Lt Gen Ogolla - take early retirement otherwise how will you be in Kasarani

[RV Pundit]

I don't know about Belsoi but family denies his farm was used and it was unlikely because he kept many non kalenjin workers.His farm workers and neighbor were fingered for his killing.Someone like kipkalyia definitely used his farm in Sirikwa for such activities including in 2007.

[Stockguru]

I don't know about Belsoi but family denies his farm was used and it was unlikely because he kept many non kalenjin workers.His farm workers and neighbor were fingered for his killing.Someone like kipkalyia definitely used his farm in Sirikwa for such activities including in 2007.

He was involved. All the talk was that he was using his knowledge to aid others and help them with logistics

Njenga Mungai and others claimed that the intelligence was collaborated by then provincial admin

Kalenjins did target a lot of Kikuyu businessmen and activists

The escalation was terrible for both sides

[RV Pundit]

Moi was evil and the cause of it.Moi felt betrayed by kikuyus as he thought he should be unchallenged till death He was one who had facilitated settlement of immigrants in riftvalley in exchange of the vice presidency.The rest of people were pawns.

[KenyanPlato]

Moi was evil and the cause of it.Moi felt betrayed by kikuyus as he thought he should be unchallenged till death He was one who had facilitated settlement of immigrants in riftvalley in exchange of the vice presidency.The rest of people were pawns.

kones and others too worked to aid moi. anyway all the well do kikuyus from rv these days try to move their kids out
 I am told even in the middle class once a kid leaves molo they encouraged never to return
the woman I was helping last year start a business told me she was sent to nairobi while in standard 7 and was adopted by her aunt because her parents wanted her to establish a life away from rift Valley. the parents too sold their land and are in process of building a home in nyeri. they just do business in rift Valley but their longterm goal is to leave rv forever. most molo people I see in states have no plans of moving back there. I had a buddy who spent weeks during pev rescuing friends and family. He vowed never again will he put his people in the position. he even burried his dad in nyeri in hope that helps his siblings know they have no future in molo

[KenyanPlato]

moi was a typical kalenjin. a hypocrite.

[RV Heavy Hitter!]

Moi was evil and the cause of it.Moi felt betrayed by kikuyus as he thought he should be unchallenged till death He was one who had facilitated settlement of immigrants in riftvalley in exchange of the vice presidency.The rest of people were pawns.

Yes, he was pure evil. He used to come to my neighborhood in Moi Barracks and say in Kalenjin, " Mbona msitu immemea mpaka kwa nyumba, toeni slasher na muvyeke kwelikweli" loosely mean why are other tribes all over your neighborhood, uproot them effectively. That is when Devout Christian Ruto started joining politics to kill tribalism and many injustices. Within a decade, he had conquered Moi. In two decades, he had destroyed remaining rascal Moi, Corrupt Kenyattas, and violent Odingas, the scum of Kenya. In 2022 and beyond, Kenya will be run by [RUTO SAMOEI] a clean heart, justice crusader, integrity-driven, and someone who means well for Kenya. Kenya is immensely blessed to have him steer the country until 2042! Fuck the idiots opposed to him!

[RV Pundit]

Yes when weak insecure leader like Moi or Raila wins he will use all means to stay in power.Ruto lead comfortably because he is excellent in almost all spheres.He doesn't have to kill or maim to win or gain power.

[RV Pundit]

moi was a typical kalenjin. a hypocrite.

kiambu mafia created moi then harassed him.Like Uhuru has done to Ruto.Kalenjin will repay Uhuru betrayal and humiliation.Ruto is pretending to be all nice until he has entrenched himself then Uhuru will cry real tears.Kenyattas are finished... just wait and see. Kikuyus have bought themselves long term stability in RV.They should live and do business with new confidence.Their heroic acts against Kenyatta have everyone shocked except luo nyanza

[RV Heavy Hitter!]

Kenyatta enemies now and going forward are the Kikuyu masses. You will never see Uhuru mingling with regular okuyus unless forced by circumstances. He will quietly oscillate from Ichaweri to Airport, Seychelles, and his Maasai Mara Ranch until his demise. When Kalenjin left Moi for Ruto, Moi never left Kabarak farm and his Kabarnet Garden home. He never met regular Kalenjin people or did anything outside his compound until he died. He was so bitter that Kalenjins went with Ruto instead of his direction. Kenyatta is facing a similar problem. He must be even more upset with okuyus than the way Moi was bitter with Kalenjins.

[RV Pundit]

Moi kept calling kalenjin elders and leaders to kabarak asking why they people abandoned and hated him despite having done so much for them..he died very bitter.There is nothing more bitter than you own people who you were leading to hate or despise you.Its hurting the Kenyatta's more than anything.Kenyatta has all the money but they want to be heard, sung for and respected...now they are despised and seen as drunk fools

[KenyanPlato]

listen to what you are saying fools. so moi tells you to go kill your neighbor but because you are evil and primitive people you go kill and then blame him. reminds me of a bishop at icc court who was asked by the Russian judge why he didn't visit his neighbors living in an idp camp. The idp was leds than 10km from his home and 5km frm his church. the kalenjin bishop didn't have an answer. stop blaming moi for knowing that kalenjins are emotionally immature enough to be told to go and they kill.
 stop excusing your people murders and violence they have subjected kikuyus for over 30 years.

