Nipate
Forum => Kenya Discussion => Topic started by: Real P on February 22, 2015, 08:29:52 AM
-
The State of Michigan is ordering a Detroit man to pay tens of thousands of dollars, or go to prison. The reason? He owes back child support for a child that everyone agrees is not his.
"I feel like I’m standing in front of a brick wall with nowhere to go," said Carnell Alexander.
He says he learned about the paternity case against him during a traffic stop in Detroit in the early 90s. The officer told him he is a deadbeat dad, there was a warrant out for his arrest.
The state said he fathered a child in 1987, and ignored a court order to pay up. It was the first Carnell had heard of the court order. He'd never even met the child.
It also was not easy to get a DNA test. Alexander didn't know where the woman was that had claimed he fathered a child. He only had an 8th-grade education, off-and-on employment at the time, and no money to hire help.
He asked the court for help, but the court couldn't help him in the way he was asking. Friend of the Court employees are not allowed to give legal advice.
Eventually he, by chance, ran into someone he knew would know where the woman was, and got a DNA test. It proved what he had been saying all along: the child he had never met was not his.
The mother had realized that, and the real father was in the child's life. Alexander took this information to court. The judge was unmoved.
“Case closed. I gotta pay for the baby,” said Alexander.
The court focused on a summons tied to the paternity case in the late 1980's. The state sent a process server to Alexander’s dad’s house in Highland Park to let him know about the paternity case. The process server turned a document into the court saying Alexander was delivered the summons, but he refused to sign the summons.
"I wasn’t there. I couldn’t refuse to sign," said Alexander.
7 Action News checked his story with the Michigan Department of Corrections. Their records confirm Alexander's story - he did not receive that order at a home in Highland Park. He was in prison for a crime he committed as a young man.
So why was there a case at all?
Carnell's ex had a baby, and didn't know who the father was. She was struggling to care for the child. When she applied for state assistance, the case worker told her she had to name the father.
"That was the only way I could get assistance," she told 7 Action News.
She said she didn't realize the state would go after the father to pay the support given to the child.
“Everything is my fault, that I put him through,” she said.
She asked the court to forgive his debt. They forgave the portion of child support allocated for her, but not the other half. Alexander still owes about $30,000 to the state.
He has refused to pay, and now is being threatened with legal consequences.
7 Action News spoke to workers at Friend of the Court. They could not talk about Alexander's case specifically. They say many people don't understand how to handle their cases, because it is a court. They recommend people promptly address issues in their cases with the help of an attorney.
Alexander says at one point he did hire an attorney, but it did not help him. Taking a look at his case, one attorney says it appears no motion was ever filed to declare that the summons that was not delivered to him is null and void. Alexander could try that.
“We know this is not my child so let’s do what we need to do, what’s right,” said Alexander.
http://www.wxyz.com/news/region/detroit/detroit-man-fights-30k-child-support-bill-for-kid-that-is-not-his
Eventually he, by chance, ran into someone he knew would know where the woman was, and got a DNA test. It proved what he had been saying all along: the child he had never met was not his.
The mother had realized that, and the real father was in the child's life. Alexander took this information to court. The judge was unmoved.
Apparently the judge is not professional and should be removed from office. He's not the father, verifiable by a DNA test.
-
This is what the media says. There looks to be crucial details missing. The next step , he needs to sue the woman for those charges. I've heard here in the states, it's a common practice for ladies to get pregnant and claim the father is someone else, so they can cheat the system for more money. This guy needs to sue her and not blame the courts. In his favor means it'll be stricter for single mothers to claim handouts. Better he sue her rather than making it mandatory for mothers to take DNA tests, or something of that effect. The judge has a bigger responsibility in preserving the autonomy of struggling mothers.
-
This is what the media says. There looks to be crucial details missing. The next step , he needs to sue the woman for those charges. I've heard here in the states, it's a common practice for ladies to get pregnant and claim the father is someone else, so they can cheat the system for more money. This guy needs to sue her and not blame the courts. In his favor means it'll be stricter for single mothers to claim handouts. Better he sue her rather than making it mandatory for mothers to take DNA tests, or something of that effect. The judge has a bigger responsibility in preserving the autonomy of struggling mothers.
Agreed. Seems deceitful on her part and careless on the part of the state for not actually checking if he was the father.
-
"Father" isn't just defined biologically like they do in science.
She obviously needed to survive. People struggle. I bet my money he was on this too, and even the authorities knew. A pity they got caught.
