Author Topic: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals  (Read 16002 times)

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #40 on: November 20, 2019, 03:44:44 PM »
Likes of KQ can be timed better but Safaricom or KCB I believe are at their optimum price.

Yes the details of when and where to sell should be left to transaction advisors. We need to start the process. The screwball cannot complete anything without help of say Ruto or Matiangi.
But do not you want to make this sale when valuation is high? Anyway screwball shelved that Somali guy commission report on public companies. I cannot remember the name of that politician he is a lightskin abri kadir or something Arabic. Screwball is going to just sit and hope this will blow over. How comes he travels alone for these debt hunts? Who really is the fixer at statehouse for this crackhead?
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527


Offline KenyanPlato

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #42 on: November 20, 2019, 04:08:26 PM »
You are not bankrupt or in crisis. Say like Greece. That's alot of alarmism and negativity. You got choices. In future you will thank Uhuru not want to lynch him. He has done much more good than bad.

Kenyans are more like a kid wailing for being dragged to school... Kadame how is that analogy  :)

Fundamentals first then others next. A farmer in nyandarua needs a better road before he needs 24 hours of electricity. He needs access to local market before he focuses on export market. Any investment in Kenya that doesn't focus on agriculture as its foundation will not flourish. We need t9 stop this extractive colonial mentality. HK who is in business will tell you that how he gets is his container to Nairobi is less of his worries. H8s b8ggest worry is if he can distribute his goods and source materials in ken ya cheaply without breaking the bank ...increase productivity in agriculture and you won't have to worry about the rest

Offline KenyanPlato

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #43 on: November 20, 2019, 04:12:13 PM »
Would you buy Kcb?

Offline Dear Mami

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #44 on: November 20, 2019, 04:19:36 PM »
You are not bankrupt or in crisis. Say like Greece. That's alot of alarmism and negativity. You got choices. In future you will thank Uhuru not want to lynch him. He has done much more good than bad.

Kenyans are more like a kid wailing for being dragged to school... Kadame how is that analogy  :)

You are telling yourself a nice fairy story, Robina.:D Being 'positive' about a dangerous situation is described by another analogy: An ostrich burying its head hoping the encroaching cheater will disappear if the ostrich doesn't look at it. Things are thick and the chicken are coming home to roost now. Perhaps the reality is too shocking. Do you imagine cash will magically turn up from some place affordable if we just stay hopeful n positive? You need to help Kamwana; dude is trying everything and not seeing a way. Let Ndii educate you, my sister: https://www.theelephant.info/op-eds/2019/11/15/i-dont-understand-why-kenyans-are-broke-mr-kenyattas-debt-distress-revisited/

Offline Dear Mami

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #45 on: November 20, 2019, 04:55:53 PM »
Guys, it's like you don't want to deal with what Jubilee has done: Jubilee has destroyed our ability to invest in much needed development projects that would revitalize our economy and increase revenues for the government as a result. It has squandared trillions in projects that contribute zero or negative value to the economy plus graft. Tell yourselves thats not Greece, all you want. :D We are not that far off.

Fundamentals first then others next. A farmer in nyandarua needs a better road before he needs 24 hours of electricity. He needs access to local market before he focuses on export market. Any investment in Kenya that doesn't focus on agriculture as its foundation will not flourish. We need t9 stop this extractive colonial mentality. HK who is in business will tell you that how he gets is his container to Nairobi is less of his worries. H8s b8ggest worry is if he can distribute his goods and source materials in ken ya cheaply without breaking the bank ...increase productivity in agriculture and you won't have to worry about the rest

Jubilee has not invested in our greatest asset: our people. We are over 70% farmers. Invest in that sector intelligently and you're investing in Kenya. Kenya is not Nairobi. Instead flashy projects yielding nothing at the (HIGH) cost of future/better/necessary development is where we are at.

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #46 on: November 20, 2019, 04:56:21 PM »
Fundamentals first then others next. A farmer in nyandarua needs a better road before he needs 24 hours of electricity. He needs access to local market before he focuses on export market. Any investment in Kenya that doesn't focus on agriculture as its foundation will not flourish. We need t9 stop this extractive colonial mentality. HK who is in business will tell you that how he gets is his container to Nairobi is less of his worries. H8s b8ggest worry is if he can distribute his goods and source materials in ken ya cheaply without breaking the bank ...increase productivity in agriculture and you won't have to worry about the rest

Yes Jubilee priorities need calibration. I have been critical of the SGR and last-miles and insisted on city metro, rural murram and cheap power. You can still argue if GoK has social responsibilities besides strict economics. Should the poor get power or just focus on the productive sectors? Should you upgrade slums at zero return? Should you outlaw unions to court business? It's the classic right vs left question in the west.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #47 on: November 20, 2019, 05:17:37 PM »
Kadame what is investing in our people? If not free education and TIVETS. And universal health - UhuruCare. The ambitious 100% primary to secondary to tertiary transition is in encouraging progress.

