the next President.

The Army decided to remain impartial and instal as its Commander-in-Chief whichever candidate won.

Mr Kibaki, for the combined Opposition, was running against Kanu's Uhuru Kenyatta, the preferred choice of Mr Moi, who was stepping down as President and Commander-in-Chief after 24 years in power.

In the book, Gen Sumbeiywo reveals that civil servants refused to accept the possibility that the Kanu candidate would lose.

Kenya: How Generals Won Battle for Transition - allAfrica.comhttps://allafrica.com › stories
22 Mar 2004 — But the military top brass strongly advised against it - and won. ... Gen Kibwana and the Army Commander Lt General Sumbeiywo in particular ...


Any link to this story.Or part of the Kalenjin Supremacy myths ?
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 05:54:12 PM

Raila and Kibaki fell out by the time cabinet was announced.
Raila had his own line up but was suprised when Kibaki announce , Achilo Ayako, Tuju and even Anyang Nyongo as Ministers.
His Party leutinants called a Pressconfrence and announced there was a MOU between NAK and LDP to share posts 50/50. That was the first week of Kibakis tenure.

Kalenjin leaders were crying foul as early as feb 2002. Raila speaks in parliament in July. When Kimunya and Kiraitu had already communicated that Raila as housing minister needed to build new VP house in Karen.

If I recall initially NARC won - the fallout btw Raila and Kibaki started almost immediately.

Also the call for MOi to account started almost immediately - with Raila & Nyayo torture chambers - Ouko probe - and later the goldenburg commission headed by Bosire. These were early months of NARC.

Raila only warmed up to KANU when Mt Kenya mafia told him the MOU btw NAK & LDP was not worthy of the paper it was written of

Mau forest is a separate story. Raila spoke up literally on TV to journalists about Moi being summoned to the Goldenberg Commission for questioning. Moody Awori defended those pushing it and Raila said Mzee to be left alone. That is something I saw and heard for myself right when the debates for the summons were going on and No, Raila hadn't fallen out with Kibaki yet. In fact, after that, the debate pretty much died, at least from the news cycle where it was hot.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 05:57:49 PM
You think CIA will air such deals? You need to use basic logic. MOU btw Kibaki & MOi overseen by US & Boinett is well known - you're just naive.


The writing was on the wall but Moi ignored wise counselhttps://nation.africa › kenya › news › politics › the-writi...
4 Jul 2020 — Kibaki's first secret meeting with Boinnet was in November 2002. ... to get the Americans tell Moi to the face what he did not want to hear.
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/politics/the-writing-was-on-the-wall-but-moi-ignored-wise-counsel--559172?view=htmlamp


Sources in the know now disclose that whereas Moi wrongly suspected his Intelligence chief to work closely with Saitoti, the truth was that Boinnet had opened a channel of communication with Narc candidate Mwai Kibaki after realising that the latter was headed to be the next commander in chief.

The secret liaison with candidate Kibaki began in November 2002, a month to the election. The two linkmen in the liaison were Mr Stanley Murage and a retired senior Intelligence officer working for the Kibaki presidential campaign.

Secret meeting

Kibaki’s first secret meeting with Boinnet was in November 2002. Boinnet personally drove himself in an unmarked car to a crowded parking of a major city hospital from where Kibaki’s emissary picked him up in a battered Peugeot 504 saloon and drove him to Kibaki’s Muthaiga home.

Following the meeting, sources disclose, Boinnet decided to limit the scope of intelligence reports on the opposition candidate landing on Moi’s desk.

Kibaki handlers took advantage of the vital liaison to aggressively fund-raise for his campaign without fear of having to look over their shoulders.

Indeed, his trusted aide and nephew, the late Alex Mureithi, was to make three secret trips to Libya where strongman Muammar Gaddafi made generous contributions to the Kibaki campaign kitty.

Mr Murage, too, could now secretly fund-raise for Kibaki without fear of reprisals from State House. It is reliably learnt that he raised such a tidy bundle for the Kibaki campaign to a point that his exalted place in the new administration was guaranteed long before hand.

But perhaps the most important thing Boinnet did for candidate Kibaki was to use the time-honoured brotherhood of intelligence to get the Americans tell Moi to the face what he did not want to hear.

A few weeks to the December 2002 elections, Moi was invited to Washington where the White House told him that intelligence picked on the ground indicated Kanu and its candidate Uhuru Kenyatta would be trounced at the ballot.

The Americans impressed upon him to accept the voters’ verdict and hand over to the opposition when the time came. Moi, ever flexible when cornered, saw the point.

Indeed, on his return home, he stopped over in London to visit candidate Kibaki, then recuperating in hospital following a road accident early in December.

It was the first clear pointer that the former president was finally reconciling with the possibility of a Kibaki presidency.