People "cheat" the system all the time and the authorities do it too because they are part of that system too. It's how we coexist-individual lives deteriorating i.e. ailing health able working bodies reckoning with a forever demanding, perfecting system.
There isn't a moral compass in the system. The system isn't a sentient entity. I noticed what makes America so great and a global power is the fact her moral compass is still among the populace and greater than the system. I don't think any system as of yet could break the extraordinary spirit they have on these shores-present and bygone, but mostly bygone. Some may call it corruption, but I've witnessed more humanity than the prior.
-
"Father" isn't just defined biologically like they do in science.
She obviously needed to survive. People struggle. I bet my money he was on this too, and even the authorities knew. A pity they got caught.
People "cheat" the system all the time and the authorities do it too because they are part of that system too. It's how we coexist-individual lives deteriorating i.e. ailing health able working bodies reckoning with a forever demanding, perfecting system.
There isn't a moral compass in the system. The system isn't a sentient entity. I noticed what makes America so great and a global power is the fact her moral compass is still among the populace and greater than the system. I don't think any system as of yet could break the extraordinary spirit they have on these shores-present and bygone, but mostly bygone. Some may call it corruption, but I've witnessed more humanity than the prior.
I also think he was probably on this too. Some people need to be forcefully sterilized, because the more babies they have the more welfare "perks" they receive. On a different note, why does the state require the name for assistance anyways? Especially one that's possibly wrong? The whole thing sounds preposterous.
-
They should require a name. Put a face to deadbeat dad-data collection, resource allocation etc.
-
They should require a name. Put a face to deadbeat dad-data collection, resource allocation etc.
Interesting take.
After doing some research on the internet I found out that the Michigan Child support law was drafted in 1956. I doubt there were female lawmakers in the legislature in Michigan in 1956. He can't blame the women, but the Government Bureaucracy although it sounds unfair for what he was being subjected to. Men should have paternity confirmed at birth with no exceptions if they suspect something. Better to find out early than to have insult added to injury.
-
I have no remorse for this bloke. To speed things up, the next step is to sue the woman. The law stands for both. She can file for court office negligence or some technical pardon from the courts. Full circle the state is responsible for negligence. Case dropped. The courts are likely to favour a technical pardon etc. she can plea financial burden/trauma because of an officer's negligence etc. it'll work better rather than a former prisoner denying responsibility. Logic.
-
I have no remorse for this bloke. To speed things up, the next step is to sue the woman. The law stands for both. She can file for court office negligence or some technical pardon from the courts. Full circle the state is responsible for negligence. Case dropped. The courts are likely to favour a technical pardon etc. she can plea financial burden/trauma because of an officer's negligence etc. it'll work better rather than a former prisoner denying responsibility. Logic.
The fact that Child Support is tied to State income it's going to make it hard to for him to sue the woman.
-
No it's not.
-
Read this article "when your daddy is not your daddy"
https://verdict.justia.com/2012/10/16/when-your-daddy-is-not-really-your-daddy
(https://verdict.justia.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/shutterstock_93323158.jpg)
-
I have no remorse for this bloke. To speed things up, the next step is to sue the woman. The law stands for both. She can file for court office negligence or some technical pardon from the courts. Full circle the state is responsible for negligence. Case dropped. The courts are likely to favour a technical pardon etc. she can plea financial burden/trauma because of an officer's negligence etc. it'll work better rather than a former prisoner denying responsibility. Logic.
Sue the woman for what? The woman would still be entitled to the support even if this mans name wasn’t listed as the father, it could have been anyone else or better yet the original dead beat dad. Obviously the woman was desperate for help, and before you lambast here for asking for child support, I would say try walking in her shoes for a day to know her plight……don’t be presumptuous about things like these. That being said, the woman did try to correct the mistake but a court system which is unfriendly to black men would not listen. Actually they should have asked for DNA to prove paternity. Had this man had money, he would not have been going through all this trouble.
-
Agreed. From the article, she never even went after the man for child support. She went to the state and as a pre-condition for getting help, she was asked to provide details of who the father was. She gave them his name because she thought he was the dad, had no idea the state would be going after him thereafter. She got the help from the state and moved on, forgot about the whole thing. Until the man tracked her down much later for a DNA test.