We buttressed this before. Coffee and cash crop boomed in the 70s because of low supply and high demand of new commodity exchanges. Even if you were the best farmers, agric cannot produce enough value. Because Israel or Netherlands are better yet agric is 1% of their stock. Value adds and services that require highly skilled manpower are a better avenue to prosperity than say heavy manufacturing. You need to specialize where you have a fighting chance. I don't criticize Safaricom for sport.

Why is the infrastructure deficit worth fixing? Because the approaching demographic dividend can be a boom if well tapped. It's a windfall easy to miss like Nigeria due to coups, civil strife, insidious corruption and instability. You cannot build infra overnight and must continue without immediate returns. I see it as a window of opportunity that will shrink with time. The manufacturing gravy train is gone. Oil and gas are DOA with the climate emergency. Commodities collapsed. Digital revolution Kenya has done OK-ish. Don't squander the demographic opportunity by being pennywise, poundfoolish.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Dear Mami

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #48 on: November 20, 2019, 05:37:15 PM »
Quote
Kadame what is investing in our people?

I'll rephrase what I said: Jubilee is not out here making sure everyone is being productive, i.e. earning and generating revenue for the government.

Now, infrastructure: That's exactly the complaint! The right infrastructure has not been invested in! The kind that would allow profitable farming and take care of our food problems. Indeed, generating a food surplus that we would then seek foreign markets for, not to mention it'll take care of the vast majority of the population. It makes no sense to say you can ignore that in favor of 'someday in the future, these projects we can't even finish because of our mindless borrowing will yield some benefit'. You service them with suitable loans at a suitable pace. You don't get a loan shark who wants his money after 3 months in order to lay the foundation for a house that will start yielding rent in 2023. Because what will happen is the house will never get finished and you will become destitute in the meanwhile, just servicing loans you can't afford and not developing an inch forward. You'll be trapped in a rat race. That's what Jubilee has done to us. You're all about investing in infrastructure: but the problem is Jubilee has ruined out ability to do just that--so much for your demographic opportunity; so how are they in line with your desires?

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #49 on: November 20, 2019, 05:54:11 PM »
In short Kadame and Socrates you cannot have the cake. Economic development has evolved since Adam Smith. Ndii has in fact urged to wean off the sugarcane and maize addiction. The GoK wonks or mandarins can only lay the big picture. Even BBI or political reforms can only do so much. Accountability is not all about sleaze; it is debating the best strategy, policy or investment. But the tire must meet the road after the roads, rail, last-miles or subways. Businesses, enterprising Kenyans and investors must ultimately hit the road hard. The private sector is almost always behind the rise of the Tigers and such success stories.

Demographic dividend is all about MANPOWER. Short of civil war the population trend bumbleheads are calling cooked is a strong signal. Other than UhuruCare, education and TIVET - I see few better strategies to tap it than infrastructure.

You can always share what artfuls you have in mind? Reform the decision making; restructure the debt;  nip instability in the bud; recalibrate. DO SOMETHING. Intransigence or plain cynicism is not a solution. That's Ndiism. :)
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Dear Mami

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #50 on: November 20, 2019, 06:17:15 PM »
In short Kadame and Socrates you cannot have the cake. Economic development has evolved since Adam Smith. Ndii has in fact urged to wean off the sugarcane and maize addiction. The GoK wonks or mandarins can only lay the big picture. Even BBI or political reforms can only do so much. Accountability is not all about sleaze; it is debating the best strategy, policy or investment. But the tire must meet the road after the roads, rail, last-miles or subways. Businesses, enterprising Kenyans and investors must ultimately hit the road hard. The private sector is almost always behind the rise of the Tigers and such success stories.

Demographic dividend is all about MANPOWER. Short of civil war the population trend bumbleheads are calling cooked is a strong signal. Other than UhuruCare, education and TIVET - I see few better strategies to tap it than infrastructure.

You can always share what artfuls you have in mind? Reform the decision making; restructure the debt;  nip instability in the bud; DO SOMETHING. Intransigence is not a solution.
Lol. Now you sound like those terrified Kenyans who are busy asking Ndii, "So what can we do now?" Well, it's kind of late: even change in leadership won't resolve this quagmire. Raila won't resolve it, Ndii won't resolve it, certainly not Ruto or Kamwana, unless they adopt the Saudi solution. No one has a magic solution. Besides, I gave mine and you called it negative and alarmist  :D: Ruthlessness; MAKE looters pay, the law not withstanding. We can get back to rule of law when we are past the downward spiral. :D

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #51 on: November 20, 2019, 06:23:29 PM »
Lol. Now you sound like those terrified Kenyans who are busy asking Ndii, "So what can we do now?" Well, it's kind of late: even change in leadership won't resolve this quagmire. Raila won't resolve it, Ndii won't resolve it, certainly not Ruto or Kamwana, unless they adopt the Saudi solution. No one has a magic solution. Besides, I gave mine and you called it negative and alarmist  :D: Ruthlessness; MAKE looters pay, the law not withstanding. We can get back to rule of law when we are past the downward spiral. :D

Yes I call it Ndiism. I am sure you mean reforms not revolution. That is the fairytale that rarely works.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Dear Mami

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #52 on: November 20, 2019, 06:26:23 PM »
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Yes I call it Ndiism. I am sure you mean reforms not revolution. That is the fairytale that rarely works.