ATI moi ndiye alituchochea kwani nyinyi ni watoto. you sound ridiculous

[RV Pundit]

When you settle in land that historical belong to others and they are complaining loudly about it; prepare for battle; be it in Kiambu or Kalenjin; that is genesis of Kikuyu suffering. Your people should have been settled in large plantation that are in Kiamb - not shipped enmasse to middle of kalenjin. Half kiambu is owned by a few kikuyu elite.This is land Ruto need to take back and give it to Kikuyu peasants....wait for 2 million settlement scheme.

As for violence - Mau Mau versus homeguards - killed more kikuyus than Kalenjin ever did.

You own village in Lari - 100 plus people dead in one night.

Stop the crap. Any war anywhere in the world people die! The one t blame is whoever start the war. Hilter killed millions of Europans. Are Europeans evil?

Moi is to blame for tribal clashes of 90s that affected Kikuyu, gusii, luos and luhyas...and also kalenjin were killed.

Kibaki is most to blame for 2007.

The rest are usual nonsense from a resident madman in this forum.

Your own parents been expelled from your own village by your lovely neighberhours...nearly killed. Your own neihgerhours in Lari - are they also Kalenjin? And they hate your madness because you're abnormal and dont know how to relate with people.

listen to what you are saying fools. so moi tells you to go kill your neighbor but because you are evil, primitive people you are evil people you go kill and then blame him. reminds me of the bishop at icc court who was asked by the Russian judge why he didn't visit his neighbors living in an idp camp. the kalenjin bishop didn't have an answer. stop blaming moi for knowing too that kalenjins are emotionally immature enough to be told to go and they kill.
 stop excusing your people murders and violence they have subjected kikuyus for over 30 years.

ATI moi ndiye alituchochea kwani nyinyi ni watoto. you sound ridiculous

[KenyanPlato]

did kikuyus just take the land or buy it from your people? Now that you have buyers remorse you take it out on your hapless neighbors. most of those displaced actually were just poor people living in informal settlements working in rv and possibly working for Kalenjins. Kikuyus won't go after the most weak. even when mau mau attacked in Lari it killed those that were abusing their privilege. Kahangara was for years maiming mau mau suspects and would even drag suspects with his car or horse. he had to be eliminated. Mau Mau was fighting the British and its loyalists.

the 1990s ethnic clashes were as a result of kalenjins trying to make sure kikuyus didn't vote or support opposition. your primitive people were suppressing democracy and subverting the will of the people. stop the bullshit about land that is pretense. the real reason is because you morons wanted kikuyus to be your political slaves forever

you can't compare mau mau war and ethnic clashes.

[KenyanPlato]

my parents were victims of Moi era insecurity in Central. moi worked with goons like kanyingi to supress kikuyus. this included not providing enough security to kikuyu areas like my village. kibaki reversed this

[RV Pundit]

First its not only kikuyus who were targeted - Gusii, Luos and Luhyas also suffered greatly.
Kalenjin did not sell the land to immigrants - in any significant numbers - those who settled bought the farms from white highlands.
This was mostly in Nakuru, Uasin Gishu and Tranzoia.
There were many complains and warning of war if settlement went on.
Murgor father was 1st to declare war against immigrants in 1963.
All through 1960s - Kalenjin complained - that settlement was going on without any fairness - that kikuyu were being given preference to buy land.
Remember few really bought the land - it was LOAN from British gov.
So nobody really bought the land - maybe just the deposit - to unlock the loan.
Kenyatta then put Moi as VP to placate Kalenjin so settlement continued
Moi knew Kenyatta had placed him there to stop kalenjin murmurs and war cries.
All was good until kikuyu leaders in 1990s wanted to remove Moi.
Moi remembered the land issues and re-opened it - Majimbo - both in RV an Coast.
He knew he would not only expel voters but hold hostage opposition leaders.
And it worked.
Of course it resulted into many deaths.
Before 1990s - kikuyus and others had been living in rift valley for 30yrs - people had even forgotten about land grievances.
Folks had intermarried - lived together - nobody even quite recall the land issues.
Until Moi started opening the old wounds and telling people to expel immigrants.
And of course he started burning few house of kalenjin - knowing it would spark war.
Which kikuyu had been attacked in 60s,70s, 80s? NONE.
Until Moi started the land clashes as he was pinned on the wall by larger tribes.
Of course Kalenjin were more than happy to board and attempt fix historical injustices.

did kikuyus just take the land or buy it from your people? Now that you have buyers remorse you take it out on your hapless neighbors. most of those displaced actually were just poor people living in informal settlements working in rv and possibly working for Kalenjins. Kikuyus won't go after the most weak. even when mau mau attacked in Lari it killed those that were abusing their privilege. Kahangara was for years maiming mau mau suspects and would even drag suspects with his car or horse. he had to be eliminated. Mau Mau was fighting the British and its loyalists.

for kalenjins they were victimized and killing kikuyus because kikuyus were voting for opposition

you can't compare mau mau war and ethnic clashes.