Doesnt corroborate what you are saying The CIA American story.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 06:27:05 PM

You like mixing stories. Truth of the matter is Moi had no qualms with Kibaki.  In 1997 he even said Kibaki is the only opposition candidate who can lead Kenya. Moi tried to bring Kibaki to his fold but Kibaki knew it would finish him politically.
If there was a deal (thats why we encourage politicians to write books) then It was done between Kibaki and Moi.
Uhuru will eventually make a deal with Ruto.
In 2002 there is a reason Uhuru conceded flanked by Ruto even before results were announced.
You think CIA will air such deals? You need to use basic logic. MOU btw Kibaki & MOi overseen by US & Boinett is well known - you're just naive.


The writing was on the wall but Moi ignored wise counselhttps://nation.africa › kenya › news › politics › the-writi...
4 Jul 2020 — Kibaki's first secret meeting with Boinnet was in November 2002. ... to get the Americans tell Moi to the face what he did not want to hear.
https://nation.africa/kenya/news/politics/the-writing-was-on-the-wall-but-moi-ignored-wise-counsel--559172?view=htmlamp


Sources in the know now disclose that whereas Moi wrongly suspected his Intelligence chief to work closely with Saitoti, the truth was that Boinnet had opened a channel of communication with Narc candidate Mwai Kibaki after realising that the latter was headed to be the next commander in chief.

The secret liaison with candidate Kibaki began in November 2002, a month to the election. The two linkmen in the liaison were Mr Stanley Murage and a retired senior Intelligence officer working for the Kibaki presidential campaign.

Secret meeting

Kibaki’s first secret meeting with Boinnet was in November 2002. Boinnet personally drove himself in an unmarked car to a crowded parking of a major city hospital from where Kibaki’s emissary picked him up in a battered Peugeot 504 saloon and drove him to Kibaki’s Muthaiga home.

Following the meeting, sources disclose, Boinnet decided to limit the scope of intelligence reports on the opposition candidate landing on Moi’s desk.

Kibaki handlers took advantage of the vital liaison to aggressively fund-raise for his campaign without fear of having to look over their shoulders.

Indeed, his trusted aide and nephew, the late Alex Mureithi, was to make three secret trips to Libya where strongman Muammar Gaddafi made generous contributions to the Kibaki campaign kitty.

Mr Murage, too, could now secretly fund-raise for Kibaki without fear of reprisals from State House. It is reliably learnt that he raised such a tidy bundle for the Kibaki campaign to a point that his exalted place in the new administration was guaranteed long before hand.

But perhaps the most important thing Boinnet did for candidate Kibaki was to use the time-honoured brotherhood of intelligence to get the Americans tell Moi to the face what he did not want to hear.

A few weeks to the December 2002 elections, Moi was invited to Washington where the White House told him that intelligence picked on the ground indicated Kanu and its candidate Uhuru Kenyatta would be trounced at the ballot.

The Americans impressed upon him to accept the voters’ verdict and hand over to the opposition when the time came. Moi, ever flexible when cornered, saw the point.

Indeed, on his return home, he stopped over in London to visit candidate Kibaki, then recuperating in hospital following a road accident early in December.

It was the first clear pointer that the former president was finally reconciling with the possibility of a Kibaki presidency.

Doesnt corroborate what you are saying The CIA American story.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 06:37:14 PM
Typical idiot - just admit you know nothing - and are naive.
Moi may have had no qualms but he had real fears that he would be held to account for all his crimes of omission and commission!
And the people around Moi were even more fearful.
The US and Boinnet saved Kenya.
Because If they didnt - It very possible Moi would have handed to Gen Sumbeiwyo after some PEV.
You like mixing stories. Truth of the matter is Moi had no qualms with Kibaki.  In 1997 he even said Kibaki is the only opposition candidate who can lead Kenya. Moi tried to bring Kibaki to his fold but Kibaki knew it would finish him politically.
If there was a deal (thats why we encourage politicians to write books) then It was done between Kibaki and Moi.
Uhuru will eventually make a deal with Ruto.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Nowayhaha on February 02, 2022, 06:59:37 PM
Moi was okei handing over power to Kibaki, NARC aeministration thought he would hand over. Moi in his last days of power visited U.S. and openly committed he will LEAVE power.
Daudi Tonje reforms in Military came in aid as there was no entitlement by the Generals to cling into power. Boinett was instrumental by sticking to his guns Kibaki had won.
Uhuru was asked by Moi and convinced by Kenyan Oligarchy to concede. You seem to not know Majority of Rainbow summit members apart from Raila were meeting with Moi secretly. They would tell Moi it was too late and I do believe its by then that Moi cut a deal. During that period alot of looting happened and Moi aides transffered alot of wealth from their custody to Moi.
Hii story ya CIA and Kalenjin Coup is just another Myth created to show superiority.