Revolution, lmao. Read what I write: no need to invent stuff. Anyone can be the ruthless Saudi Prince we need, even Ruto and dear old Kamwana. Getting frustrated with me won't change the facts, btw.

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #53 on: November 20, 2019, 06:28:23 PM »
Kadame if you were keen you would see Raila has not abandoned the reform path. Not even the strategy to Canaan. He has merely changed tact - with a small sacrifice - to achieve accountability, inclusion, stability and a better future. BBI and Handshake is smarter than NRM and maandamano.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #54 on: November 20, 2019, 06:33:32 PM »
Quote
Yes I call it Ndiism. I am sure you mean reforms not revolution. That is the fairytale that rarely works.

Revolution, lmao. Read what I write: no need to invent stuff. Anyone can be the ruthless Saudi Prince we need, even Ruto and dear old Kamwana. Getting frustrated with me won't change the facts, btw.

I am not frustrated with you. MBS is hardly a role-model. I would settle for Kagame or Zenawi. Pundit cloaks Ruto as such a benevolent dictator. I wonder why you oppose him in vehemence.

Anyway a benevolent dictator is pure hope - just rolling the dice. You could easily land an Idi Amin.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #55 on: November 20, 2019, 06:40:47 PM »
Kadame for argument sake: what do you think is the cause of Kenya's present situation? Incompetence, ill-will or circumstance?
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline Dear Mami

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #56 on: November 20, 2019, 07:17:30 PM »
Kadame if you were keen you would see Raila has not abandoned the reform path. Not even the strategy to Canaan. He has merely changed tact - with a small sacrifice - to achieve accountability, inclusion, stability and a better future. BBI and Handshake is smarter than NRM and maandamano.

My opinions on this have nothing to do with Raila, handshake, or BBI. I am pro-BBI. I am just aware it will resolve a different issue than this one Jubilee created with the economy.

I am also not interested in a benevolent dictator: I am just aware the only options we have are to return some of the loot, at least 1 trillion or 2. We can't do that legally because even though we know who has it, they are very 'clean', wamejisafisha. So we are btw a rock and a hard place and I'm willing, for the sake of our 48 million to have a temporary mfinyo for economic rather than political 'dissidents'. Anyway, I'm not president, of course: if I were, that is exactly what I would do; I'd force the thugs to cough up some of that loot in exchange for their freedom. Then we can invest it in areas that can give us repreave while we find our way to 'comfortable' payments. Anyway, I'm sure if the govt really wanted, they would/could find very creative ways to 'finya' that are not blatantly illegal. Mine is an expression of frustration with the recklessness than anything.

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #57 on: November 20, 2019, 10:46:14 PM »
My opinions on this have nothing to do with Raila, handshake, or BBI. I am pro-BBI. I am just aware it will resolve a different issue than this one Jubilee created with the economy.

I am also not interested in a benevolent dictator: I am just aware the only options we have are to return some of the loot, at least 1 trillion or 2. We can't do that legally because even though we know who has it, they are very 'clean', wamejisafisha. So we are btw a rock and a hard place and I'm willing, for the sake of our 48 million to have a temporary mfinyo for economic rather than political 'dissidents'. Anyway, I'm not president, of course: if I were, that is exactly what I would do; I'd force the thugs to cough up some of that loot in exchange for their freedom. Then we can invest it in areas that can give us repreave while we find our way to 'comfortable' payments. Anyway, I'm sure if the govt really wanted, they would/could find very creative ways to 'finya' that are not blatantly illegal. Mine is an expression of frustration with the recklessness than anything.

Pro-BBI shows your cynicism is mostly economic. Yet the economy and politics are directly related. The recklessness and theft are driven by lack of openness and accountability. BBI is supposed to address these and the bigger socioeconomic factors of inequity, exclusion and instability. The chronic electoral disruption.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527

Offline RV Pundit

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #58 on: November 21, 2019, 08:08:20 AM »
Yes kagame or Meles we need is the one to reform public service.Once public sector start delivering like Chinese contractors we will fix a lot.A gov full of Ruto,Muchuki,Matiangi,Magoha,Nyachae, I mean such kind of strong personalities would deliver.As long as they don't stray into Magufulism. Private sector and individuals should do their part without blaming the gov for everything
« Last Edit: November 21, 2019, 03:32:46 PM by RV Pundit »

Offline Nefertiti

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Re: Treasury in a desperate move raids parastatals
« Reply #59 on: November 21, 2019, 01:01:28 PM »
Yes kagame or Meles we need is the one to reform public service.Once public sector start delivering like Chinese contractors we will fix a lot.A gov full of Ruto,Muchuki,Matiangi,Magoha,Nyachae, I mean such kind of strong personalities would deliver.As long as they don't stray into Magufulism. Private sector and individuals should do their part without blaming the gov for everyone.

This is the heart of the matter.
I desire to go to hell and not to heaven. In the former place I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings, and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks, and apostles. ~ Niccolo Machiavelli on his deathbed, June 1527