If the man was having sex with her around the time she conceived, she would have good reason to think he was the dad. We don't know the exact circumstances. Maybe she cheated on him (with the real dad) once and assumed that the latter could not have been the dad. Some people can be rather daft, you know. Something else may have later convinced her he wasn't. Maybe the baby looks very much like her real dad as she grows up, who knows? Or maybe the real dad showed up later and took a DNA test. Either way, I don't know how he can sue her for guessing him as the likely father in a situation where she couldn't access his DNA in order to confirm. He had been sleeping with her, after all. If they were never together, then that would be some kind of fraud and probably very serious.
-
Agreed. From the article, she never even went after the man for child support. She went to the state and as a pre-condition for getting the help, she was asked to provide details of who the father was. She gave them his name because she thought he was the dad, had no idea the state would be going after him thereafter. She got the help from the state and moved on,forgot about the whole thing. Until the man tracked her down for a DNA test.
If the man was having sex with her around the time she conceived, she would have good reason to think he was the dad. Something else may have later convinced her he wasn't. Maybe the baby looks very much like her real dad as she grows up, who knows? Or maybe the real dad showed up later and took a DNA test. Either way, I don't know how he can sue her for guessing him as the likely father in a situation where she couldn't access his DNA in order to confirm. He had been sleeping with her, after all. If they were never together, then that would be some kind of fraud and probably very serious.
The assumption is that she probably knew this man, was either going out with him, or was in otherwise close proximity with him to know such personal details like date of birth and social security numbers that she would provide to the state. Whatever the case, the state failed this man and they should do everything to clear his name...even compensate him for mental distress.
-
I have no remorse for this bloke. To speed things up, the next step is to sue the woman. The law stands for both. She can file for court office negligence or some technical pardon from the courts. Full circle the state is responsible for negligence. Case dropped. The courts are likely to favour a technical pardon etc. she can plea financial burden/trauma because of an officer's negligence etc. it'll work better rather than a former prisoner denying responsibility. Logic.
Sue the woman for what? The woman would still be entitled to the support even if this mans name wasn’t listed as the father, it could have been anyone else or better yet the original dead beat dad. Obviously the woman was desperate for help, and before you lambast here for asking for child support, I would say try walking in her shoes for a day to know her plight……don’t be presumptuous about things like these. That being said, the woman did try to correct the mistake but a court system which is hostile to black men would not listen. Actually they should have asked for DNA to prove paternity. Had this man had money, he would not have been going through all this trouble.
-
I have no remorse for this bloke. To speed things up, the next step is to sue the woman. The law stands for both. She can file for court office negligence or some technical pardon from the courts. Full circle the state is responsible for negligence. Case dropped. The courts are likely to favour a technical pardon etc. she can plea financial burden/trauma because of an officer's negligence etc. it'll work better rather than a former prisoner denying responsibility. Logic.
Sue the woman for what? The woman would still be entitled to the support even if this mans name wasn’t listed as the father, it could have been anyone else or better yet the original dead beat dad. Obviously the woman was desperate for help, and before you lambast here for asking for child support, I would say try walking in her shoes for a day to know her plight……don’t be presumptuous about things like these. That being said, the woman did try to correct the mistake but a court system which is hostile to black men would not listen. Actually they should have asked for DNA to prove paternity. Had this man had money, he would not have been going through all this trouble.
Mya, the story says eventually the man ran into someone he knew that would know where the woman was, and got a DNA test. Test proved what he had been saying all along: the child he had never met was not his. The mother had realized that, and the real father was in the child's life. He took this information to court. The judge was unmoved. According to Michigan law, if you spend a month or something with a child that is not yours after it is born, you have to pay child support for the rest of 18 years or something because you have "cared for it or something.
-
RP
That is why I am saying he cannot sue the woman for anything. I haven’t read the complete Michigan law, but I am sure there is a clause somewhere that could have exempted him from liability had he realized his name is in the system and acted earlier on. Of course he would have needed money to wiggle through the legal wrangle. That is really an absurd law, I will have to look at it. Its like in other states where if you have lived with a woman in your house for 6 months and you fight, you cannot kick her out…matter of fact if there is some domestic dispute, she can have you kicked out of your own home….common law BS.
-
She isn't innocent. He didn't even know who the woman was.. apparently. My guess is she sought the help of someone who knew the chap was in prison and used his name. Fraud.
-
In the league of baffling, this is a walk in the park. Few things can top scenarios where clearly innocent or mentally challenged people have been put to sleep because some crude system has to be adhered to.
-
The guy can sue the state and the woman for damages, thats the only way he can get out of it.