Typical idiot - just admit you know nothing - and are naive.
Moi may have had no qualms but he had real fears that he would be held to account for all his crimes of omission and commission!
And the people around Moi were even more fearful.
The US and Boinnet saved Kenya.
Because If they didnt - It very possible Moi would have handed to Gen Sumbeiwyo after some PEV.
You like mixing stories. Truth of the matter is Moi had no qualms with Kibaki.  In 1997 he even said Kibaki is the only opposition candidate who can lead Kenya. Moi tried to bring Kibaki to his fold but Kibaki knew it would finish him politically.
If there was a deal (thats why we encourage politicians to write books) then It was done between Kibaki and Moi.
Uhuru will eventually make a deal with Ruto.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: Dear Mami on February 02, 2022, 07:16:58 PM
Kalenjin leaders were crying foul as early as feb 2002. Raila speaks in parliament in July. When Kimunya and Kiraitu had already communicated that Raila as housing minister needed to build new VP house in Karen.

If I recall initially NARC won - the fallout btw Raila and Kibaki started almost immediately.

Also the call for MOi to account started almost immediately - with Raila & Nyayo torture chambers - Ouko probe - and later the goldenburg commission headed by Bosire. These were early months of NARC.

Raila only warmed up to KANU when Mt Kenya mafia told him the MOU btw NAK & LDP was not worthy of the paper it was written of

Mau forest is a separate story. Raila spoke up literally on TV to journalists about Moi being summoned to the Goldenberg Commission for questioning. Moody Awori defended those pushing it and Raila said Mzee to be left alone. That is something I saw and heard for myself right when the debates for the summons were going on and No, Raila hadn't fallen out with Kibaki yet. In fact, after that, the debate pretty much died, at least from the news cycle where it was hot.
I wasn't wrong saying 2003. Remember, elections were in Dec 2002. These Goldenberg things were happening in 2003-2004, the first year of NARC after Kibaki swearing in almost (close to) New Years. And even if the rift started immediately, they were still managing it for a while as things got worse. Only when Raila and company walked out did it fully mature. But for at least some months they were getting along. I remember Kibaki visiting Nyeri to cross River Chania as president with Raila.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 02, 2022, 07:25:33 PM
Yes true - fallout happened on 2nd day - after swearing - but they thought it was just hiccups - unaware Kibaki and his mafia had no intention to honour the deal. Kibaki health didnt help.

Anyway Kibaki disappointed me - I wish he had just honoured the MOU - and stuck to the reform agenda - not become insular and try to re-enact a kikuyu regime - when kenyans had broke free from tribalism to elect him with 2/3 majority.

It was the biggest let down - and personally I quit supporting him in 2004.

Back to issue - Moi was not saved by Raila or Kibaki - he was saved by the Americans who guaranteed his jail free ticket as long as he handed over power and stayed out of politics. As much as Moi had disappointed Kalenjin nation - he was and still is a revered hero who had impacted Kalenjin in big ways - and touching him would have definitely sparked a civil war.

I wasn't wrong saying 2003. Remember, elections were in Dec 2002. These Goldenberg things were happening in 2003-2004, the first year of NARC after Kibaki swearing in almost (close to) New Years. And even if the rift started immediately, they were still managing it for a while as things got worse. Only when Raila and company walked out did it fully mature. But for at least some months they were getting along. I remember Kibaki visiting Nyeri to cross River Chania as president with Raila.
Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: gout on February 04, 2022, 10:24:15 AM

Title: Re: Oka to join Azimio but kalonzo not happy
Post by: RV Pundit on February 04, 2022, 10:27:31 AM
I wonder what Gen Cheruiyot was doing with Ndii. Cheruiyot was an illeterate. He had been fired or retired in the army - and had decided to oppose Moi - and was in Narc. Maybe he was emissary to Mois Generals.

I believe there was big fallout btw Nandi elites and Tugen elites in EATEC land. The Nandis wanted the land being ancestral land of the Nandis - but Moi Tugens and Keiyo wanted it all.

Mark Too being the chairman of Lonro - who owned Eatec was in charge of selling the 40,000 acres land full of wattle trees - now Kapseret - near Eldoret airport - Biwott and Moi - and their tugen-keiyo elite wanted huge piece - leading to bitter fallout. Mark Too got himself 3,000 acres and told Moi to go dry.

Gen Cheruiyot, Kibor and many Nandis opposed Moi - and eventually Nandis mostly voted for NARC - led by Kirwa and Tarus.


1 NOVEMBER 2002
The East African Standard (Nairobi)
By Judith Akolo And Ben Agina
Nairobi — Former Army Commander Lt Gen Augustine arap Cheruiyot yesterday resigned as chairman of the Kenya Airports Authority (KAA) and joined the Opposition.

Cheruiyot, who joined the Liberal Democratic Party (LDP), was received by Mr Raila Odinga.