[Stockguru]

First its not only kikuyus who were targeted - Gusii, Luos and Luhyas also suffered greatly.
Kalenjin did not sell the land to immigrants - in any significant numbers - those who settled bought the farms from white highlands.
This was mostly in Nakuru, Uasin Gishu and Tranzoia.
There were many complains and warning of war if settlement went on.
Murgor father was 1st to declare war against immigrants in 1963.
All through 1960s - Kalenjin complained - that settlement was going on without any fairness - that kikuyu were being given preference to buy land.
Remember few really bought the land - it was LOAN from British gov.
So nobody really bought the land - maybe just the deposit - to unlock the loan.
Kenyatta then put Moi as VP to placate Kalenjin so settlement continued
Moi knew Kenyatta had placed him there to stop kalenjin murmurs and war cries.
All was good until kikuyu leaders in 1990s wanted to remove Moi.
Moi remembered the land issues and re-opened it - Majimbo - both in RV an Coast.
He knew he would not only expel voters but hold hostage opposition leaders.
And it worked.
Of course it resulted into many deaths.
Before 1990s - kikuyus and others had been living in rift valley for 30yrs - people had even forgotten about land grievances.
Folks had intermarried - lived together - nobody even quite recall the land issues.
Until Moi started opening the old wounds and telling people to expel immigrants.
And of course he started burning few house of kalenjin - knowing it would spark war.
Which kikuyu had been attacked in 60s,70s, 80s? NONE.
Until Moi started the land clashes as he was pinned on the wall by larger tribes.
Of course Kalenjin were more than happy to board and attempt fix historical injustices.

did kikuyus just take the land or buy it from your people? Now that you have buyers remorse you take it out on your hapless neighbors. most of those displaced actually were just poor people living in informal settlements working in rv and possibly working for Kalenjins. Kikuyus won't go after the most weak. even when mau mau attacked in Lari it killed those that were abusing their privilege. Kahangara was for years maiming mau mau suspects and would even drag suspects with his car or horse. he had to be eliminated. Mau Mau was fighting the British and its loyalists.

for kalenjins they were victimized and killing kikuyus because kikuyus were voting for opposition

you can't compare mau mau war and ethnic clashes.

Bullshit i know a woman that family was displaced during Seroney time. It must have been in the 60s and Kikuyus were displaced in 1953. Read up on history of Kikuyus displacement in RV
It have come in waves from 1950s to present

[RV Pundit]

1) Kikuyus were displaced first in 1947-1952s- mostly by Italian/germans prison of wars and tractors.

After serving their time - as British POWS (WW2) - generally building roads/dams- they were given land that kikuyus and others were illegally squatting on the edges of British farms like Molo and Olenguerene. Those Italians army men were pretty nasty and violently evicted kikuyus and kalenjin....they were workhorse who dug their farm using own tractors and rarely hired labour.
Secondly British farmers imported tractors - so there was a lot of mechanization - and manual labourers were mass fired.
This initial group that cameback to central - to find themselves landless as relative or chiefs refused to grant them land- and started Mau Mau - land clashes.Those are ones responsible for Lari massacres - as they felt the chiefs had disinherited them

2) The 2nd eviction happened btw 1952-1956 - with Mau Mau emergency laws -
With the killing british farmers in cold blood - British decided to expel any kikuyu from their farms.
Almost all kikuyus were evicted from rift valley except those that worked in african farms. There were few kalenjin rich farmers like Biwott father, Tiren - who had bought huge land after learning from Boers (South Africans) who were not racist and taught african farming.
Biwott father for example - applied and was allowed to keep 200 kikuyu farm labourers. Generally kikuyus were rounded up in farms and shipped back to concentration camps in central.

3) Kikuyu mass return to rift valley - once kenyatta became president - kikuyu trek back to rift valley - this was from 1960s-1970s.
They initially received no resistance as they mainly occupied maasai land - Nyandarua, Naivasha, parts of east of Nakuru. The Maasai had been evicted to Narok, Kajiado and North Laikipia - so had no idea that former land was going

4) When they started crossing Nakuru - all the way to Kitale - kalenjin started complaining. These were pasture land of kalenjin. The ownership claims are tenous. Nobody really lived there...it was fallow land for grazing cattle during drought. Kalenjin and Maasai held claim to them - but British finding them devoid of human settlement - had made them white highlands.

5) When in 1970s the immigrants now started encroaching into now traditional kalenjin counties of nandi, kericho, elgeyo - this when war cry and skirmshes started. I think seroney started one - Nandi Hills declaration - that forbade kikuyus or others from crossing into Nandi district.

6) I think there were few skirmshes in 70s - localized - nothing serious on land dispute btw farms or wrangles on borders - and some on business - that evicted kikuyu businessmen from deep kalenjin trading centers.

7) Then they was 20yr peace until 1991 land clashes.

Bullshit i know a woman that family was displaced during Seroney time. It must have been in the 60s and Kikuyus were displaced in 1953. Read up on history of Kikuyus displacement in RV
It have come in waves from 1950s to present